Turkey Says Attack On Turkish Convoy A Russian “Act Of War”

a reply to: Aliensun


I may be wrong, and also others might have already said this.... But isn't the reason behind NATO to back up the other member countries? What I mean is - if a country is seen to be wronging a member of NATO.... The rest of the 'Gang' can be called for help!?
If Turkey (being a part of NATO) calls foul about Russia 'picking' on them, and "Magically" produces evidence (doesn't require truth, just needs to be believable), then Nato can either tell any such Aggressor to back down or face sanctions, and or war. Anyone in Nato with an axe to grind against Russia, ya think? Apologies if that doesn't make as much sense as I though...

It seems that Russia has fought many battles against Turkey and Turkey lost quite a lot. Now it looks as they know that NATO is backing Turkey , they want to start another war with Russia .

It will leave NATO divided if this is going to happen IMO ..

originally posted by: 0bserver1
It seems that Russia has fought many battles against Turkey and Turkey lost quite a lot. Now it looks as they know that NATO is backing Turkey , they want to start another war with Russia .

It will leave NATO divided if this is going to happen IMO ..

Trust me, no sane country wants a war with Russia, frankly I don't know what the hell they are doing.
Going up to Russia is a mistake, the majority of the country is filled with Patriots who will support Putin no matter what actions he will take. ( for better or worse )

originally posted by: 0bserver1
It seems that Russia has fought many battles against Turkey and Turkey lost quite a lot. Now it looks as they know that NATO is backing Turkey , they want to start another war with Russia .

It will leave NATO divided if this is going to happen IMO ..

I doubt nato will attack russia because of turks the way it is. Turkey started it and now they dance alone. Plus my country despite what our politicians wish or want or wannabe. We would never go against Russia, they like it or not.

In the other hand, turkey is a monkey chicken.. .they always created war events with my country, to burry another internal or external matter of which they are involved. Each time scandals appeared in Turkey, always ended up with some warm events with violations (airspace/sea/military events) with my country or Cyprus. We are preparing "instead", for an event in our islands. But this time they took an arrow in the knee! Russia and Iran (plus Kurds) are very angry with turks.

I really doubt that France the way it is now, would support NATO against Russia as well.

I would totally trust RT news, especially when concerning questionable Russian political and UFO incidents. They'll never steer you wrong!
I'm nearly positive Russia did violate Turkish airspace. I'm also certain Turkey was being a bunch of idiots when they shot down their aircraft.
Neither the Russian's nor the Turks are innocent in this. They're both doing things they shouldn't be doing.

a reply to: Willtell

Not so sure of POTUS Obama having the nuts to "give it a go". After all, he kept it pretty silent when under his watch they went into basically a large compound housing retired INTEL brass to get Bin Laden.

Captain Phillips anyone?

Those are pretty passive-aggressive decisions made.

Even if in a puppet mode being President.

a reply to: Belgianbloke
Those patriots are manned by the US and other European countries who leant them their patriots.

So when patriots are being deployed against Russian fighter planes, the Russians know that one of the European countries or the US have shot on Russian targets.

Turkey itself doesn't have patriots. .

And I'm not sure if they still got patriots ,because Germany retrieved their patriots due to hacking the Patriot system in august. .

a reply to: Ploutonas

Are you Greek? Just asking to be sure and would be nice to get input from that part of the world right here on ATS...

Turkey keeps provoking Russia, while ago turkey started a military exercise, how to maintain a crisis if turkey closes the straits of Bosporos and not allow Russia pass from black sea to Aegean sea...!

The below link can be auto-translate into your language (under the main title and picture, there is a choice to translate, just click your flag).

link

It will be illegal if they do that, they will give every right to Russia for a war declaration against turkey.

Turks also provoke Kurds in a daily bases. Today they murdered a big personallity for Kurds in live coverage! There is live feed and photos included in the link (warning for sensitive minds and spirits) It is characterized as a political assassination link

# Terminal1 Yes I am Hellenic

So um yeah Russia has bombed another aid convoy most likely full of weapons for the terrorists in Syria. Russia looks to be working towards closing down that border to stop the flow of weapons into Syria.

Russia strikes another Turkish weapons supply convoy to Syria.
www.liveleak.com...

Islam is Islam...of course there are people in power in Turkey that support ISIS and every other terrorist group. Same with Iran and every other Muslim country. Are you starting to see that this is...by their choice...Islam declaring war on the world? And in the end...we will be at war with Islam regardless if Obama and tribe refuse to say the words.

Now...something really scary. Lets say we wipe out all Islamic terrorists. Every last one...today. Tomorrow these so called "moderate" Muslims will give birth to another terrorist, then another, then another. It will continue to happen as long as there are Muslims.

I'm not offering a solution...I wouldn't touch that with a ten foot pole. But it is true. As long as Islam and Muslims exist, there will be Islamic terrorists.

Turkey has been a wolf in sheeps clothing for a while now and a hot bed for terrorism just like how packistan with Al Queda was. Russia has every right to bomb them to oblivion after shooting that plane down. Turn Turkey in to a parking lot the sooner the better.

a reply to: Telos

Turkey must be desperate.

Putin signed today a series of measures with economic impact against turkey.

www.zougla.gr...

the article has the option to be translated, on top there is flags, pick yours.

ps: I also read an article stating that these measures, can impact turkey up to 1.4% of the annual growth of the whole Turkey.

originally posted by: voyger2
just a little memory exercise, from 30 october 2013.

The Daily Telegraph has learned:

”Every day there are Mujahideen coming here from all different nationalities,” said Abu Abdulrahman, a Jordanian volunteer managing the flow of foreign fighters. He handles a network of receiving centres in southern Turkey for volunteers wishing to join al-Qaeda’s branch in Syria, known as “the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant” (ISIL).

The Daily Telegraph

The Telegraph has some serious credibility problems if they are posing that IS is an Al Qaeda branch. They have an on-again, off-again relationship and are two separate entities. In fact, a couple days ago Al Nusra (branch of Al Qaeda) took out Abu Ali al-Baridi (the head of ISIS) and other ISIS leadership with a suicide bomber. Everyone hates everyone in the religion of peace...

originally posted by: arcnaver
I would totally trust RT news, especially when concerning questionable Russian political and UFO incidents. They'll never steer you wrong!
I'm nearly positive Russia did violate Turkish airspace. I'm also certain Turkey was being a bunch of idiots when they shot down their aircraft.
Neither the Russian's nor the Turks are innocent in this. They're both doing things they shouldn't be doing.

I think you're on to something here...

originally posted by: Savvyrascal
a reply to: Aliensun


I may be wrong, and also others might have already said this.... But isn't the reason behind NATO to back up the other member countries? What I mean is - if a country is seen to be wronging a member of NATO.... The rest of the 'Gang' can be called for help!?
If Turkey (being a part of NATO) calls foul about Russia 'picking' on them, and "Magically" produces evidence (doesn't require truth, just needs to be believable), then Nato can either tell any such Aggressor to back down or face sanctions, and or war. Anyone in Nato with an axe to grind against Russia, ya think? Apologies if that doesn't make as much sense as I though...

China will join Russia.

I've said it before and will say it again. My opinion is that there are no good guys in this lunacy, and that the whole region (and world) has lost its mind.

Opinion:

NATO wants Assad gone. ISIS is a convenient casus belli. Russia wants Assad to stay, or to have a say in his successor, because they want the port of Tartus. ISIS is a convenient casus belli. Turkey wants to weaken the Kurds. ISIS is a convenient casus belli. The Kurds are widely seen as the only effective ground force against ISIS, but Turkey and the Kurds can't get on the same page for reasons that are painfully obvious. Meanwhile NATO, Russia, Turkey, and the Kurds et al are all (ostensibly at least) at war with ISIS.

ISIS is selling oil to elements within Turkey, because governments are comprised of human beings, and human beings are corruptible and flawed. Is this being done with the outright blessing of the Turkish government as a whole? Probably not, but no one knows for certain. I tend to lean more toward there being multiple competing and contradictory internal interests within Turkey, as is the case in all governments, though.

This is a microcosm of the larger playing field, in which both Russia and the West benefit from and tacitly allow militant extremist/terrorist groups to persist - not necessarily by choice or as part of some grand scheme, but just because that's how the situation works in the region - by allowing them to benefit from their own oil sales, or the oil sales of their host states, who likewise allow their existence because they are useful tools occasionally and mopping them up would be politically disadvantageous. Thus these oil producing countries in the region, all of whom have their own competing internal interests both along political, and economic, and sectarian lines, also allow these groups to flourish tacitly - not because they like them, but because, again, this is the situation the region finds itself in, and the world has yet to rid itself of its fossil fuel dependency fully.

Meanwhile, any all out attempt to outright eradicate any individual group such as ISIS simply results in more and different fragmentation along sectarian and socioeconomic lines, and a whole new generation of disparate, competing groups emerges. It's a swirling, bubbling cauldron of chaotic, unpredictable, uncontrollable madness, with no good guys. In short, a massive, uncontrolled cluster function.

Russia are not gallant heroes trying to save the world from ISIS while the West sits by and allows it to flourish. The West is not intentionally creating ISIS (though they certainly are not above exploiting their emergence, and they are, indirectly, and imho not entirely by choice, economically and politically allowing them to persist to some degree) as part of some grand machination.

Things are not that simple. Quite the contrary. It's too easy to simply conclude things are this black and white. Too convenient. (And Russia has exploited this in terms of PR to great effect, just as they did in the case of Ukraine... people remember Ukraine, right? Things aren't as black and white as "evil fascists backed by NATO vs good guy Russia" there, either.)

And the longer this goes on, the more everyone loses their minds and states act ever more irrationally as the lack of control and calculable predictable statecraft prevents long term geopolitical strategy and instead gives rise to fear and reactionism. Both on the parts of heads of state, and states' populations in terms of unrest and fear. (Which in turn allows frightening things like the curtailing of civil liberties, or the election of populist tyrants, to become more probable.)

It's like watching a train wreck in slow motion. One with eery parallels to the world before WW2 and WW1 imho. I hope the pattern does not hold. I hope humanity finds its head, and cools it off promptly. I for one will not and cannot pick a side, other than the averting of this train wreck, if at all possible.

Again... just my opinion. As always, I could be wrong.

Peace.

a reply to: Savvyrascal

An interesting thing to bear in mind, is that Greece and Turkey are not kissing cousins, Russia has put a lot of money into Cyprus, and has friendly relations with Greece, Even after the E.U financial debacle. I don't think, N.A.T.O. Greece would back N.A.T.O Turkey in any war with Russia.

Why isn't that border closed yet?