DNA, Human Genome Project and the Myth of Race

originally posted by: creation7
a reply to: mapsurfer_

ya, the other half of my genetic origin is Pottawatomie NA, Korean and English. I only wrote the genetics of one parent that you are replying too. I live in Hawaii, crime is relatively low, but I think thats an economic issue more.

As far as what I fill in on a document requesting race, I mark Caucasian or white, because I have more of those ethnic backgrounds than any other, though if you saw me in person one would say I may appear Asian, albeit with brownish blond hair and hazel eyes. Like you say its rather arbitrary to only have one choice and its open to misuse

Oh really? My grandaughter is a fractional Pottawatomie NA in her DNA from her mDNA. So you look like an anime character? Too funny

originally posted by: DexterRiley
a reply to: mapsurfer_

The admixture information is basically just the old divisions of the races. Essentially it's the scientific equivalent of the racial definitions you were talking about earlier.

In another section there is a lot more information about the origins of various segments of the molecular DNA. This is much more detailed view of geographic origins. A significant portion of my DNA originates in Ireland. Another point of origin in on the W. Coast of the African Continent in the area of Cameroon. Then there are other contributions from various sources.

23andMe has a much more detailed test available now than the test we took a few years ago. It's actually pretty cheap compared to what I payed. I haven't checked on it lately, but I think it's around $200.

These chips they are using to perform the DNA analysis are more or less comodity these days. But LEO forensics probably requires a higher standard that what these devices are rated. That's just a guess.

Ok the LEO DNA forensics is the CODIS and NDIS system which is of course a classified access, has around 12million offender records with metadata. The wiki page has a list of the 13 STR loci, Y-STR, mDNA markers they use, but no where does it actually describe the capabilites of the analysis. I got the number of one of the CODIS labs, but no idea if they will talk to me about DNA analysis unless it is a LEO related request.

After reading a bit on CODIS, apparently the basically answer the simplest questions of positive ID and mathing/searching, but that is based on an old specification, so their actual capability in an unknown. I don't think they would publish they had a DNS race profiler, but do mention that is possible, but CODIS is a "color blind" system they claim.

My opinion, that is a brick wall. Looking back at this 23andMe tests, but most likely will wait 4 years til next Census before I renew Ancestry.com, and do my DNA test. Hopefully there will be improvement over time.

a reply to: mapsurfer_

Yes there is no such things as race peeps have been trying a long time to classify but to not scientific avail. If there is no such thing as race then terms like race are if you think about it racist by definition..

there are no sub species for humans we are all humans..

There was this girl who worked at the corner convenience store. She was a white girl, with gorgeous legs that were not alabaster white, but rather a somewhat tanned, creamy complexion (really nice legs, might I add).

Her parents were both black. Her dad looked like a much larger/taller version of louis armstrong. Her mom was anything but light complected. She is albino, or so they say....but her skin color isn't pale. Her eyes are brown.

Growing up, she had a hard time among her neighborhood peers. But to me, she proved to me (before it was really being talked about widely) that "race" is just made up.

Beyond that, seeing how hard it was for a racist to nail down what a "Mexican" is (when they are likely to also have blond hair and blue eyes), was quite enlightening for an observant young man.

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: mapsurfer_

Yes there is no such things as race peeps have been trying a long time to classify but to not scientific avail. If there is no such thing as race then terms like race are if you think about it racist by definition..

there are no sub species for humans we are all humans..

My wife's aunt loos like she just walked out of a rice paddy in Korea. She is as latin as it gets, and the wifes family has no asian history....

A guy i worked with, and his sister, were adopted as young eastern indian orphans. You should see the looks of disgust he would get when someone would come up and start speaking spanish to him, and he couldn't understand.

race was never a myth and never will be. In the Bible it states 'each shall marry after his own kind'. dna is taking race out of the equation to be politically correct, nothing else. French perfume manufacturers test and make perfumes based on race as each race smells different.
a reply to: mapsurfer_

a reply to: mapsurfer_

Ok the LEO DNA forensics is the CODIS and NDIS system which is of course a classified access, has around 12million offender records with metadata. The wiki page has a list of the 13 STR loci, Y-STR, mDNA markers they use, but no where does it actually describe the capabilites of the analysis. I got the number of one of the CODIS labs, but no idea if they will talk to me about DNA analysis unless it is a LEO related request.

I think the claim is that the CODIS markers contain no useful information about the phenotypical expression of the criminal's DNA. I wasn't aware that the mtDNA and Y-STR results were also being stored in the NDIS system. That information could be used, minimally, to determine the appearance of an individual. However, they are passed along, relatively unchanged, from generation to generation. So, it's likely that other molecular DNA sequences would play a much greater role in defining the characteristics of the suspect.

There was a recent Supreme Court case that examined the constitutionality of maintaining a database of arrestee's DNA. Their opinion was that as long as the non-descriptive CODIS markers were used, the data was similar to keeping fingerprints. Justice Antonin Scalia dissented from the majority.

Antonin Scalia's concern was that the FBI database could grow to include the full genomic DNA sequence of individuals. Of course that information would be highly descriptive. The full DNA sequence not only provides enough information to physically describe an individual's appearance, but also information about what health ailments the individual may be subject to. And while the CODIS markers were specifically discussed in this case, if the FBI decided to add genomic information, a future SCOTUS may decline to hear the case and just rely of this ruling.

These days it is a simple matter for a properly equipped lab to get a full DNA sequence from the follicle of a single human hair. So, even if this data is not added into the NDIS database, modern full search capabilities could extract these records from reports and other databases that aren't at the national level. Not to mention that it would be a simple matter for law enforcement to issue a subpoena to the commercial DNA testing services to get any suspect's test results to further their investigation.

-dex

originally posted by: Nochzwei
race was never a myth and never will be. In the Bible it states 'each shall marry after his own kind'. dna is taking race out of the equation to be politically correct, nothing else. French perfume manufacturers test and make perfumes based on race as each race smells different.
a reply to: mapsurfer_

The bible also states the world was created in six working days, and you believe that because of RC or religiously correct.
And really Kind?? kind most likely meant that horses and cows shouldn't do the nasty because they couldn't kind bore off springs.,

The EU has interfered with doctor's experiments and work with genetic research. Every scientists' research was tampered with by the EU criminal intelligence apparatus to damage patients with neurological weapons and eve genetic weapons, for the sole purpose of pretending that the genetic cure for cancer and other degenerative diseases does not work.
EU intelligence attacked the patients with other illnesses and dysfunction such as immune system disfunctions. These dysfunctions were blamed on the cure of the original illness. All for obscurantist purposes, to stop a new medical revolution that goes way beyond any previous medical capability.

Cure for many illnesses are currently being witheld as classified information in the EU, and when a doctor tries to perform them on a patient, the secret service intervene on the patient with neurological and other biological weapons to discredit the doctor's work, even at the risk of killing the patient as long as the cure is not administered. If the patient is cured the EU intelligence will attempt anything the kill them as a demonstration.