why is there something so " off " about christianity

a reply to: freedom7

Here is my take on it, the bible keep's changing as if there is some hidden war which is why when you first read it the book showed you a loving fatherly god but now it show's an angry even hateful and worse indifferent god, it is not the same god.

So do you remember the sky being blue, do you remember when the first time you read a passage saying "GIve the immoral brother to Satan" and you said WTF that never used to be there or do you remember passages you can not now find as if somehow the bible is being altered or perhaps it is reality and something very nasty is intent on alienating you to your god and making him out to be a horrible old man.

I actually have experienced this and wait faithfully as I believe it shall be put right, if it is not then if I can fight in the spirit to do so then that is my intent.

Our God is real, he is Our father but he has enemy's and they seek to enslave or corrupt us and take us away from him and him away from us, remember the Jesus you knew, he is the real one whom is still there and still loves you but also remember he said that we were in a war with the powers and principality's of heaven and the earth, the rulers in dark (hidden) places, you can bet that meant he was alone on our side against all of them but of course he does have his own angels and probably many other world's to deal with so he also said "I shall come as a thief in the night to steal back what has been stolen from me" and also that they should not know the time of his return.

I am not lying to boost you though I may be a little crazy but I did read a different bible and he was a far nicer person than this one, for me the change seemed to happen about the early 90's and included passaged from the revelation vanishing and other's in the old testament as well as the aformentions inclusion of the passage about giving the immoral brother to Satan.

For me Christ has Paid the debt for us all but there are powers that are refusing to accept that and indeed do not realise just whom he really is.

a reply to: freedom7

But then belief is not just enough just a few books later and we will hear that if one isn't truly repentant and carries any of the sins of lying , sexual immorality , cowardliness , etc .. their portion will be in the lake of fire .
But this lake of fire wasn't talked about in the old testament ( at least not in those terms , not even close ) ....

So do you see my point .. even the most sincere genuine christians out there if they are honest and real enough will admit that either the bible is LITTERED with contradictions OR it is has been altered throughout history , mistranslated deliberately or purposefully .

You have overlooked something that most Christians have overlooked (including myself), and I am just learning. Adam was created Trichotomous, having Body, Soul, and Spirit. Therefore, Salvation must be Trichotomous as well:

1). When we believe that Jesus paid for our sins, our dead spirit is Born Again. This is salvation for the Spirit.
2). All believers are promised a resurrection. This is salvation of the Body.

So, what's missing???

3). Once we have believed, we must continue in faith to keep the Robes of our Souls clean with the Water of the Word of God. We must confess our sins via 1John 1:9 to the Heavenly Father when needed, and Abide in Christ. If we fail to do this, the believer will spend eternity, locked out of the satellite city of New Jerusalem, and will instead have a place in the Outer Darkness, where there is weeping and gnashing of teeth. This is not the same as the Lake of Fire, but it is the closest thing to death for the believer.

This is why the bible SEEMS to contradict when it comes to the topic of salvation...because salvation is threefold.

This verse in 2nd Timothy ties it all together.

2nd Timothy 2:11Here is a trustworthy saying: If we died with him, we will also live with him; 12if we endure, we will also reign with him. If we disown him, he will also disown us; 13if we are faithless, he remains faithful, for he cannot disown himself.
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Here is a good scripture filled article on the subject.Trichodomous Salvation.

edit on 17-2-2016 by BELIEVERpriest because: added link

When I began questioning my faith in a God, I thought I would be living on this earth lost and without a purpose. Three years later, I am better without religion than I ever was with it. I always lived in fear as a child and up to a few years ago of doing something that might not have appeased God and if you ask me, I think that's a whole lot worse than being a non believer. If you decide that religion isn't your thing, it's not the end of the world. And if you decide to stay religious, just go about it the way that YOU think is right.

a reply to: freedom7

Religion is all about Faith and possibly control of the masses. Do your research, read the bible and maybe a few other books from some other religions learn and you will develope your own beliefs and faith.

The Bible has been Altered throughout history, Edited, added to primarily by the Roman Catholic church, Littered with contradictions, mistranslated.

The problem with the Protestant Churches is in the fact that they are following the traditions and edicts laid down by the Catholic Church they are supposedly protesting from and every single one cherry picks through the bible saying this we must do but this is covered by the blood.

The Whore of Revelations (The Catholic Church?)

Pope Gregory The First around 600 A.D., specifically instructed Augustine, the Archbishop of Canterbury, to adapt existing local religious (pagan or otherwise) customs and practices to Christian usage in order to help propagate the faith. Many roman holidays and celebrations were adopted by the Roman Catholic church.

Rev 17:4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet color, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication

Rev 17:7 I will tell thee the mystery of the woman, and of the beast that carrieth her, which hath the seven heads and ten horns.

Rev 17:9 The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth. (Rome is known as the city of seven hills.)

Rev 17:15 The waters which thou sawest, where the whore sitteth, are peoples, and multitudes, and nations, and tongues. (The Roman Catholic Church is made up of possibly the most diverse range of nationalities of any church in the world.)



“It is well to remind the Presbyterians, Baptists, Methodists, and all other Christians, that the Bible does not support them anywhere in their observance of Sunday. Sunday is an institution of the Roman Catholic Church, and those who observe the day observe a commandment of the Catholic Church.” Priest Brady, in an address reported in The News, Elizabeth, New Jersey, March 18, 1903.

“They [the Protestants] deem it their duty to keep the Sunday holy. Why? Because the Catholic Church tells them to do so. They have no other reason...The observance of Sunday thus comes to be an ecclesiastical law entirely distinct from the divine law of Sabbath observance...The author of the Sunday law...is the Catholic Church.” Ecclesiastical Review, February 1914.

Sun worship persisted in Europe even after the introduction of Christianity, as is evidenced by its disguised survival in such traditional Christian practices as the Easter bonfire the coloring of eggs, the Easter Bunny and the Yule log setting up and decorating the tree for Christmas.

a reply to: freedom7

I wish you the very best in your journey to reclaim your mind from the control system devised by the Roman Empire to pacify rebellious Jews around 2000 years ago.

That's all it ever was.

That this system spiraled out of control and wiped the world clean of most indigenous peoples, or at least their culture; that this system held the world in the dark ages for 1000 years; that this system programs existential fear into the minds of children..these horrors are the great mistake;
A control system masquerading as a genuine religion.

Now I know some Christians learn love and kindness..but its in spite of the deception not because of it.

I know it's hard to give up rat poison that you became addicted to. It takes years to cleanse the violence done to you.

Be strong.

Just a cursory examination of science and church history can be very healing and revealing.

I'm not saying it's wrong to believe in God.

Threes nothing wrong with wanting to have fellowship and togetherness and wishing to serve a cause greater than yourself.

There is nothing wrong with being inspired by a truly loving and wise teacher.

But examine the fruit of any organization first.

If it's a murderous death cult from the very beginning; if none of it's main figures ever lived, or were in fact radically different than recorded in history; if it put girls as young as 13 on the rack to be tortured to death...if the rich could buy forgiveness in unlimited quantity (indulgences)..these aren't even 10% of the crimes committed.

Is this sort of organization an outpouring of divine love?

That's for you to decide.

Kev

originally posted by: Justso
a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed Believers, etc. always point to faith-never answers because only god knows. You have not answered his questions because your god doesn't give answers. You are too afraid to confront your religious beliefs and think for yourself. Bravo to the brave who are not afraid to think and question without fear.

How would you know any answers if you don't even have any faith yourself? This is why YOU have no answers because you believe there are none.
You won't get any answers yourself if you have no spiritual honesty, no humble heart, and nothing else of a higher calling unto yourself to draw from.
When you do, then come and try speaking again about spiritual matters.

By the way, my earlier response to the OP was to point to matters of trust. We spend our lives by experience learning to trust. That is what a relationship with God is about. Learning to trust.

And somehow you think you know what I think and do? If I didn't answer any of the OP's questions let him reply and tell me so and I will answer him if I can. I am also never afraid to ask God questions about anything, and have done so uncountable times, and I have always had those questions answered in time. That is what it means to actually know God by faith, because after a little faith comes in your face truth direct from the almighty himself. You think God is always silent? That is only belief of an unbeliever. It isn't simply a relationship on faith alone. That is only in the beginning. But I wouldn't expect a disbeliever to understand what to them is just a fantasy, and to them, maybe that is all it will ever be, sad and untrue though it is.

The bible has a constant theme of hatred for humankind from someone, or some group, that has tried to control God, the most powerful force in existence, using technology. The bible is a living, breathing word that can manifest in the flesh because of belief. The proof of that is the extremely powerful impact of it, meaning the bible, that has changed over the years in the interpretation of it, which changes the written words in it which is then presented as THE Bible, as seen historically and modernly, with proving to be powerful by the numerous Christian denominations who have members numbered in the thousands to millions, who believe the interpretation to be true. Key word is belief. With belief manifesting flesh. And with an extremely powerful force such as this, having started with it's original binding as a book/scroll/tablet being THE word, it unleashed itself. How did it do that? With belief.

In realizing that, one needs to take care in how they interpret the many, many times interpreted bible they read and know that the reader's best interest was not in mind due to belief being such a powerful force. This is present in your case here as it is designed in a way to replace belief with doubt and feeding the reader's feeling of rejection and guilt and thinking they are really not accepted and loved by Christ Jesus. Which that is untrue, because Christ Jesus does love you as you know by feeling it in you and seeing it. This is why many call Him their personal friend and savior because what He speaks inside us and shows us, it is always in love and gentleness, the opposite of what the bible speaks of. This is why you grow your belief on the inside of yourself with verses from the bible the Holy Spirit leads you to in it, which is pure - purified. And it is all good, being pure. Then you absorb that within you, in your flesh. Then you stop there with reading no more of the other because you are forgiven and saved. After building your confidence again and believing in the love of Christ Jesus is all that there is, you should be able to read the bible without it hurting your belief. Unfortunately though, that can lead to focusing back on scripture that is negative to feed a need of yours for feeling satisfief that someone who was unkind to you or harmed you, will get their punnishment. Those negative verses that satisfied you in a worldly way eventually come back to haunt you, then your back to where you started. These are not of turning the other cheek or of the meek or of loving your neighbor.

Always remember Christ Jesus did not write the bible. The bible writes about Him and is powerful in all its changed interpretations, so powerful that the bible in its content acts as if its more powerful than Christ Jesus as seen by Christians who put the bible first before Christ Jesus. And they did that too with placing the Old Testament with the New Testament in binding. It can be a trap if you don't recognize that. Have the New Testament in a single bound book on hand. Better yet, find your favorite books in the New Testament that speaks to your heart as it tells of the story of Christ Jesus and the things He said.

If all else fails, remember Christ Jesus' s Commandments. Love God and your neighbor as yourself, with all being a circular reflection of the other keeping all 3 connected in love.

This is all about belief and faith in love to which those produce good works to confirm the legitimacy of belief - faith ' love, which is valuable for you and others because at that point the belief manifested itself - gave presentation to itself.

At their base, the big religions are man made constructs of control ... and most of the smaller ones are man made constructs of control by one person, rather than the elites in general.

Expressing those rational, doubtful thoughts about the possible contradictions to be found in the religious structures will provoke other believers to throw circular arguments at you because they, too, have thought it and cannot face the fact it might be a truth.. . circular arguments like the devil puts those thoughts of logic and doubt in you, so just forget it and swallow the medicine or risk this loving, incredible creator of all throwing your butt into a hell because He made you with the smarts to figure out the logical fails in the religious book likely written by men rather than appearing whole upon your very soul as the real word of any god should, in my estimation... or failing that, perhaps written in the constellations if the information was so darned important.

Interestingly, there are some basic instructions/tendencies written on (most of) our nervous systems/essence... called empathy, rationality and kindness.

Go figure...

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: freedom7

When I look around a the world and I see biblical prophecy unfolding and a hatred for anything relayed to Yeshua

Actually you'll find the hatred is rarely directed at him...

Its mostly directed towards the religion that came from the bible... and or those that claim to follow him

Even the most staunch atheist will usually openly admit Jesus was a pretty good guy

Said hatred has little to nothing to do with Jesus... Its comes from what the religion turns people into

This 100%. Jesus (if he was real) was a decent dude, it's just a shame large chunks of his followers only pay him lip sevice. If more of them actually practiced what he preached the world would probably be a better place.

The question I have always had in my had is what I'd god is real, what is he put homosexuals, non-believers and people of other faiths on this earth to test the faithful. To see if the actually listened to what jesus said. You know, about not judging and loving everyone as if they were your own and what not. Everyone is part of the plan. No I don't believe, but is this sounds like it could be a pretty good way to test everyone who does. If that's the case I'd say as a race we are doing pretty shockingly.

I question my non belief all the time. It usually results in me coming back to the realisation that it makes no sense. In one breathe we are told we have free will and in the other we are told we MUST follow his instructions. Doesn't sound very free to me. Especially not when there is an eternity of punishment for not following the rules.

I hope you can resolve your crisis of faith one way or the other. Being in limbo, not know what to believe can be pretty awful.

a reply to: freedom7

You make it sound like the bible is Christianity and it is but a small part. You concentrate more on the errors in today's bible instead of worshipping God.

Christianity is about Christ, the Gospel better known as the Good News. It does not matter how well you write your words, you doubt Christ so you are not Christian and probably never were.

So do you see my point .. even the most sincere genuine christians out there if they are honest and real enough will admit that either the bible is LITTERED with contradictions OR it is has been altered throughout history , mistranslated deliberately or purposefully .

You don't get it. do you? The bible is not going to save anyone or anyone else. It sounds like you are worshipping the bible and not God? Are you now denying that God does not exist?

I've felt at times indescribable peace and love that come from feeling like a loved , forgiven child of God . And I have a fondness and love for Jesus Christ in my heart . But I don't know what to do with that anymore , I don't even know what to believe anymore because im not so sure anymore it was a genuine peace. I'm tormented by the idea that a God who loves me will only love me if I abide in him and stay obedient though it all until the end .. and if I don't .. I get sentenced to an eternal doom of the likes so horrific one shudders just at the thought .

You do not know what to do with peace and love? And now you don't know what to believe? And you have problem with being obedient to God? You are right, you are not a Christian. Why all the worries instead serving and worshipping God? Your words show you are filled with fear and not peace and love.

And it's that very fear that keeps ALL religion fine tuned and spinning ...

I'm starting to believe the majority in the " know " who are in positions of religious authority don't even believe in the faith , but they know their flock does . And what better way to control the flock then through fear ?

You think Christianity is run by fear? LOL You sound like a Southern Baptist! Do you understand the words, "Fear the Lord thy God?" One day you will understand. (I will get to the punch line soon enough.... just hang onto your panties)

I want to believe the answer truly is Jesus Christ , and I want to believe God will make it right in the end , but I just don't know anymore ...

OK now you are making some sense.

OK you want to believe ..... so a step in the right direction. Stop listening to the world and those wild thoughts in your head.....there lies your torture. EVERYONE has these thoughts and within them is the deceit to pull you away from your faith. Faith is a gift... you are not born with it. Faith can fade away just like the love for your partner. If you don't spend time and show the love for your partner she/he will leave you..... the same with faith..... one reason for attending a Holy Spirit filled church so your faith gets recharged!

You need peace to come upon you which is what the Holy Spirit will do. Clearly you have stopped your prayers ... it can be seen in your words and I recommend you IMMEDIATELY get back to them by first repenting. Not believing in God is sin in itself. You need help with your prayer life and you need to find a church where God resides in. Many churches have been desecrated and God has left them so find one. Do you know how?

And I don't know how to make sense of a book that tells me there will be family against family , war , wolves against sheep .. I don't understand the contradiction between our human nature and old testament commands of an eye for an eye ( warlike nature ) and Jesus 's command to love our enemies .

Religion has created enormous restlessness and confusion in my life because the answers that seem to be in the book go against so much that I feel , believe , sense ... how do we others who believe just have faith and never question the horrific parts of the bible ?

My advice? Concentrate on your relationship with God. Get back on your knees, repent, because your faith has been drained or left you..... find a church with the Holy Spirit in it. Turn off the TV for 2 weeks and stop letting the "Spirit of Fear" rule over you. Don't let every thought cause you to make a reaction. Slow down.....you are letting daily life and its pressures control you....concentrate more on God and get back with your prayers.... the cloud will leave, happiness will return, the torment will leave and life will get better.

If WW3 comes can you stop it? I can't..... don't let rumors control you..... that is why they are called rumors....

a reply to: freedom7

Surely faith in something should bring you joy?

I left the desert religions because of their dogma and rules designed to make life harder and importantly to make people rely totally on their clerics and pay for services etc which of course to support their living - some considerably better than their (flock).

Like others, I automatically know how to behave in that I don't commit murder, I don't rape and in actual fact try to consider my actions with regard to the ancient idea - if it harms none, do it and try to be decent in judgement and help others etc.

I doubt people can really dispute that Christianity was a manufactured religion designed to give the Emperor control which, if the people saw as coming direct from some supernatural being e.g. a God above the earth,gave him divinity status.

You obviously couldn't have a number of Gods because then people would argue which was the greater because once Judaism came into being with their claim of the one superior God, that set the state for people to make claims as to their superiority over all others. Get others to believe that and you are top dog and it deliberately places you above all criticism.

But before you knock Christianity out of the box altogether I don't think one should ever forget that what Christ really was and is today still, is the male archetype. He displays human characterises in that he taught people values and listened to their woes. He was human in that he could loose his temper, but then he respected his mother, cured the sick and most important of all he gave us some wonderful parables whose meanings never date but show us insights into life and what to expect e.g. the prodigal son, but most important for me he gave us the Good Samaritan.

Christianity has had its hey day for forced conversion and violence, especially against women and science, however if you look at both the teachings for the other two desert religions they still teach religious ideas that permit their followers to harm others whom they perceive as different, which is hardly conducive for life on this planet today.