What this woman says sends a chill down my bone

a reply to: Wookiep

Fine, let's talk about the bigger picture. You honestly think I'm in favor of Muslim Rule??? Are you nuts??? I don't give a rats ass about Muslims or their stupid religion or what they think of me and my lack of Religion. Some Muslim tries to get me to go to Allah he better be ready to defend himself. The same goes for any and all other devoted slaves of Religion. I'm the last guy you want to preach to or try and convert.

Watching that video makes me dislike her as much as whoever the Jewish guy was that started complaining about his holidays not being included too. I'd tell them both to shut up and sit down and get over it because WE DON'T DO RELIGION HERE. If they don't like it then they can go back to Israel or Iraq or wherever they want to.

But the way it is now. The way we favor a Religion unofficially yet say we don't. It makes us hypocrites to stand up to them.

a reply to: mOjOm

well you keep asking if i'm ready for a secular nation. We already live in a secular nation. So I thought you meant the fear of a sectarian nation, which then I attempted to correct you. No biggie moving forward...

a reply to: FlySolo

We say we live in a secular nation. Just like we say we're the land of the Free. Meanwhile we have cameras watching everything we do and every communication monitored and on the verge of being chipped and tracked like cattle.

Look what's been happening lately. Religious Freedom allowing county clerks to just say "F*ck You" to the law and Supreme Court. With a presidential hopeful backing her up and praising her for defying the law. Judges doing the same. People all over the place saying "Ya, screw the law and screw EQUAL RIGHTS. That's BS, MY GOD SAYS I CAN DO WHAT I THINK IS RIGHT."

That's not Secular. That's Religion.

We say a lot of things as a nation but you have to look beyond what we say and look at what we do. We also say that our Giant military is for Defense yet we have military bases in over 150 countries some of which we are currently occupying in the name of Peace and Freedom. You think if someone was occupying us in the name of freedom we'd feel more free or less???

I do agree we aren't a Theocracy. But we aren't Secular either. A secular country wouldn't lose it's sh*t over the idea of an Atheist President. Something that you won't see here for a long time. Not openly anyway.

Welcome to the truth of the Islamic infiltration agenda. They have been saying this for a while now.

Yes it is frightening and this is only the beginning.

a reply to: mOjOm

In your perfect world, there would be no religion. I get that. I GET that you wish it played no part in American politics etc. But it DOES, and Christianity is the DOMINANT religion in America whether you like it, libs like it, atheists like it etc or not! Right now, that's REALITY.

We can sit here and argue about whether or not America was founded on Christian values ALL DAY, but one thing we KNOW is that America was NOT founded on Muslim beliefs! Fine, you want secular, great! Most libs are tired of Christians and want everyone else to acknowledge that, but they sure as hell dont really seem to care much about other religions, which tells me that yeah, maybe there ARE a lot of Christians here, and there always HAS been. I mean, if this nation was founded by athiests, then surely, we would have a majority of atheists here??

Ugh..... I really hate these kinds of convos, due to this very reason. However, fine give the lady her holiday. Let's wait for the next demand, then the next. I understand that you want total secularism, but that just isn't reality. I wish you luck on that tho, you are really a minority in the grand scheme.

originally posted by: markosity1973
Welcome to the truth of the Islamic infiltration agenda. They have been saying this for a while now.

Yes it is frightening and this is only the beginning.

If everyone would stop catering to the Religious fanatics it won't. But the more we keep giving into Religious Freedoms so they can sidestep the laws and want to be special this will keep happening.

If we just put an end to all of it across the board and tell them to go back to their temples or masques or whatever and do all the God worship stuff there and not in Gov. or official public areas, then it's all good. But if you start giving in to one then your going to have all of them taking more and more.

Here the arabs laugh at our idealisation of democracy- because what it means is that whatever group procreates the fastest and the most abundantly will gain the power. While the white population is limiting their births, waiting until they have had career success, the arabs are practicing polygamy and procreating at a faster rate.

In the public sector, the muslim employees not only get paid vacation on the national holidays, they also get them for the muslim holidays and Ramadan. In some cities, like Marseille, the school meals are already restricted to being hallal - for everyone. I watch with curiosity to see if the US will be able to respond to this take over in a different way.

originally posted by: Wookiep

Ugh..... I really hate these kinds of convos, due to this very reason. However, fine give the lady her holiday. Let's wait for the next demand, then the next. I understand that you want total secularism, but that just isn't reality. I wish you luck on that tho, you are really a minority in the grand scheme.

No, don't give her a holiday. That's the opposite of what you do. You don't give in to her. You tell them NO! Tell them HELL NO!!

The reason it seems like I'm hard on Christians is because I'm twisting this around a bit. The reason I'm not worried about Muslims as a priority is because they are not even close to being a majority here at all. Are you serious. The first time a Muslim group really starts some sh*t here they'll be erased before you hear a peep out of them. People here are just waiting for such a thing to happen. This nation is Dominated by Christians and Atheists (in various forms.) It will be a long time till Muslims get a hold of this place.

However, there is no chance of getting a hold if you ensure Secular Rule. That doesn't mean you get rid of Religion. We have Religious Freedom. That's what people get confused. Let me explain.

True, I don't really like religion or promote it. But I don't want to remove it. I want everyone to be free to worship how they want. Just keep it out of Gov. that's all.

I'm not trying to destroy Religion, I just want it kept out of Law and Gov. and Secular Society because when it gets in there things are no longer Fair or Equal for everyone. When they get in there it favors a certain group. Do you see the difference?

originally posted by: Bluesma
Here the arabs laugh at our idealisation of democracy- because what it means is that whatever group procreates the fastest and the most abundantly will gain the power. While the white population is limiting their births, waiting until they have had career success, the arabs are practicing polygamy and procreating at a faster rate.

In the public sector, the muslim employees not only get paid vacation on the national holidays, they also get them for the muslim holidays and Ramadan. In some cities, like Marseille, the school meals are already restricted to being hallal - for everyone. I watch with curiosity to see if the US will be able to respond to this take over in a different way.

Here's an idea. STOP CATERING TO THEIR RELIGIOUS WAYS THEN. If they want a holiday let them take it off. If they want special food let them bring it. Same with kosher meals Catholic blood drinking or whatever too.

Stop catering to all of it.

Let them do it on their own. But no official catering to it.

a reply to: mOjOm

I get where there should be separation of church and state. I have from the very start of this "debate". I get the reasons why. I've stated that. Now, I'm just unsure of why we have come back to that? I have stated my own personal thoughts regarding the OP, I would hope that you understood my stance on it, as I have done my best in explaining my stance on it.

Thanks for the discussion!

originally posted by: Wookiep

I think we both have the same stance. I'm just trying to make that clear because it didn't seem that way at first.

If you're for keeping Religion from taking over be it Muslim or any other then we're on the same page.

If you're for scaling up Christian Populous and Christian Rule because you're afraid of Muslim Rule then we aren't. Because that leads to a Holy War and you can see how well those work out for everyone.

a reply to: mOjOm

I do think you hit it on the head. This idea that you can impose your religious ideas on others is disgusting to people who see religion as nonsensical.

Its the emotional blackmail of the 'young girls tears, the Jewish holidays not being observed that is actually their own business and shouldn't be inflicted on others. Its only the religious lobby who think their beliefs take priority it would be very interesting to see just what percentage they actually represent within the community as a whole - we live in a democracy supposedly.

However I would make the point that there are a lot of religious people who believe in very large families, because they recognise the value of outbreeding everyone else which will give them ultimately more votes and power. If you look at the refugee camps where people have been living for a number of years, they have carried on having kids despite the inhospitable and appalling conditions and also the fact they personally can't provide for them - it seems irresponsible in many ways IMHO. I have always been conscious that its my responsibility to provide for my family and have kept it to a number I could provide for.

a reply to: mOjOm

I agree with you , but here we are and this keeps happening.

It's not just a problem in the USA by the way. Here in Australia where the government in a lot more secular, they are still pushing their luck.

You should see some of the outrage over the building of new mosques that is occurring.

In fact here is one such story

a reply to: mOjOm

Here's an idea. STOP CATERING TO THEIR RELIGIOUS WAYS THEN. If they want a holiday let them take it off. If they want special food let them bring it. Same with kosher meals Catholic blood drinking or whatever too.

Stop catering to all of it.

Let them do it on their own. But no official catering to it.

I happen to agree very strongly with this. The whole point of the school systems having "winter break" rather than christmas and other religious holidays is that it gives everyone time with their families during their religious gatherings and rituals without giving special treatment to anyone. And that is the way it should be, regardless of what religion a person happens to be. And they already accommodate people regarding "off-season" religious holidays by the very solution that they stated in the video, that they can have their days off and they will not be penalized for it.

When my daughter was going to school, I always packed her lunch because the swill they served was not up to my standards for what I wanted my child to ingest. Yes, it was a pain in the ass, but it would have been silly for me to insist that special items be provided simply because I did not like what they were offering in the cafeteria. If people don't like what is being served, then they need to bring their meals with them.

The demands that they were making were unreasonable in my opinion due to A) the short notice and B) the fact that no one else gets special designated religious holidays either...even the christians. And it needs to stay that way, because the bickering and childish scorekeeping regarding religious issues is ridiculous and detracts from the reason we send our children to school in the first place.

And how do you handle a spoiled, bratty child who demands special treatment? You tell them, too bad. Period. And if you have more than one spoiled, bratty child, you tell all of them, too bad. Period. Giving in to things like that is only going to invite more and more unreasonable demands.

originally posted by: markosity1973

I agree with you , but here we are and this keeps happening.

It's not just a problem in the USA by the way. Here in Australia where the government in a lot more secular, they are still pushing their luck.

You should see some of the outrage over the building of new mosques that is occurring.

Maybe we can just out smart them. We can put them all on one continent and let them have their holy wars all they want. But we take all the boats and planes away so they're stuck there and we just wait it out. When they're all done and sick of war we gradually ease them back into society and let them know that while they've been killing each other we've made some changes. They can have their religion but they have to keep it to themselves as far as Society goes. Or it's back to the Holy War Island.

a reply to: tigertatzen

Exactly!!

Everyone our new President, Tigertatzen!!

I liked that part about Winter Break too. We all share Winter. Nobody's special. Nobody owns winter. We all get it the same way. Winter Break. Call it whatever you want at your house or your church. Name it after whatever God or Magic Monster you desire. But in Society that we share, we call it Winter Break and we all get the same time off to do as we please.

a reply to: mOjOm

I'm not for or against "scaling up Christian populous" because that's not something you or I have control over. What I am against, are these new anti-Christian sentiments being brought on by liberal media, while propping up Muslims.

Perceptions are being drawn up abroad showing some make-believe Muslim ideology where Islam is "peaceful" when current events EVERYWHERE prove that it clearly ISN'T, yet leftist buy it and still, blame everything in the world on Christians.

I just find it weird how whenever a Muslim community infiltrates a country, region, city, etc... we get all this "liberal" crap about how they are just victims in a world they had no choice in being a part of, even tho they are totally cool with beheading people, stoning women who don't wear burkas etc...

Yet, somehow, modern day "Christians" are somehow to blame, even in the USA. Ask a "liberal" in the U.S. We don't see anywhere near that kinda # from Christians here, yet, libs HATE them here, with no regrets! But Muslims?? Just by seeing these recent un-describable acts over the last 10 years?... I can kinda see why the "horrible" crusades happened in the first place.

What a cluster #! For some crazy reason, American liberals have no comment on that. I find that to be completely unacceptable, pretty much crime-worthy as a matter of fact.

originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: Bluesma
Here the arabs laugh at our idealisation of democracy- because what it means is that whatever group procreates the fastest and the most abundantly will gain the power. While the white population is limiting their births, waiting until they have had career success, the arabs are practicing polygamy and procreating at a faster rate.

In the public sector, the muslim employees not only get paid vacation on the national holidays, they also get them for the muslim holidays and Ramadan. In some cities, like Marseille, the school meals are already restricted to being hallal - for everyone. I watch with curiosity to see if the US will be able to respond to this take over in a different way.

Here's an idea. STOP CATERING TO THEIR RELIGIOUS WAYS THEN. If they want a holiday let them take it off. If they want special food let them bring it. Same with kosher meals Catholic blood drinking or whatever too.

Stop catering to all of it.

Let them do it on their own. But no official catering to it.

Yeah that sounds good. Laicism is what the french claim to embrace. Except you get the problem of democracy- when the numbers of them are larger, they simply vote to have things go their way. The public sector is paid for by the state, the tax payers- they are paying the paid holidays and the meals. The parents were fine with voting out certain dietary offerings in school lunches (there's no crap food- no pizza or hotdogs) they retained that right to have a say.
That was all well and good, until the Muslim parents became the majority.

They were fine with Christmas being a national (paid) holiday because Christians were the majority, and so instilled in the culture that many even forgot it was a Christian holiday.

Like with the veil thing, they had to also outlaw wearing crosses on jewelry in common public areas as well. Strict application of secularism becomes a bit complicated when you have to suddenly face your own hypocrisy you had become blind to.

As long as the students get Christmas, and Easter off, then you're obligated to do the same for other religions. This makes everyone stop and go um... wait.

When they become a majority vote, it becomes more complicated than one assumes at first glance. Especially in a democracy.

a reply to: mOjOm

a reply to: tigertatzen

Exactly!!

Everyone our new President, Tigertatzen!!

I liked that part about Winter Break too. We all share Winter. Nobody's special. Nobody owns winter. We all get it the same way. Winter Break. Call it whatever you want at your house or your church. Name it after whatever God or Magic Monster you desire. But in Society that we share, we call it Winter Break and we all get the same time off to do as we please.

Hahahahaaa...I wouldn't last five seconds as President...I'm too mouthy. Plus I'd rather die than be required to wear a suit. I'm a jeans and tshirt kinda chick.

I remember the bitch-fest that went on when NEISD converted to Winter Break...and I'll give you three guesses as to which religious group was leading the pack. They were literally talking about picketing. I rolled my eyes so hard I checked out my own ass...grown adults whining and bickering because their specialness was being replaced by fairness and equality. What a world we live in...

a reply to: Wookiep

That's because not all Muslims like the chopping off of heads and sharia law either. That's why some of them are trying to escape it too. All of that stuff get's skewed in the media too.

One side wants you to fear the Muslims while the other wants you to help them. The truth is I'm all for helping those who need help and I'm all for eliminating those who want to eliminate me.

The tricky part is figuring out who's who. Because when you confuse the two you start making enemies out of friends.

Just recently I read an article about how the US droned a damn hospital that was part of Doctors without Borders. What a mess. They are still working out the detail but apparently in our fighting the bad guys we droned the helpless innocent ones who should be our friends but now probably are justifiably pissed off because some of them are dead now.

So I know what you mean. It sucks and we need to certainly watch our backs but while we're doing that we need to make sure we keep looking where we're going too so we don't stab the guy in front of us in the back while we are watching our ass.