Robert Dear is a Christian Terrorist

a reply to: LSU0408

I agree. Reading through this thread it is pretty impossible not to see the hypocrisy. I also think it is ironic when Conservatives/Republicans/Christians say anything in defense of our stance or beliefs we are called whiners and victims.
Truly ironic coming from liberals that seem to find offense quite easily.

originally posted by: LSU0408
Fortunately for you, us "right wingers" are competent and we think for ourselves and are able to make our own decisions without having our strings pulled, so I assure you that none of this propaganda you are so afraid of is going to have an effect on any of us. That's one of the biggest differences between Conservatives and liberals. We aren't puppets, we don't need other people thinking for us.

It seems that it already has had a effect on you, just sayin'...

a reply to: ketsuko

There really isn't much else that needs to be added other than, this topic is a blatant attempt to silence the opinions and speech of the opposition by shaming us into silence and tarring and feathering us. It's contemptible and should be nipped in the bud however it presents on either side.

Nonsense and I resent the implication. Your own post is nothing more than a wanton attempt to silence my speech by playing the victim.

This was actually the fourth political thread relating to the topic of the disturbing influence of Christian extremism (and while I'm at it, romantic nationalist fervor) over American conservatism that I've authored in the last month. Here's links and an excerpt from each OP.

Oct 30 Three GOP Candidates Speaking At Hate Monger's Bigotry Fest

None of this should be surprising considering that the conference's organizer, Ken Swanson, is a hate mongering bigot — a fact no rational person could possibly hope to deny. Even if you're fortunate enough to not know this man's name, you'll likely have heard some of his insane homophobic rantings in the past. Ashley Feinberg's Gawker post, Three GOP Candidates Join Pastor Who Thinks Frozen Turns Kids Gay, has links to several examples of Ken Swanson's nuttery, including these linked from Right Wing Watch:

The conference is a veritable Who's Who of radical fundie hate speech including nutjobs who want America to become a Christian theocracy like Phil Kayser and Joel McDurmon. Phil Kayser was in the news during the 2012 campaign after pledging support for Ron Paul, an endorsement that was briefly touted by the Ron Paul campaign:

Nov 20 About those 'Free Speech Protesters' at the University of Michigan

"Liberalism promotes sexual perversion —especially homosexuality and miscegenation — which debases the White race. Neither homosexuals nor interracial couples, after all, produce White children." — Kyle Bristow, 'Does white guilt run in the family?' - The Citizens Informer of the Council of Conservative Citizens Feb. 10, 2011

More to the point, extremists like these are nurtured and embraced by some elements within the conservative establishment. Their actions excused, apologized for, buried and often SIMPLY IGNORED. Speaking of things ignored, let me finish by relating to you the link to Ted Cruz that set me on this course. As I said, I was looking for a transcript of Ted Cruz's speech at a conference I posted about in this thread and I came across the following:

Nov 25 Radical Christianity — Pastor Who Hosted GOP: Paris Victims 'Devil-Worshippers'

With the possible exception of the Westboro Baptist Church, many Americans generally turn a blind eye to Christian extremists. Is it that the Westboro Baptist Church is saying something that is so radically different from other fundamentalists churches? I don't think so. I believe the line they crossed that excludes them from being protected by the cloak of conservative political correctness is largely one of etiquette rather than ideology. Pro tip for fundamentalist hate preachers: don't disrupt soldiers' funerals.

Two days after the last one was authored, Dear walks into a PP and starts shooting people. In the following days, statements from two of his ex-wives come to light:

From his 2nd wife, daughter of a Republican State Senator, in a 1993 affidavit:

"He says that as long as he believes he will be saved, he can do whatever he pleases. He is obsessed with the world coming to an end."

Then from his 3rd wife, who divorced him in 2000:

He was religious but not a regular churchgoer, a believer but not one to harp on religion. “He believed wholeheartedly in the Bible,” she said. “That’s what he always said; he read it cover to cover to cover.” But he was not fixated on it, she added.

In 2005 he was posting online:

“AIDS, hurricanes, we are in the end times. Accept the LORD JESUS while you can.”

Fast forward to recent years and he's handing out Conservative political pamphlets. Were these in fact the sort of "political guides" that groups like CCA print and disseminate? I don't know, but I wouldn't rule it out.

Now consider what's come out so far about his statements:

Colorado Springs, Colorado (CNN)Robert Lewis Dear, the suspect in Friday's shootings at the Planned Parenthood clinic in Colorado Springs, mentioned "baby parts" to investigators and in later interviews expressed anti-abortion and anti-government views, a law enforcement official briefed on the investigation told CNN.

(all of that is from the OP)

Seems to me that whether or not he's the most deranged version of the type of extremist I've BEEN talking about all month or not, there's what outwardly appears to be a definite pattern of radicalization.

Deny it all you want but please don't try to paint me as somebody simply echoing stupid talking points from the last few days.

a reply to: LSU0408

I can't help but feel that the overall premise I'm trying to convey to you is being overlooked. Perhaps my delivery is inadequate.

It doesn't matter though. I will move along because it seems like I'm just repeating myself.

a reply to: theantediluvian

This was actually the fourth political thread relating to the topic of the disturbing influence of Christian extremism (and while I'm at it, romantic nationalist fervor) over American conservatism that I've authored in the last month. Here's links and an excerpt from each OP.

I anxiously await your threads of Reverend Wright and Louis Farakan





Somehow I know we won't see any.

Hey, this may be true. Looking more and more so as things unwind.

One person who spoke with [Dear] extensively about his religious views said Mr. Dear, who is 57, had praised people who attacked abortion providers, saying they were doing “God’s work.” In 2009, said the person, who spoke on the condition of anonymity out of concerns for the privacy of the family, Mr. Dear described as “heroes” members of the Army of God, a loosely organized group of anti-abortion extremists that has claimed responsibility for a number of killings and bombings.[ Source]

“He claims to be a Christian and is extremely evangelistic, but does not follow the Bible in his actions,” Mescher stated in the affidavit. “He says that as long as he believes he will be saved, he can do whatever he pleases. He is obsessed with the world coming to an end.”

She did not return multiple requests over the weekend and Monday for comment. [Source]

The more I read through this thread and others like it, the more I become convinced that there is a certain faction of people who, because they actually do paint all _fill-in-your-own-blank_ people a certain way, are actually in their own minds extreme bigots or simply extremists, immediately assume upon reading anything remotely critical of their own beliefs that someone is doing the very same thing to them as they do to others.

There's a phrase for this...not quite coming to me....

a reply to: ~Lucidity

There's a phrase for this...not quite coming to me....

It's called American politics.

Where two sides use propaganda to 'prove' one side is better than the other side.

When in truth they are both full of snip.

originally posted by: theantediluvian

originally posted by: infolurker
a reply to: theantediluvian

LOL,

Go for it. While your at it tell everyone that whoever believes in Christ is a terrorist?

I'm not doing any such thing and I won't be cowed by your politically correct victim-playing tactics.

haha, Christians do not receive PC protections. Quite the opposite, they get PC hate.

As long as you never, ever derail any discussion of the daily, world-wide, 40-year muslim terrorism wave.....I guess you'll be consistent.

Of course I hope you'll acknowledge that the Christian example like Dear happens a couple times per year, as opposed to many times daily for muslims.

originally posted by: tonycodes
thats right! all terrorists are actually suffering from mental illness.. this thread supports my theory that terrorism needs to be fought as a psychological war. send in the muslim missionarys! bc, of course, if this guy is a christian terrorist, bc he is mentally ill, then you would be calling muslim terrorists mentally ill as well, sonce u cant have it both ways

In that vein of thought all the anti Christian rhetoric and pro life hatred on this forum could cause violence against these groups as well?

Come to think of it the anti Christian rhetoric has caused the beheading and crucifixions and stonings of Christians in the middle east, and are being perpetrated by thousands of madmen.

I guess they are insane.

Yes I am pro life, I believe all life is sacred including the abortionist.

I just hate this sort of thing, it goes against everything I believe in.

But so does abortion.

The PTB now can hope to silence the opposition, since we are all radicals.

originally posted by: amberinsc
a reply to: LSU0408

I agree. Reading through this thread it is pretty impossible not to see the hypocrisy. I also think it is ironic when Conservatives/Republicans/Christians say anything in defense of our stance or beliefs we are called whiners and victims.
Truly ironic coming from liberals that seem to find offense quite easily.

yeah, Alinsky taught / preached this.

Keep using a strategy 24 / 7 / 365, such as crying the blues about all the evil persecution in the world (like we're seeing ad nauseum at the universities, but every day all day for LGBT, BLM, la raza, sexism, AGW, etc) then quickly claim the other side is doing it. No rational or honest explanation, just say they're doing it to head off any accurate description of the libs doing it.

a reply to: theantediluvian

Wondering if there be calls for the moderate Christians to do something about this. Just as the moderate Muslims are expected to do something about the Muslim extremists.

:-)

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ~Lucidity

There's a phrase for this...not quite coming to me....

It's called American politics.

Where two sides use propaganda to 'prove' one side is better than the other side.

When in truth they are both full of snip.

No.

Saying it's politics or dismissing it as such trivializes what is probably a much deeper issue. An issue which in fact politics and politicians attempt to take advantage of.

originally posted by: amberinsc
a reply to: LSU0408

I agree. Reading through this thread it is pretty impossible not to see the hypocrisy. I also think it is ironic when Conservatives/Republicans/Christians say anything in defense of our stance or beliefs we are called whiners and victims.
Truly ironic coming from liberals that seem to find offense quite easily.

Times 1,000,000

originally posted by: aorAki

originally posted by: LSU0408
Fortunately for you, us "right wingers" are competent and we think for ourselves and are able to make our own decisions without having our strings pulled, so I assure you that none of this propaganda you are so afraid of is going to have an effect on any of us. That's one of the biggest differences between Conservatives and liberals. We aren't puppets, we don't need other people thinking for us.

It seems that it already has had a effect on you, just sayin'...

LOL.... Just sayin'


Fear the Conservative!

originally posted by: introvert
a reply to: LSU0408

I can't help but feel that the overall premise I'm trying to convey to you is being overlooked. Perhaps my delivery is inadequate.

It doesn't matter though. I will move along because it seems like I'm just repeating myself.

Likewise.

originally posted by: purplemer
a reply to: theantediluvian

Wondering if there be calls for the moderate Christians to do something about this. Just as the moderate Muslims are expected to do something about the Muslim extremists.

:-)

Like calling him a crazed lunatic and not fearing for our lives as we openly say it?

I don't agree with the websites that say that this guy was a Democrat based on the evidence. It is fairly clear that he has conservative views. That being said, that doesn't make all Christians or all conservatives terrorists. He just happened to be a bit crazy.

originally posted by: ~Lucidity

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ~Lucidity

There's a phrase for this...not quite coming to me....

It's called American politics.

Where two sides use propaganda to 'prove' one side is better than the other side.

When in truth they are both full of snip.

No.

Saying it's politics or dismissing it as such trivializes what is probably a much deeper issue. An issue which in fact politics and politicians attempt to take advantage of.

More like overanalyzing, totally... An insane lunatic shot up an abortion clinic... Nothing more, nothing less... Somehow, though, it's all because of right wing media that a right wing extremist Conservative Christian shot up an abortion clinic. Pretty damn silly to be honest.

originally posted by: LSU0408

originally posted by: ~Lucidity

originally posted by: neo96
a reply to: ~Lucidity

There's a phrase for this...not quite coming to me....

It's called American politics.

Where two sides use propaganda to 'prove' one side is better than the other side.

When in truth they are both full of snip.

No.

Saying it's politics or dismissing it as such trivializes what is probably a much deeper issue. An issue which in fact politics and politicians attempt to take advantage of.

More like overanalyzing, totally... An insane lunatic shot up an abortion clinic... Nothing more, nothing less... Somehow, though, it's all because of right wing media that a right wing extremist Conservative Christian shot up an abortion clinic. Pretty damn silly to be honest.

We'll see...