Ancient river network discovered buried under Saharan sand

That reminds of the Electric Universe, Thunderbolts and Mars, videos. Instead of water this could have been what ended the water, some natural cosmic energetic disaster that dried up this region. I'm sure it was not always a desert.

odd double post.

originally posted by: Unity_99
That reminds of the Electric Universe, Thunderbolts and Mars, videos. Instead of water this could have been what ended the water, some natural cosmic energetic disaster that dried up this region. I'm sure it was not always a desert.

It's entirely due to the effect humans have. The one thing that all these people do is to pick up the dead forest wood off the forest floor. There was once an experiment done. Researchers fenced off section of desert about 100 square meters square. They also marked off several control areas of the same size. They left it for several years to see what would happen. The fenced off area collected seeds, pollen. When rain came, plants grew. Palm trees, weeds, flowers, everything. Eventually, a complete forest was beginning to grow. Meanwhile in the unfenced area, grazing animals ate all the flower. Any trees or saplings that were there, were cut own or eaten.

originally posted by: network dude

Are you talking about man made climate change, or just regular climate change? the two are vastly different.

Both, actually. The Sahara was not a single cause. Initially, it was global climate change but humans with overgrazing of domestic animals accelerated the desertification process.
en.wikipedia.org...

Interesting stuff. As someone posted before, I would like to see some artifacts from along the river system. I went to google maps and scanned over some Arizona dry places and found many areas that looked almost the same. Mostly likely made by flash floods and some mountain runoff, but not during a "green" time. I am not sure of the scale of what I was looking at compared to the picture in this post and I am no geologist.

Google Maps

If my math is correct, Egypt should/could have been around when the river was around.

You think Egypt would have stories about carbon causing a river to dry up. Like the aborigines have stores about the ocean level rising.

With the disappearance of a river system like this from thousands of years ago, we would have no written history to help us as we ponder our theories.I believe that recent human activities have only been affecting where the rains hit and what plants are currently surviving in a region. I recall reading years back that the massive Rain Forests that were cut back in South America changed where the rains fell. I don't think we have much of an affect on temperature, but i am certain we have had an affect on toxic chemicals in our waters.

More likely this was caused by what someone pointed out earlier on this thread. It seems a reasonable scenario based on the earthquake phenomenon that was observed tilting the earth in recent quakes. Perhaps also the periodic magnetic pole shifts that are observed have been more dramatic in historical significance than we think due to heavenly bodies passing close by or maybe even the natural effects created by the rare alignments of the planets.

a reply to: butcherguy

yea.. if we as ATS can come together and fund our own digs.. # i dont travel much but i think id be down to try and go to that.. i wanna check the usa deserts now.. this would be a great undisturbed dig site..great post

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
the Sahara was once green so a river running through it isn't surprising.
some where i've read about what they called the cattle cult in the Sahara, and other things that would seem to thrive better in a green wetter environment.

to explain this a little better here is a article that gives NASA reason as to why it dried up.

Most scientists believe the Sahara dried up due to a change in the Earth's orbit, which affects solar insolation, or the amount of electromagnetic energy the Earth receives from the Sun. Or to use simpler words, insolation refers to the amount of sunlight shining down on a particular area at a certain time. It depends on factors such as the geographic location, time of day, season, landscape and local weather.
What Changed The Green Sahara Into A Desert?

A change in orbit??

What could have caused THAT? The growing or shrinking of ice caps causing some displacement of weight? Or the end of the ice age meant that less sunlight was being reflected, and all that extra energy being absorbed by the earth caused a shift in some of the orbital parameters?

A change in orbit... that's not really a "local" phenomenon, now, is it? I wonder what other areas were drastically changed during this change in earth's orbit?

The enormous stones were transported using anti-gravitational techniques well known to these people. (They were carried on platforms, 20 centimetres above the paved roads, which were constructed using the same principals as those of the pyramids.) Roads such as these were built all over the country, converging, like a massive spiders web, on the capital, Savanasa.

The huge stones were taken to Savanasa and put into position according to directions from the master or chief architect on the project. When finished, the pyramid measured exactly 440.01 metres in height and its four faces were oriented precisely towards the four points of the compass.

Was this intended to be the Kings palace, or his tomb?

Nothing of the sort. This pyramid was much more important - it was a tool. An enormous tool, I admit, but a tool just the same. So, too, was the Pyramid of Cheops, in Egypt, though it was much smaller in size.

A tool? Please explain - I'm no longer with you.

one of the great mysteries was about to be revealed to me - one which had provoked so much inquiry and had been the subject of so much writing on Earth.

You will have realised, that these were highly advanced people. They possessed a profound understanding of Universal Law and used their pyramid as a captor of cosmic rays, forces and energies, as well as terrestrial energies.

Inside, rooms positioned according to a precise plan, served the King and certain other great initiates, as powerful communications centres, enabling communication with other planets and other worlds in the Universe. Such communication with extra-terrestrials is no longer possible for people on Earth; but the people of Mu in those days, by natural means and by exploiting cosmic forces, were in constant communication with other beings and were even able to explore parallel universes.

Was this the sole purpose of the pyramid?

Not quite. Its second use was to make rain. By a system of plates, made of a special alloy incorporating silver as its major component, these people were able, in a few days, to cause the accumulationof clouds above the country, and so, to have rain as they needed it.

Thus, they were able to create, virtually, a paradise over the whole continent. Rivers and springs never dried up, but flowed lazily across the numerous plains of a land that was essentially flat.

Fruit trees were laden with fruit, bowing under the weight of oranges, mandarins or apples, according to latitude. Exotic fruits, of kinds that actually no longer exist on Earth, were harvested in abundance. One such fruit, called the Laikoti, possessed a property that caused an excitation of brain activity, allowing whoever ate it to solve problems which would normally be beyond them. This property was not actually a drug but the fruit was, nevertheless, condemned by the sages. The Laikoti was only authorized to be planted in the gardens of the King. The striking similarity between this prohibition from eating the Laikoti - for reasons relating to knowledge - and, in the Bible, Adam being forbidden to eat the apple on similar grounds.

Man being what he is, however, the fruit was secretly planted in various places throughout the continent. Those caught with the fruit were harshly punished for they had directly disobeyed the King of Mu. In matters of religion and government, he was to be obeyed absolutely, as he was the representative of the Great Spirit.

From the above quote taken from the book the Thiaoouba Prophecy by Michel Desmaqruet, the satellite images are more circumstantial evidence that the book TP is true and correct about how the pyramids of Giza and the pyramids on the lost continents of Atlantis & Lemuria controlled the weather to make what we slightly remember through myth as the Garden of Eden.I also think there are some American satellites that prove that the ancient Nile once flowed not into the Mediteranian but into the Atlantic Ocean.

a reply to: tonycodes

Imagine finding some rare seeds or fossils that would be dope. If I won me some publishers clearinghouse I would be digging out there for sure in search of rare treasures to share with the world.

Check this out from nat geo on old seed stock.

news.nationalgeographic.com...

Who here wants to go dig and is obscenely wealthy? Count me in as a volunteer if so and all I ask as payment is lots of beer and beef.

Forests/ green = clouds and rain
without them = hot sun everyday,
especially if you are on the equator receiving tones of suns energy
with not enough rain and the desertification already begun, situation was doomed.

Have you ever imagined what our lands might look like in the future?
Are areas within 25-40 degrees from the equator the near future deserts?

originally posted by: 3n19m470

originally posted by: hounddoghowlie
the Sahara was once green so a river running through it isn't surprising.
some where i've read about what they called the cattle cult in the Sahara, and other things that would seem to thrive better in a green wetter environment.

to explain this a little better here is a article that gives NASA reason as to why it dried up.

Most scientists believe the Sahara dried up due to a change in the Earth's orbit, which affects solar insolation, or the amount of electromagnetic energy the Earth receives from the Sun. Or to use simpler words, insolation refers to the amount of sunlight shining down on a particular area at a certain time. It depends on factors such as the geographic location, time of day, season, landscape and local weather.
What Changed The Green Sahara Into A Desert?

A change in orbit??

What could have caused THAT? The growing or shrinking of ice caps causing some displacement of weight? Or the end of the ice age meant that less sunlight was being reflected, and all that extra energy being absorbed by the earth caused a shift in some of the orbital parameters?

A change in orbit... that's not really a "local" phenomenon, now, is it? I wonder what other areas were drastically changed during this change in earth's orbit?

Velikovsky had an idea that might have holes in it but is intriguing to think it has some plausibility and his theory would explain some things we see . A collision of planets in the solar system. Planets in different alignments than today. This offers an explanation for the anomalies we see in the various rotations of the planets.

en.wikipedia.org...

originally posted by: Sublimecraft
a reply to: SLAYER69

I can't help but agree with the author that this does indeed show how quickly the climate can change over a relatively short period of time in going from an apparent green, lush and humid environment (as seems to be suggested from this find) to one that is dry and arid.

and thanks for another fantastic contribution mate, as always

Brings to mind China's "Green Wall", an effort to stave off desertification. Three North Forest Shelter Program

Very intriguing article. I've always wondered what lies beneath the sands in that huge desert that is larger than the United States. We do know that ancient Carthage once thrived to the north of the Sahara, but the expanding desertification of the area had to have occurred thousands of years before their time. So any civilization that existed there is lost to us(for now).

It is mind blowing that we have technology orbiting the Earth that can take photos that show long dead rivers underneath the harsh sand.

originally posted by: 3n19m470
What could have caused THAT? The growing or shrinking of ice caps causing some displacement of weight?

I can't imagine, relatively speaking, a little bit of ice making much of a difference. If the earth were shrunk down to the size of a bowling ball, the earth would have a smoother surface.

My point being that I doubt the cyclical accumulation and melting of ice in the polar and high-altitude regions of the earth would cause much of a disturbance in the orbit of the earth.

Of course, I could actually be quite wrong--even a slight disturbance over tens of thousands of years can have an overall drastic effect in the end--but I don't think that there is much evidence to support your theoretical question.

It's funny how this thread has become one about climate change...

a reply to: 3n19m470

just guessing but i would think that a shift in tectonic plates, massive earth quakes or some other geologic event.
hard to say, it may as you've said been the ice caps.

fact is we know the earth moves and that quakes can move the plates, think chili quake about if i remember correct about 15 20 years ago, and the one in japan just recently in geologic time. who's to say that one bigger hasn't caused a shift or the normal movement of the plates.

ETA: and yes i agree that that's not just a local phenomenon and dare say that other changes have happened. just like i say that the chili and japan quake changed the orbit not so much as to alter perception, but just enough to alter the length of time the sun shines in certain places.

of course some people call me nuts because i look at things with common sense and know that a shift in the crust or movement can't happen without effecting something else no matter how small.

originally posted by: 3n19m470

A change in orbit??

What could have caused THAT? The growing or shrinking of ice caps causing some displacement of weight? Or the end of the ice age meant that less sunlight was being reflected, and all that extra energy being absorbed by the earth caused a shift in some of the orbital parameters?

A change in orbit... that's not really a "local" phenomenon, now, is it? I wonder what other areas were drastically changed during this change in earth's orbit?

This is the Milankovitch Cycle and is perfectly natural.

Milutin Milankovitch

Wobbles in the axis (comet strikes / major earthquakes, etc) should not be confused with changes in the orbital cycle - they are 2 very different beasts.

a reply to: SLAYER69

Brilliant. This looks prime territory for Sarah Parcak - if she is still interested now she has won (and quite rightly) the TED award for 2015. The problem with this though may be the depth of the dunes - for example, in parts of Libya the Saharan dunes can reach over 500ft. I highly doubt her techniques would work with such depths. Parts of Western Sahara must be equally deep. Plus the really annoying point that several of the countries are no go areas for westerners.....

Although this is further West, we already know there were several major lakes in the Sahara region and that Lake Chad was once much larger. Cave paintings depict hippo's playing in watering holes, etc. So, water, greenery and animals......and the presence of humans. There has to be something buried there.........

a reply to: Flavian

to be fair the article i posted did call it a change in the earth's orbit.

from my first post.

Climate scientist Gavin Schmidt, of NASA's Goddard Institute for Space Studies, explained that around 8,000 years ago, the Earth's orbit was slightly different to how it is today. The tilt changed from around 24.1 degrees to the present-day 23.5 degrees. "Additionally, the Earth had its closest approach to the Sun in the northern hemisphere (with) summer in August," Schmidt said. "Today, that closest approach is in January. So, summertime in the north was warmer back then than it is now." The changes in the Earth's orbital tilt and precession (or the wobbling motion) occur because of gravitational forces emanating from other bodies in the solar system.