What is being tested at China Lake, Calif, to cause this notice?

a reply to: BASSPLYR

I fear no man, so you can tell me privately and I will make it public if you wish

originally posted by: AmericanRealist
a reply to: BASSPLYR

I fear no man, so you can tell me privately and I will make it public if you wish

Ones interesting and one I think I informally agreed to not talk about. The other is less conspiracy theorists and would probably be a let down of "oh....thats all?"

a reply to: BASSPLYR

I am just saying dont be surprised to find out soon after that there were nearby "training exercises/drills" . Or in plain English, covert operations against citizens on American soil. Propaganda baby, Obama makes sure we get it good after he signed the laws allowing it.

a reply to: desert

Its what you call the military finally decided to take a possible EMP threat seriously.


Definitely not the brightest folks in seats of power nowadays---all that imbreeding and inheritance affluent disorder the cnts have

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: desert

Yes. The signal is only affecting airborne GPS units. It won't affect ground based units.

hey zap......the key word here is "satellite" in GPS....how would that signal be blocked only down to 50 feet? pardon my last century electronics knowledge, but, isn't the "GPS signal" creating "noise" in the air between the satellite and land?

originally posted by: AmericanRealist
a reply to: BASSPLYR

I fear no man, so you can tell me privately and I will make it public if you wish

I bet if ya saw a seraphim youd have plenty of fear----I love the john wayne thugnation so prevalent worldwide. But then again Seraphim aren't men so I stand corrected.

a reply to: jimmyx

That would be part of the "we could tell you, but then we'd have to kill you aspect.

Some of the satellites are being hit at oblique angles. If the jammer is looking straight up, a signal at a flatter angle would get through.

You do realise blocking gps signals is common practice during military exercises to test ground troops ability to function and use equipment without it? doesn't mean conspiracy. This often causes issues for hill walkers and rock climbers in Brecon, Wales who rely on GPS navigation because it's a national park and a military training area.

example in the UK

This could even be to test new measures and technologies that combat signal jamming. North Korea for instance uses GPS interference as a weapon regularly.

It's not going to affect TV, radar, heat seekers Internal and laser guidance weapons, so must be for something else.

originally posted by: jimmyx

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: desert

Yes. The signal is only affecting airborne GPS units. It won't affect ground based units.

hey zap......the key word here is "satellite" in GPS....how would that signal be blocked only down to 50 feet? pardon my last century electronics knowledge, but, isn't the "GPS signal" creating "noise" in the air between the satellite and land?

They are interfering with with the receiver they way jmom works isn't the way you think. A receiver say like GPS runs on a frequency. If we bombard it with a frequency that's close it makes it very difficult to get its signal. Ever have a radio pick up two stations at once? What you hear is the radio jumping back and forth and what you hear is garbage.

With the hight restrictions tells us something about the location. The testing is probably in a valley and that means nothing under 50 ft will get the signal is my guess. So the further you are away the higher you can use your GPS.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: Nochzwei

The Phenom users the Garmin GR77 Attitude and Heading Reference System. It takes input from GPS,the air data computer, and magnetometers to read the attitude of the aircraft.

Um...just how badly does a Phenom go out of control if it loses GPS input? (rubs hands together gleefully)

originally posted by: dragonridr
With the hight restrictions tells us something about the location. The testing is probably in a valley and that means nothing under 50 ft will get the signal is my guess. So the further you are away the higher you can use your GPS.

Or the emitter has a sort of conical emission pattern and it's pointed upward from the ground.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

Double thanks! I'm working on it.
I'll be back for another reply after I get the chance to wade through it.

a reply to: Bedlam

According to Embraer they don't, but then they're not going to come out and say different.

a reply to: desert

- It is easy to create error in GPS accuracy to protect our cities
- GPS can and probably will be disabled in time of conflict
- Must test new systems that navigate using non Satellite and non GPS signals like STELLAR Navigation, which has been around for centuries.
- Enemies will most likely continue to rely on technology PERCEIVED to be advanced like GPS

We Win!

originally posted by: Quantum12
a reply to: desert

Why can't they test their expensive toys over the ocean on ships and not effect air travel?

We need Zaph to chime in here.

You do realize aircraft fly over the ocean too?

originally posted by: amoodyk9
a reply to: desert

- It is easy to create error in GPS accuracy to protect our cities
- GPS can and probably will be disabled in time of conflict
- Must test new systems that navigate using non Satellite and non GPS signals like STELLAR Navigation, which has been around for centuries.
- Enemies will most likely continue to rely on technology PERCEIVED to be advanced like GPS

We Win!

Yeh right.
Because your enemies are as simple as your thoughts on those matters lol.
Whatever you've thought of, your government, and potential enemy governments, have already thought way ahead of.
Don't stress your self out over nothing.

So gps signals are microwaves right. And they are beamed from satellites right? Satellites that have to beam the signal through the lower band of the ionosphere correct? Good thing we have a way to corrupt that signal and render enemy satellites of all sorts (comms. Targeting. Data Clouds. Control, surveillance etc) useless at our whim.

But baa-aassss (whiny voice) what if they fly the equivalent of whats on those satellites below the ionosphere in some lta vehicle or aircraft of some sort to try and go around that, what will we do then......


Dear santa,

Could you make us an aircraft that does the same signal denial to the enemy and fly it around to where we want it, and make it deny all enemy communications, targeting systems, reconnaissance, survailance and data transmissions. You know so they can't do F all? Oooh and make it so we still can. Oh, oh and also can you make it so we can spoof, hack and do mean things to their systems? While simultaneously providing electronic attack on ground targets. But wait I want more. Can you also make it so it can command, control, coordinate, do vast data and sensor fusion in a cloud and do it for all of our vast plethora of drones and other assorted military assets in a battlespace including the soldiers on the ground? Oh and one last thing can you make it stealthy too, like really stealthy. thanks that would be awesome.

Thanks in advance,

Bassplyr



Lights out china. You too russia. Cheers to half a century of punking your sorry asses

originally posted by: Bedlam

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: desert

The Phenom is the only aircraft that has a stability system that relies on GPS to keep the aircraft stable. If they lose the GPS signal the stability system fails and they can lose control.

That seems like the sort of thing a first year engineer would design.

Sort of inconvenient behavior.

I fly a Phenom from time to time, A loss of control is pretty unlikely. All you have to do is switch to heading mode and use an alternative navaid like VOR, ADF, Loran (unlikely) or GNS, and get out of RVSM airspace. Oh yeah, and turn of all the flashing lights on the annunciator panel for GPS HSI (1 and 2); AHRS System fault (1 and 2); SWPS fauly; yaw damper warning, ventral rudder warning. You may get a little bit of dutch rolling but the airplane isn't going to suddenly go beserk.

a reply to: desert

GPS would be most inaccurate in this area for two reasons, state plane coordinate systems make distortion here profound due to the state's size. Although this does not affect unprojected data most data is used in conjunction with a coordinate system so perhaps they are calibrating the satellites? The problem here would be mean root square error (x,y axis)

Another major anomaly (largest in the world) is the Yellowstone region which is contiguous with the test area and due to it being a huge bulge and the gps algorithm being based on an idealized sphere, not an irregular geoid the gps here could be problematic when projected. The problem would be height from center of sphere (z axis).

My guess is they are trying to improve GPS accuracy positioning over this area for the purpose of missiles tracking over terrain masking to converge on China, so it is a military mapping project for missile positioning that is possible in this instance.

The purpose may, as well, be; to make synthetic digital terrains that are more accurate when used with gps in conjunction with a missile digital map in memory.

Or to improve the performance of satellite and radar control of the missiles, by sattelite read gps and messaging and/or tracking control.