It's hard to argue against the fact we live in a THEOPHOBIC culture.

a reply to: grandmakdw

TAKE A CHILL PILL AND STEP AWAY FROM THE COMPUTER!!!!

So that justifies lining Christians up
and shooting them in the head

What the hell are you on about? Did you read the OP? Was my post in response to your normal ramblings we put up with on these kinds of debates?

I am seeing the true colors of all of you here
who are Christophobic and Theophobic.

Stop acting like you're being persecuted, its getting a tad boring!!

Well people have gotten your message
and are starting to do something about
those awful religious people. You are winning.
Are you proud?

What message would that be? You know what, don't bother responding to that rhetorical question.

You know something Grandma, at times you are brilliant in your posts and then there are times like this that you act like a Banshee!!

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: grandmakdw

Not heard anyone say all religious people are evil. Not once.
Deluded but not evil.
But religion can sure make good people do bad things.
This thread is going to be full of chtistians claiming percicution isn't it?.
Ahhh poor deluded sheep.

Of course it is. This whole thread was started with the premise of adopting the Christian persecution complex that everyone who isn't a Christian finds so tedious. So of course we'll see a bunch of x-tians whining that they are persecuted even though they are among one of the least persecuted groups of Christians (heck not just Christian, religious in general) in the world.

Um, shooting people dead who say they are Christians.

In your book that is not persecution.

Ok................?
So you think people can line up people,
ask if they are Christian,
shoot them dead if they are,
and that is not persecution?
Ok.............

Then by extension of YOUR logic, I am using YOUR logic here,
atheism and saying the world would be better off
without religious people and religion can sure make people do bad things.

Wow, your thought process really shows where the world is today.

It is ok to shoot people dead for being a Christian, that is not persecution.
Just WOW.

What is this? Where did I ever say that the recent mass shooting event wasn't Christian persecution? Heck, when did I even start talking about the shooting? Another question, when did I say that Christian persecution doesn't exist in this country?

Oh wait, it's just another one of your awful strawmans that you make about other posters' posts.

I believe you said that Christian persecution does not exist multiple times on ATS. you regularly make fun of people who think there is such a thing as Christian persecution. Just look at what you have written in this thread alone.

I believe you are wrong. I've NEVER said that Christian persecution doesn't exist. I've said many times that Christians in this country like to blow it out of proportion and that it isn't as bad as they pretend it is though.

You are deflecting and not looking at the real picture

Says the person who can't read someone else's post honestly and without interjecting her own version of how the post went.

This is a clear example of Christian persecution.
This is a clear example of what anti-Christian rhetoric leads directly to.

This thread is about the ENTIRE country being Theophobic, not about ONE instance of Christian persecution. ONE instance of persecution DOES NOT a trend make. Sorry, that isn't how it works. Try again. This time without an anecdote.

Lining people up and shooting them for being Christian
that is whining about being persecuted I suppose

AGAIN, YOU brought up that shooting. -I- never mentioned it in my post. Stop putting words in my mouth, it is VERY disrespectful.

Just yesterday having people shot ISIS style for being Christian
in the US certainly makes Christians one of the least persecuted Groups in the world.
Oh wait, ISIS is killing every Christian they come across, forget them, that's half a world away.
We are just overreacting, huh.

ONE event is an anecdote. Anecdotes can't be used as evidence of larger trends. That is a logical fallacy.

Also, this thread is about AMERICAN Christian persecution. Not Middle Eastern Christian persecution. So your point about ISIS executing people is a red herring. Not to mention ISIS executes and persecutes EVERYONE who doesn't' believe exactly as they do; Christians aren't special in that regard.

originally posted by: Prezbo369

originally posted by: grandmakdwYou know the only way to do that is
to eliminate all religious people.

Unsurprisingly, you're the only person that has said this.....

I said it because that is exactly what anti-religous rhetoric is directly responsible for
and has quite clearly led to.

You are just feeling guilty that the anti-Christian rants
on ATS and other sites may have
contributed in some small way to this evil act,
by being the catalyst for the actions of this
person.

a reply to: flammadraco

Grand is loving it he is using what happened to attempt to show us that christians are the most percicuted people ever.
Never mind christians have percicuted millions in the past and still attempt to do so.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: grandmakdw

Not heard anyone say all religious people are evil. Not once.
Deluded but not evil.
But religion can sure make good people do bad things.
This thread is going to be full of chtistians claiming percicution isn't it?.
Ahhh poor deluded sheep.

Of course it is. This whole thread was started with the premise of adopting the Christian persecution complex that everyone who isn't a Christian finds so tedious. So of course we'll see a bunch of x-tians whining that they are persecuted even though they are among one of the least persecuted groups of Christians (heck not just Christian, religious in general) in the world.

Um, shooting people dead who say they are Christians.

In your book that is not persecution.

Ok................?
So you think people can line up people,
ask if they are Christian,
shoot them dead if they are,
and that is not persecution?
Ok.............

Then by extension of YOUR logic, I am using YOUR logic here,
atheism and saying the world would be better off
without religious people and religion can sure make people do bad things.

Wow, your thought process really shows where the world is today.

It is ok to shoot people dead for being a Christian, that is not persecution.
Just WOW.

What is this? Where did I ever say that the recent mass shooting event wasn't Christian persecution? Heck, when did I even start talking about the shooting? Another question, when did I say that Christian persecution doesn't exist in this country?

Oh wait, it's just another one of your awful strawmans that you make about other posters' posts.

I believe you said that Christian persecution does not exist multiple times on ATS. you regularly make fun of people who think there is such a thing as Christian persecution. Just look at what you have written in this thread alone.

I believe you are wrong. I've NEVER said that Christian persecution doesn't exist. I've said many times that Christians in this country like to blow it out of proportion and that it isn't as bad as they pretend it is though.

You are deflecting and not looking at the real picture

Says the person who can't read someone else's post honestly and without interjecting her own version of how the post went.

This is a clear example of Christian persecution.
This is a clear example of what anti-Christian rhetoric leads directly to.

This thread is about the ENTIRE country being Theophobic, not about ONE instance of Christian persecution. ONE instance of persecution DOES NOT a trend make. Sorry, that isn't how it works. Try again. This time without an anecdote.

This thread is directly about Christian persecution.
This is a recent and clear example.
It is quite relevant and pertinent to the thread.

I see that you refuse to see that
the kind of anti-religious rants seen
daily on ATS and other sites
have led directly to thinking like the
one seen in the shooter.
That this kind of hatred spewed daily
against religious people can lead
to people taking action against religious
people.

This is a quite clear and relevant example of
what the OP is discussion.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Strawmans hyperbole putting words into peoples mouths.

originally posted by: grandmakdw
This thread is directly about Christian persecution.
This is a recent and clear example.
It is quite relevant and pertinent to the thread.

I didn't say it wasn't, but -I- was never talking about it. You brought it up and started filling in my side of the debate on it for me without me even mentioning it.

I see that you refuse to see that
the kind of anti-religious rants seen
daily on ATS and other sites
have led directly to thinking like the
one seen in the shooter.
That this kind of hatred spewed daily
against religious people can lead
to people taking action against religious
people.

This is a quite clear and relevant example of
what the OP is discussion.

All it is, is evidence that Christian persecution exists. It ISN'T evidence that the country is theophobic like the OP is claiming.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: flammadraco

Grand is loving it he is using what happened to attempt to show us that christians are the most percicuted people ever.
Never mind christians have percicuted millions in the past and still attempt to do so.

No, I am using this to show you that
the rhetoric that is loved so dearly on ATS,
that religion must be destroyed

and this anti-Christian rhetoric
led directly and clearly
to the shooting.

You all can try and avoid the
obvious if you want and claim
that persecution is all in our minds;
but you are deluding yourselves to
what this kind of barrage of
anti-religious and anti-Christian
has done to the psyche of the radical
atheist - it has prompted them to
kill religious people simply for
being religious.

And this daily barrage of
hateful rhetoric is as evil
and as bad as you all claim
the religious to be.
This shooting proves it.

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: grandmakdw

Not heard anyone say all religious people are evil. Not once.
Deluded but not evil.
But religion can sure make good people do bad things.
This thread is going to be full of chtistians claiming percicution isn't it?.
Ahhh poor deluded sheep.

Of course it is. This whole thread was started with the premise of adopting the Christian persecution complex that everyone who isn't a Christian finds so tedious. So of course we'll see a bunch of x-tians whining that they are persecuted even though they are among one of the least persecuted groups of Christians (heck not just Christian, religious in general) in the world.

Um, shooting people dead who say they are Christians.

In your book that is not persecution.

Ok................?
So you think people can line up people,
ask if they are Christian,
shoot them dead if they are,
and that is not persecution?
Ok.............

Then by extension of YOUR logic, I am using YOUR logic here,
atheism and saying the world would be better off
without religious people and religion can sure make people do bad things.

Wow, your thought process really shows where the world is today.

It is ok to shoot people dead for being a Christian, that is not persecution.
Just WOW.

What is this? Where did I ever say that the recent mass shooting event wasn't Christian persecution? Heck, when did I even start talking about the shooting? Another question, when did I say that Christian persecution doesn't exist in this country?

Oh wait, it's just another one of your awful strawmans that you make about other posters' posts.

I believe you said that Christian persecution does not exist multiple times on ATS. you regularly make fun of people who think there is such a thing as Christian persecution. Just look at what you have written in this thread alone.

I believe you are wrong. I've NEVER said that Christian persecution doesn't exist. I've said many times that Christians in this country like to blow it out of proportion and that it isn't as bad as they pretend it is though.

You are deflecting and not looking at the real picture

Says the person who can't read someone else's post honestly and without interjecting her own version of how the post went.

This is a clear example of Christian persecution.
This is a clear example of what anti-Christian rhetoric leads directly to.

This thread is about the ENTIRE country being Theophobic, not about ONE instance of Christian persecution. ONE instance of persecution DOES NOT a trend make. Sorry, that isn't how it works. Try again. This time without an anecdote.

This thread is directly about Christian persecution.
This is a recent and clear example.
It is quite relevant and pertinent to the thread.

I see that you refuse to see that
the kind of anti-religious rants seen
daily on ATS and other sites
have led directly to thinking like the
one seen in the shooter.
That this kind of hatred spewed daily
against religious people can lead
to people taking action against religious
people.

This is a quite clear and relevant example of
what the OP is discussion.

I'm much more afraid of the world you would have us live in than the secular nontheocracy. Therefore I guess I am Theophobic.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw
This thread is directly about Christian persecution.
This is a recent and clear example.
It is quite relevant and pertinent to the thread.

I didn't say it wasn't, but -I- was never talking about it. You brought it up and started filling in my side of the debate on it for me without me even mentioning it.

I see that you refuse to see that
the kind of anti-religious rants seen
daily on ATS and other sites
have led directly to thinking like the
one seen in the shooter.
That this kind of hatred spewed daily
against religious people can lead
to people taking action against religious
people.

This is a quite clear and relevant example of
what the OP is discussion.

All it is, is evidence that Christian persecution exists. It ISN'T evidence that the country is theophobic like the OP is claiming.

It is evidence of the acceptance of theophobia
as being a good thing.

It is evidence of the acceptance of calling
Christianity evil and calling for it's destruction
as being a good thing
in our society.

It is evidence that the real persecution
has begun
fueled by the constant barrage of hate filled
"religion is the root of all evils in the world"
rhetoric that is seen daily on ATS
and other sites.

You all have actually won,
where is your victory dance?

The world has clearly seen through this shooting,
that religion must be eliminated.
Dance and rejoice at what you all have accomplished.
Christians have been eliminated for holding their
viewpoints that differ from yours, YEA.

(yes I am exaggerating, but you get my point,

everyone who has called for the total annihilation
of religion from the world, is directly responsible
for this tragedy.)

I know you won't believe it: but I've got to run;
life to live things to do: so go ahead and have
a field day absolving yourselves of your
collective guilt by saying bad things about me
and avoiding the truth
- and rejoice - Christians are dead,
happy day, the theophobes and christphobes
have won big time on this shooting.

originally posted by: flammadraco

originally posted by: DBCowboy

originally posted by: flammadraco

originally posted by: DBCowboy
a reply to: nwtrucker

We're seeing a cultural shift from respecting personally held beliefs to being offended by people who hold personally held beliefs.

Thats because people who hold personal beliefs offend everyone else who do not have the same belief as them, I give you Kim Davies and exhibit A, Westboro Church as exhibit B and ISIS and exhibit C.

Of course! And being offended justifies all sorts of responses! From banning, silencing, vilifying anyone who "may" offend someone at some future date and time.

And every example you have given is exactly what Religion has done to society for over two millennium.

So quid pro quo? Religion has done some pretty crappy things throughout the ages. That justifies being crappy in return? I'm not very religious, but even I think that stinks.

a reply to: grandmakdw

So we can blame you directly when isis throws a gay person from a rooftop?.

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: grandmakdw
This thread is directly about Christian persecution.
This is a recent and clear example.
It is quite relevant and pertinent to the thread.

I didn't say it wasn't, but -I- was never talking about it. You brought it up and started filling in my side of the debate on it for me without me even mentioning it.

I see that you refuse to see that
the kind of anti-religious rants seen
daily on ATS and other sites
have led directly to thinking like the
one seen in the shooter.
That this kind of hatred spewed daily
against religious people can lead
to people taking action against religious
people.

This is a quite clear and relevant example of
what the OP is discussion.

All it is, is evidence that Christian persecution exists. It ISN'T evidence that the country is theophobic like the OP is claiming.

It is evidence of the acceptance of theophobia
as being a good thing.

No... I haven't seen a SINGLE person agree that what that man did was the right course of action or defended him.

It is eveidence of the acceptance of calling
Christianity evil and calling for it's destruction
as being a good thing
in our society.

It is evidence that the real persecution
has begun
feuled by the constant barrage of hate filled
"religion is the root of all evils in the world"
rehtoric that is seen daily on ATS
and other sites.

Slippery Slope Fallacy. Again, this is just ONE event. You act like we are on the cusp of a big religious war or something.

You all have actually won,
where is your victory dance?

Victory dance? Could you be anymore hyperbolic?

The world has clearly seen through this shooting,
that religion must be eliminated.
Dance and rejoice at what you all have accomplished.
Christians have been eliminated for holding their
viewpoints that differ from yours, YEA.

(yes I am exaggerating, but you get my point,

everyone who has called for the total annihilation
of religion from the world, is directly responsible
for this tragedy.)

*eyeroll* Get over yourself.

I know you won't believe it: but I've got to run;
life to live things to do: so go ahead and have
a field day absolving yourselves of your
collective guilt by saying bad things about me
and avoiding the truth
- and rejoice - Christians are dead,
happy day, the theophobes and christphobes
have won big time on this shooting.

Psh. The only reason I don't like you is because you are one of the most dishonest posters I've come across on ATS. I could care less about your religious beliefs. It just upsets me that you freely and without shame distort my words and create strawmans out of everything I say.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Whose being Crappy to religious folks in the US? I've not seen ISIS lining American Christians up along Florida's beach and beheading them? Ive not seen religious folks in the US being refused services due to their belief system, I've not seen religious folks being refused Marriage licences by non believers. What I have seen is those religious folk declaring they are being persecuted as the rest of society is waking up and not tolerating the fact that the religious right in the states does not have a right to impose their religious beliefs onto the rest of society.

The religious right in the states is akin to ISIS in the Middle East minus the killings but you have the KKK that takes care of that side of things. The worst elements of Christianity are a dominant force in American politics, and a deadly one that threatens the future of the world. This is because the conservative strains of the leading religions are utterly nihilistic and positively seek the world’s destruction and so far from the teachings of Christ, that it's laughable.

That all being said, the religious right are now reaping what they have sowed and now they are throwing a divine hissy-fit. For any Christian ATS member in the states saying they are being persecuted, go to the Middle East and find out exactly what that means!!

originally posted by: flammadraco
a reply to: DBCowboy

Whose being Crappy to religious folks in the US? I've not seen ISIS lining American Christians up along Florida's beach and beheading them? Ive not seen religious folks in the US being refused services due to their belief system, I've not seen religious folks being refused Marriage licences by non believers. What I have seen is those religious folk declaring they are being persecuted as the rest of society is waking up and not tolerating the fact that the religious right in the states does not have a right to impose their religious beliefs onto the rest of society.

Religious folks don't have that right.

The religious right in the states is akin to ISIS in the Middle East minus the killings but you have the KKK that takes care of that side of things. The worst elements of Christianity are a dominant force in American politics, and a deadly one that threatens the future of the world. This is because the conservative strains of the leading religions are utterly nihilistic and positively seek the world’s destruction and so far from the teachings of Christ, that it's laughable.

That seems extreme. I guess you're anti-Christian, anti-Christ?

That all being said, the religious right are now reaping what they have sowed and now they are throwing a divine hissy-fit. For any Christian ATS member in the states saying they are being persecuted, go to the Middle East and find out exactly what that means!!

I try to treat everyone the same. Gay, Christian, gay-Christian, jewish, muslim, black, white. Don't really care who or what they pray to. It's none of my business.

I don't judge people based on who or what they pray to.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Religious folks don't have that right.

You know that and I know that, tell them that!!

That seems extreme. I guess you're anti-Christian, anti-Christ?

No I'm a Deist, not anti anything other than anti bigotry and using man made religion as the reasoning behind being a bigot!

I try to treat everyone the same. Gay, Christian, gay-Christian, jewish, muslim, black, white. Don't really care who or what they pray to. It's none of my business.

I don't judge people based on who or what they pray to.

Shame your fellow ATS members don't take a leaf out of your book then!!

a reply to: flammadraco

According to your signature, you do judge people based on who or what they pray to. Everyone has their own issues I guess.

originally posted by: grandmakdw

I said it because that is exactly what anti-religous rhetoric is directly responsible for
and has quite clearly led to.

No this is just what you wish were true...

You are just feeling guilty that the anti-Christian rants
on ATS and other sites may have
contributed in some small way to this evil act,
by being the catalyst for the actions of this
person.

So by your 'logic' did you then feel guilty when the Charleston shooter shot all those black folk due to the racist posts you've made here on ATS?....

And the Umpqua College shooter shot a lot of people not just christians...

a reply to: nwtrucker

Actually it a rather easy task to argue against. There is no fear of religion. It is an understanding that beliefs are inferior to facts and that is not fear that is logic.

As a matter of FACT all religions use fear to control the minds of people and huddle together in FEAR of what their imagined God might do.

The FACT that religions are quite happy to destroy anyone that does not share their same system of beliefs proves how weak their argument really is.

Speaking on a personal level I FEAR religion about as much as an imaginary friend. It would be idiocy to allow either to govern me.

a reply to: DBCowboy

Then pray for me to stop!!