why is there something so " off " about christianity

a reply to: freedom7

well Christianity is a recycled religion from the Egyptians, story of Horus and Isis is the same as Jesus and marry. the Egyptians got the idea from an older religion call mithraism i think and they got it from an even older one. it all has to do with sun worship. also the christian religion got taken over by the roman empire of the time when the emperor converted on his death bed. So in short it was recycled a few times over and then taken over by roman, so i would think is why it has so many plot holes.
i went to a catholic school and was in a similar boat is you, but dont give up you dont need to follow a religion to believe in good and a higher power.

The Gnostic books might be interesting to you on a side note.

originally posted by: masqua
a reply to: freedom7

I've heard Karen Armstrong is a very good author . I will check those out. Thank you !

If you read the Gospel of Thomas, he was actually quite the badass, a bit of renegade with his feats and reasoning, but that banned because he'd be a bad example(Think of The CHILDREN. I personally don't believe he existed, and that it was just a constructed narrative, that got really popular at the time, but how it became a religion, spread ed like a virus is beyond me, especially before the NT.

No frowning or negativity in their version of the Kingdom of Heaven, in the NT. Also, whats odd about the OT, there was only Hell.

a reply to: freedom7

You're welcome. I'm just finishing her book; 'A Short History of Myth' now and once again she has opened my eyes to what is considered today to be a useless, childish idea (myth), but which was also the roots and branches of what I'd call the 'tree of the world's religions'. Fascinating stuff in a small book of 150 pages.

a reply to: freedom7

Don't let people convince you otherwise, this is a GOOD thing for you in the same way that it is a good thing that a Muslim would start questioning their faith. You will find Christians on here trying to convince you that what you are thinking is from the devil, don't listen to them. The contradictions are there to be seen by anyone, it is only those who are not afraid who choose to recognize them.

Like I said, don't throw Jesus out, his words are the truth in the same way that Buddha's words are the truth. All religions are a perversion of the same truth, they are all connected by one source of truth. Read about all faiths and you will realize they all share the same core concepts with one another, it is everything around those core concepts (such as Jesus dying for sins) that are dogma and lies, used to guide you from the truth. They all symbolize something, but the literal interpretations are wrong. You have to look at them with a discerning and spiritual eye, sifting out the truth on your own terms. Don't let anyone tell you what to believe, find it for yourself. Jesus said that when you pray, to do it alone. To pray is to seek, and to seek is to find eventually.

Good luck.

ETA: If you're interested, you can take a look through some of the threads I've made on these forums, maybe they'll give you a good idea on where to start. Maybe not though, I don't claim to be right about everything I have said on here. Just some friendly advice.

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: freedom7

When I look around a the world and I see biblical prophecy unfolding and a hatred for anything relayed to Yeshua

Actually you'll find the hatred is rarely directed at him...

Its mostly directed towards the religion that came from the bible... and or those that claim to follow him

Even the most staunch atheist will usually openly admit Jesus was a pretty good guy

Said hatred has little to nothing to do with Jesus... Its comes from what the religion turns people into

Very well said. nonbelivers have nothing against the filosofy that represents "jesus" its the magic and supernatural absurdity that turns us off, oh and the apparent hatred for anyone outside the cult.

a reply to: freedom7

Your relationship should be with Jesus. Not what man tells you. The Bible is our guidebook. Pray for the Holy Spirit to help you understand. The Bible is so much history and layers that are still being revealed today - as God wants us to understand them. Just focus on Jesus' love and you'll be fine.

Keep in mind man wants power and man is open to temptation and so man can tell you what the Bible says. He can only advise. If it becomes overwhelming or too frightening just pray for protection and understanding. God will reveal all in the time that he knows is best for you.

The devil is mimicking everything God does in order to pull one's attention away from him and his love.

Get to know Jesus and read His word if anything - one should read the entire Bible but go slowly if you must. Focus on the love and not all the fear. Some of that isn't even meant for those who have accepted Jesus.

By the way no one can take your salvation away from you. Jesus died once and he did it for you and all mankind. If there were only you on this earth he would have done the same - you are just as safe as the next believer.

P.M. if you ever wish. I don't believe in religion either - just a personal relationship with our Savior. Hugs!

So you are questioning your faith, that's a good thing

You really have two options to finding a reality

Ask people on ats who for the most part hate Christ and Christianity, irrespective of what people say

Go study and ask as many questions of people who can answer your questions

Its imperative to get both sides of an argument.

The sad thing is most people in ministry don't understand the teachings of the Word and some hold extreme views.

Tough rod but here is not the place, I believe that there would be one or two people who could help you here and they would be drowned out by the gray noise all around

Do a couple of courses at school. Its your life, make a decision based on education not hearsay from ats.

Christianity is a faith, faith is called for when things are falling apart, we see that now more than ever.
I don't have an answer to Calvinism, what I do know is that there is a little truth to it and many lies.

Hows this for a simple and stupid answer
God works in mysterious ways

I had a similar thread called I hate Christianity, yours is more eloquent

Christ never said this choice would be easy, no matter what a tv evangelist says

originally posted by: freedom7

But this lake of fire wasn't talked about in the old testament ( at least not in those terms , not even close ) ....

So do you see my point .. even the most sincere genuine christians out there if they are honest and real enough will admit that either the bible is LITTERED with contradictions OR it is has been altered throughout history , mistranslated deliberately or purposefully .


I want to believe the answer truly is Jesus Christ , and I want to believe God will make it right in the end , but I just don't know anymore ...

And I don't know how to make sense of a book that tells me there will be family against family , war , wolves against sheep .. I don't understand the contradiction between our human nature and old testament commands of an eye for an eye ( warlike nature ) and Jesus 's command to love our enemies .

Religion has created enormous restlessness and confusion in my life because the answers that seem to be in the book go against so much that I feel , believe , sense ... how do we others who believe just have faith and never question the horrific parts of the bible ?

You could dwell on why God asked Abraham to kill his son Isaac as well..Ah! he was only testing.
I would never ever agree to that from man or any God, but that's me.
But as you say you are a Christian, you have to deal also with the historic entity of Jesus. There is nothing in the new testament written at the given time of Jesus, it's all anecdotal, mostly secondhand from the writers, while the consensus is that Jesus was a historical person. That's something I tend to agree with, although it's not science per se.
Even today though, scholars debate who actually was Jesus, scholars debate how to approach that model even.
The earliest date is given as the Epistles of Paul dated to AD 59, everything else is much later.
The Old Testament is thought to be around five hundred years earlier.
The Bible itself is just a book, about God and Jesus really that appears to tie the two together.

Although I fear my post will be of no assistance in your journey, the one thing I can say is exactly that, it is YOUR journey. No one else can decide this on your behalf. Don't let the mainstream affect your decision. Two phrases, albeit quite cliche, come to mind..."Knowledge is power." and "Seek and ye shall find." Stay dedicated in your search for truth, stay humble, stay inquisitive and most of all, stay true to yourself. Just know that in the end, there's nothing to fear but fear itself.

(I know, my post is littered with cliche, but it's true nonetheless.)

A2D

a reply to: freedom7

Most of us are awaking to the hymns of a NWO that is beginning to realize itself and religion is trying to create a veil over the truth and keep people's mind preoccupied from the powers that control the economy. At times of economic turbulence it feels good to be an Atheist.

originally posted by: smurfy

The Bible itself is just a book, about God and Jesus really that appears to tie the two together.

Just like a textbook they are sold with new editions every year or so to generate money for the authors. Religion = big business.

a reply to: freedom7

You are prying at some of the chinks in the wall of the prison.

Yes, it is scary to live in a wider world that sometimes is quite cruel and makes little sense.

However, if one is truly seeking "freedom" ... sometimes one has to leave what was known or believed behind.

You are not the first to make the journey.

Best of luck; may random chance be with you.

Freedom,

I claim now to be an agnostic, grew up methodist, spent some time with catholicism, spent some time with fundies. You have to do what is right for you, do your research, take others recomendations, but read what appeals to you. Each of us are individuals, we all have different spiritual beliefs. Embrace yourself, and find what works for you.

a reply to: freedom7

I will not leave verses here; I will just tell you what I know and you decide for yourself if it helps you to make better sense of the Bible.

To burn forever and ever is an idiom similar to when Americans say that someone has kicked the bucket. To burn forever and ever means that once something is burnt it will never be that thing again. Those who go into the lake of fire will be instantly turned to ash and never be again. God is merciful. (Manuscripts were written in Hebrew, Arabic, and Greek)

He knew us in the world that passed away. (Christ spoke of that world that passed away) This is the second world age where we were born of flesh; it is our second chance. We were born without the memories of the previous world when we were all angels. He knew the ones that worshiped Lucifer and the horrible things they did. That is why there are some that have passed through this age that God hated before they were born, but even they were given a chance to redeem themselves, but many never will. All the angels, good and bad had to pass through this flesh age so that no one could say God was unfair; even He passed through.

There are two lineages at the beginning of the manuscripts for a reason. Keep in mind that a woman can become pregnant by two different men over a 5 day period of time. Cain was not Adam's son, but was Lucifer (Satan's) son. The serpent was Lucifer, he was the tree of knowledge (good and evil), he taught Eve lust and she taught it to Adam. They didn't get in trouble for eating apples. (God refers later in the manuscripts to the angels as trees and Lucifer as being the tallest and most beautiful tree)

Cain's lineage is the one that God had His children go after and destroy as they were part pure human and part supernatural. They are the ones that Christ was referring to when He said "They call themselves Jews, but are of the synagogue of Satan". They are the mongrel race.

Satan was allowed to roam the earth until that day that Jesus sent him away. Before that Satan could travel to any part of this world. Keep in mind that his greatest sin was wanting to be worshiped as God. Hence all the other "gods" people through time have worshiped. Remember also that he is a deceiver.

Right now you see prophecy unfolding and are feeling the way that you are; I am feeling grief most days. That is Satan attacking those of us who are a threat to him. Ask God to strengthen you for this battle. New age is the wrong path; get off of it while you can.

Adam and Eve were not the first humanoids, they were the first pure humans. Evolution happened. If man can manipulate DNA, God can do it better and over a much longer period of time. The 6th day creations were the ones who evolved from ape; Adam and Eve were made after God rested. 6th day: Men, women, and wild beasts....8th day: Adam was molded out of clay, not created (evolved from DNA manipulation), then God gave him helper animals, not wild beasts, and then He made Eve. They were made 100% pure human as that lineage would be the one that Christ would be born through.

Allah is most definitely not God.

I hope that this has helped a bit.

a reply to: NoCorruptionAllowed Believers, etc. always point to faith-never answers because only god knows. You have not answered his questions because your god doesn't give answers. You are too afraid to confront your religious beliefs and think for yourself. Bravo to the brave who are not afraid to think and question without fear.

I appreciate all these great insights in these responses. I can't imagine the road ahead trying to get to the truth will be easy , and I don't know what to believe in as of this writing . I guess now that I'm growing up I'm realizing why I was always told when I was younger that " Religion and Politics are the two most controversial topics on the planet. So much confusion , so much emotion and thought invested into it etc ...
Whatever road I end up going .. I just hope I find freedom and happiness in . Don't we all ?
I guess the part that's unsettling is the realization I may have never found true contentment , peace , joy and a sense of feeling loved in the Christian Faith . And there are people who have been and are involved in my life who will tell me it's because I'm not one of God's chosen .
My heart goes out to all who've been victims of religious extremism , cults , mind control etc ... thank you for everyone who's reached out and know you can always message me and talk about any of this stuff if any of this relates and you want to open up

a reply to: Agree2Disagree I love your message and your meme.

A lot going on with your OP and the responses. But I'll avoid the religious aspect as others have dove through that & just add this as a response to the latter bit of your post...

Being around ATS you'd think it was the end of the world, that we were already in the midst of WW3, that the NWO was smashing us all down with its iron fist, & that diseases and other under-the-stairs destruction was rampant. But the truth is much brighter than that. This place (ATS) is a wash of drama & doom porn. The earth, on a global scale, is in an era of relative peace when looking at the bulk of recorded history. Compared to human history, diseases and illnesses are fought with science (just look up the state of medical knowledge around 1900, it's rough), many of them having been eradicated. Civil rights, globally, has undergone massive steps forward in just the past 100 years. We are healthier (well, we could be if we didn't buy & eat junk) and overall, happier than humanity has been historically. And there's tons of free porn now! Ha! Just kidding... kind of.

But we are only in the dawn of interconnectedness. Only in the past 15-20 years have we all been supersaturated by the internet (and now our smartphones) and all the information and awareness of everyone else's lives, day to day problems and opinions. It's a lot to take on and a lot to process at times (and a lot of it is unnecessary). Put down the phone and the computer and get out into nature when you can, it's beautiful out there and it all isn't as bad as it may seem. Enjoy your time here.

originally posted by: freedom7

I've felt at times indescribable peace and love that come from feeling like a loved , forgiven child of God . And I have a fondness and love for Jesus Christ in my heart .

What you have written above is the key...trust your heart...

I have been exactly where you are, struggling with exactly the same problems, and here is what I've learned:

The bible can contain 'truth' without being 100% 'true' - read it for yourself (especially the gospels), take it into your heart and 'translate' it with love...

...I put it this way -

"I may or may not be 'Christian' - I don't keep 'my' God in the 'bible' box."

Remember above all that 'Faith' is not about 'believing in' God -

- Faith is about your 'relationship with' God...

...and you develop that relationship by learning 'who' God is to 'you', no one else.

Read and learn as much as you can - not just 'religious' stuff - read anything that gets you thinking about 'what makes sense to you about Faith and God'...

...but - don't believe anything (or 'stop' believing) just because of something you read...

That author, Karen Armstrong is a good recommendation, especially for learning how 'Religions' developed
(remember, 'Religion' is not the same thing as 'Faith' or 'Spirituality' - Religion is about 'rules', the other two are about 'relationship')

But even works of fiction can help you 'relate' to God - He 'speaks' to me primarily thru stories (even stuff like the Harry Potter books), but one of the times I felt closest to Him was when I was reading a book on quantum physics, of all things!

Just keep your mind and heart open and focus on 'getting to know' God - 'talk to Him' as if He was your favorite Uncle (or favorite Aunt!) - ask Him to bring 'information' (books, movies, whatever) into your life that will help you develop the relationship...

Just like any 'real' relationship, you have to be willing to put in time, effort, and thought, and it won't always be easy -

- but you already have a great start with those feelings of Love, so just go right from there.


Edit: Here's a really entertaining book you can find free online, because it's very old and out of copyright - it's not even actually about Jesus himself, it's a fictional story about the Roman Centurion who killed Jesus and how he came to be a christian..

"The Robe" by Lloyd C. Douglas (google the title and author and 'read free online')

It's a great story, cool characters, with a bit of adventure - if you read it, I would love to hear what you think!