Russia's bombing in Syria has killed hundreds of civilians - new report

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: CaptainBeno

Anyway, what's your point here? AND what other way of WAR would you like?

One fought with courage and personal involvement, not faceless slaughter from above. Russia is making the same mistake that the United States made in its more recent follies. Islam emerged from a warrior culture; it views the battlefield as a place to demonstrate one's virtue: courage, strength, belief in the after-life rewards for serving one's god. This explains why Muslims will prove their faith by becoming human bombs. Like the Americans before them, the Russians are proving themselves to be cowards who are unwilling to risk their lives in personal combat while targeting innocent women and children. The only response is to prove Islam's moral superiority to the decadent infidels by striking against Russian civilians with valiant suicide bombers.

The only way that Daesh can be defeated is if non-millenialist Muslims defeat it on a glorious battlefield: Dabiq. Western involvement is not required.

No point in explaining, eventually these lunatics will see the backlash when generations of kids will rise up and raise hell throughout the world to avenge their families and break free from this new found oppression raining on them from the sky. There are 1.1 billion muslims worldwide, 1/7th of the world population, not even 0.0001% (literally) are terrorists, yet we are bombing them all. Sad.

I pray on everything that the next time a terrorist from america commits a crime overseas, that other countries come and bomb america, because that's where the terrorist came from.

I pray that the next time a terrorist from Canada commits an act on US soil, that the world powers bomb the hell of Canada for being the country he came from

See logic?

a reply to: theySeeme

Your prayers would be rejected by a compassionate God. That is why Daesh will destroy itself.

War always includes civilian casualties.
If it doesn't then it's a sham because someone is just dropping bombs on empty desert (US maybe?)
Where was the outrage when the civilians of Iraq were being killed by US bombs in our invasion?

If you are in close proximity to ISIS forces then you're gonna get hit.
The idea of "surgical strikes" was invented by the US to make war sound safer to civilian populations.
It's a farce and always has been.

If the US were seriously attacking ISIS we'd be killing civilians too.

It's actually funny to observe the pro-russian crowd trying to slither their justifications of innocent civilians being killed by Russia, at the same time grabbing on their last straw - whataboutism.
Look, if you hate the US for the doing the same, you can't go on justifying Russia. Otherwise you're exposing yourself as a shill or as an extremely ignorant person.

a reply to: Asktheanimals

Where was the outrage when the civilians of Iraq were being killed by US bombs in our invasion?

You must have a very short memory. Remember all those "PROOF: US is using NUKES in Iraq" threads? And just a couple of months ago some members could post anything on any thread with happening to bring up the "US attacks hospital in Afghanistan." And yet, when Russia engages in "shock and awe" tactics, the same members applaud it.

If you are in close proximity to ISIS forces then you're gonna get hit.

Some people have no choice but to hunker down where they are. You cannot make it sound as though they are responsible for their own deaths.

The idea of "surgical strikes" was invented by the US to make war sound safer to civilian populations.

Sad but true.

It's a farce and always has been.

Nevertheless, it is possible to choose targets with high value and low potential for collateral damage. This is the warfighting doctrine of the United States, but not, apparently, Russia. The US uses drones to take out a terrorist leader and kills a few of his neighbors. It's cowardly (and in my opinion, illegal) but it is less invasive than barrel bombing an entire city because there might be terrorists there.

If the US were seriously attacking ISIS we'd be killing civilians too.

You say that as though it were an end, not a means.

originally posted by: gmacev
It's actually funny to observe the pro-russian crowd trying to slither their justifications of innocent civilians being killed by Russia, at the same time grabbing on their last straw - whataboutism.
Look, if you hate the US for the doing the same, you can't go on justifying Russia. Otherwise you're exposing yourself as a shill or as an extremely ignorant person.

Its funny how all the anti-Russians are all jumping on the same wagon at the same time. "You hate the US for X, now hate Russia because they did X too"

Is there like a bulletin board for pro-western sepremisists where they all get their talking points from? I would expext a little more diversity in opinions. They all seem to have the same angle and hold anyone that does not hate Russia with same opinion.

Regardless if Russia is doing what the US is doing, I dont feel as dooped by Russia as I do by the west and their allies.

Still, has Russia blown up 4000 of their own civillians as an excuse to launder trillions from their own tax payers to murder a million or more of other nations civilians.

We can deal with Russia later. Right now it is the US and their allies whos jack boots are firmly against my throats telling me what to do believe or be put on a "watchlist"

In other news top rebel commanders (including nr#1. zahran alloush of jaish al islam) in Ghouta pocket, Eastern-Damascus have been killed by russian airstrikes today. The same men who have called for genocide of alawites and sjiites, denounced democracy and put civilians in cages as human shields. Good job Russia! This shows their operation is highly effective.
Civilians die in war, i dont understand this report, does the OP have a better idea how to remove al qaeda, isis and other fanatical radical islamist groups from Syria? How to destroy the bomb factories, armories, traning facilities without airstrikes?

besides, for the thousands of airstrikes they have performed, a few hundred civilian casualties is very acceptable in my opinion. They have killed more isis terrorist (not counting other fanatical beasts) in a single day. Meanwhile turks have literaly killed thousands of kurdish-turkish civilians and yet we are here discussing 'russian warcrimes', eventhough we should be thankfull that they are cleaning up the world a bit.

originally posted by: Asktheanimals
War always includes civilian casualties.
If it doesn't then it's a sham because someone is just dropping bombs on empty desert (US maybe?)
Where was the outrage when the civilians of Iraq were being killed by US bombs in our invasion?

If you are in close proximity to ISIS forces then you're gonna get hit.
The idea of "surgical strikes" was invented by the US to make war sound safer to civilian populations.
It's a farce and always has been.

If the US were seriously attacking ISIS we'd be killing civilians too.

I just hope you say the same the other way around. For example, the soldier from Oregon, USA who we imprisoned for killing civilians in Afghanistan, does Afghanistan have the right to rain bombs on Oregon, U.S.A? No? Than why is it like that the other way around? We created this problem as a direct result of assassinating political figures who maintained order in the reigion, and we replaced that order with complete chaos. Prior to the Gulf War, no one even knew what a terrorist was or cared, now look, everyone's a terrorist. It's the new black, the new gay. What ever

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: theySeeme

Your prayers would be rejected by a compassionate God. That is why Daesh will destroy itself.

Exactly!

Daesh will destroy itself the same way america has destroyed itself when it did exactly what I stated in my post. I know you feel me, you won't admit that though -- contracts your biblical world (which is as violent as "islam))

originally posted by: gmacev
It's actually funny to observe the pro-russian crowd trying to slither their justifications of innocent civilians being killed by Russia, at the same time grabbing on their last straw - whataboutism.
Look, if you hate the US for the doing the same, you can't go on justifying Russia. Otherwise you're exposing yourself as a shill or as an extremely ignorant person.

Exactly! There is simply no excuse. We can send people to the moon, make unthinkable medical breakthroughs, can brag about sniping people across several miles in distance (America Propaganda Chris Kyle movie or what ever), yet they can't hit the target without hitting innocent kids. Can you imagine if we followed this same logic here in america, like

-- "Oh well, that kid deserved to die, it was living in the same area as the criminal that the hero cop shot at"

can you imagine? If we considered our kids as collateral damage ACCEPTABLE simply because criminals live near us?

Sick sick sick

So basically, instead of 100 innocent people dying in paris, it's better that 100 innocent people from Syria die instead - wow, such logic. Meanwhile, 1000's of friends and families and even strangers of these victims will avenge their deaths and become "terrorists" themselves!

Sick sick sick

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: gmacev
It's actually funny to observe the pro-russian crowd trying to slither their justifications of innocent civilians being killed by Russia, at the same time grabbing on their last straw - whataboutism.
Look, if you hate the US for the doing the same, you can't go on justifying Russia. Otherwise you're exposing yourself as a shill or as an extremely ignorant person.

Its funny how all the anti-Russians are all jumping on the same wagon at the same time. "You hate the US for X, now hate Russia because they did X too"

Is there like a bulletin board for pro-western sepremisists where they all get their talking points from? I would expext a little more diversity in opinions. They all seem to have the same angle and hold anyone that does not hate Russia with same opinion.

Regardless if Russia is doing what the US is doing, I dont feel as dooped by Russia as I do by the west and their allies.

Still, has Russia blown up 4000 of their own civillians as an excuse to launder trillions from their own tax payers to murder a million or more of other nations civilians.

We can deal with Russia later. Right now it is the US and their allies whos jack boots are firmly against my throats telling me what to do believe or be put on a "watchlist"

Weird, you don't feel duped by Russia, but you admit you don't know what Russia is doing. Strange.

originally posted by: theySeeme

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: gmacev
It's actually funny to observe the pro-russian crowd trying to slither their justifications of innocent civilians being killed by Russia, at the same time grabbing on their last straw - whataboutism.
Look, if you hate the US for the doing the same, you can't go on justifying Russia. Otherwise you're exposing yourself as a shill or as an extremely ignorant person.

Its funny how all the anti-Russians are all jumping on the same wagon at the same time. "You hate the US for X, now hate Russia because they did X too"

Is there like a bulletin board for pro-western sepremisists where they all get their talking points from? I would expext a little more diversity in opinions. They all seem to have the same angle and hold anyone that does not hate Russia with same opinion.

Regardless if Russia is doing what the US is doing, I dont feel as dooped by Russia as I do by the west and their allies.

Still, has Russia blown up 4000 of their own civillians as an excuse to launder trillions from their own tax payers to murder a million or more of other nations civilians.

We can deal with Russia later. Right now it is the US and their allies whos jack boots are firmly against my throats telling me what to do believe or be put on a "watchlist"

Weird, you don't feel duped by Russia, but you admit you don't know what Russia is doing. Strange.

Not that strange at all. Russia owes me nothing. I could care less what they do. Its Canada and it's allies that I am concerned about because they represent me and spend my money.

When my own back yard becomes a little cleaner I will start critisizing others.

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: theySeeme

originally posted by: MALBOSIA

originally posted by: gmacev
It's actually funny to observe the pro-russian crowd trying to slither their justifications of innocent civilians being killed by Russia, at the same time grabbing on their last straw - whataboutism.
Look, if you hate the US for the doing the same, you can't go on justifying Russia. Otherwise you're exposing yourself as a shill or as an extremely ignorant person.

Its funny how all the anti-Russians are all jumping on the same wagon at the same time. "You hate the US for X, now hate Russia because they did X too"

Is there like a bulletin board for pro-western sepremisists where they all get their talking points from? I would expext a little more diversity in opinions. They all seem to have the same angle and hold anyone that does not hate Russia with same opinion.

Regardless if Russia is doing what the US is doing, I dont feel as dooped by Russia as I do by the west and their allies.

Still, has Russia blown up 4000 of their own civillians as an excuse to launder trillions from their own tax payers to murder a million or more of other nations civilians.

We can deal with Russia later. Right now it is the US and their allies whos jack boots are firmly against my throats telling me what to do believe or be put on a "watchlist"

Weird, you don't feel duped by Russia, but you admit you don't know what Russia is doing. Strange.

Not that strange at all. Russia owes me nothing. I could care less what they do. Its Canada and it's allies that I am concerned about because they represent me and spend my money.

When my own back yard becomes a little cleaner I will start critisizing others.

Having opinions about something you admit you know nothing about is strange, period.

No need to argue that.

a reply to: paraphi

A civilian is a civilian untill the radicallism kicks in.

a reply to: CaptainBeno

Ahh, I see...

Western aircraft blow civilians up = War crimes, people should pay, etc etc..

Russian aircraft blow up civilians = Well, that's just War, never mind...

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
Lets see , US 1 1/2 year of bombing with little results and no report .Russia is knocking the snot out of ISIS in short order and the reports are starting .

Let's see - 18 months of an air campaign that has seen the IS advance halted and 18% of their territory lost.

As for Russia, there is little evidence they are even hitting IS in any meaningful way as all the area's the Syrian Government have taken back under Russia air support is from other rebel groups. I see you're buying the Kremlin propaganda in spades.

originally posted by: purplemer
Funny how there where no harrowing images of innocent families being bombed to bit when Western coalition forces bombed Iraq. An occupation that took some million lives. Mostly women and children..

Sorry, you're full of crap. Most (and I really mean almost all bar one) sources put the civilian toll in Iraq over the course of almost a decade at around 150,000. Now this is mostly deaths caused by lawlessness and sectarian violence caused by Iraqi's themselves, not coalition forces.

1 million - - I can't believe people, in this day and age of instant information, still believe crap they read on the internet without some basic fact checking.

a reply to: theySeeme

you won't admit that though -- contracts your biblical world

You need to spend some time on a board before you start jumping to conclusions about its participants. As an atheist, I found your prayers for death and destruction very telling.

a reply to: stumason

Sorry, you're full of crap. Most (and I really mean almost all bar one) sources put the civilian toll in Iraq over the course of almost a decade at around 150,000. Now this is mostly deaths caused by lawlessness and sectarian violence caused by Iraqi's themselves, not coalition forces.

The truth hurt buts it the truth. Government figures are low have a look at the only peer reviewed scientific study done on the death toll in Iraq. The lancet report

a reply to: purplemer



Isn't that exactly what I said? All bar one source has the figures at around 150,000 - and I will reitterate again that most of these deaths are Iraqi on Iraqi violence, not the result of Coalition combat missions.

You have the solitary source claiming a million but actually, they're not, you are! The Lancet report has such a wide range it is laughable anyone takes it seriously. You're also misquoting their numbers, which shows you either don't understand what they're saying, or are simply grabbing the highest number because it jives with your mindset.

The second survey[2][3][4] published on 11 October 2006, estimated 654,965 excess deaths related to the war, or 2.5% of the population, through the end of June 2006. The new study applied similar methods and involved surveys between May 20 and July 10, 2006.[4] More households were surveyed, allowing for a 95% confidence interval of 392,979 to 942,636 excess Iraqi deaths. 601,027 deaths (range of 426,369 to 793,663 using a 95% confidence interval) were due to violence. 31% (186,318) of those were attributed to the US-led Coalition, 24% (144,246) to others, and 46% (276,472) unknown. The causes of violent deaths were gunshot (56% or 336,575), car bomb (13% or 78,133), other explosion/ordnance (14%), air strike (13% or 78,133), accident (2% or 12,020), and unknown (2%).

As you can see, their figures range from a low of 392k to a high of 942k... Ridiculous. They may as well have sat in a room for five minutes and randomly picked a number.

Almost every other source you can find puts the figure at between 150k-200k.

a reply to: MALBOSIA

Its funny how all the anti-Russians are all jumping on the same wagon at the same time. "You hate the US for X, now hate Russia because they did X too"

So then it is no different than blaming the US for everything under the sun because they did something in the past.

Not exactly a good defense there I'm afraid.

Still, has Russia blown up 4000 of their own civillians as an excuse to launder trillions from their own tax payers to murder a million or more of other nations civilians.

They do that yes...remember Chechnya.

We can deal with Russia later. Right now it is the US and their allies whos jack boots are firmly against my throats telling me what to do believe or be put on a "watchlist"

Ah yes because Russia doesn't keep their citizens under a tight watch...just don't oppose the government policies and their president and everything is peachy...oh and don't be in the LGBT community as they are the loved ones in Russia.

a reply to: MALBOSIA

I could care less what they do.

But your one of the first to defend them and their actions wholeheartedly aren't you...so you do care what they do.