I feel like people shouldn't react to the lion kill badly if they eat meat

I know hunting for sport is wrong to some people, including myself but can we honestly be mad while we support slaughter houses who abuse animals?

Ya, ceceil the lion death was tragic but at least that lion never had to live in a small confined area, force to take chemicals ect.. He lived a good life, a free life. The animals we eat never was given that chance. They're purely made to feed us. You see video of chickens growing unnaturally, there becks getting cut off, and stuffed in a small cage. Pigs often spend all there life in a cage where they can't move.

So, do we really have the right to get upset about sport hunters who kill exotic animals because it's condone cruelty?

Something to think about. I am no way saying we shouldn't directly get mad. I'm saying it's something to think about. Are we any better then them?

So, do we really have the right to get upset about sport hunters who kill exotic animals because it's condone cruelty?

a reply to: CaptainHook

Yes to the upset part, we do have the right. I think you'll find that the Lion is an endangered species. No killing is justified but in circumstances like that, the whole world is robbed!

Meh.

I see a vast difference between not feeling bad eating an animal that was raised and killed to be eaten and being upset that an animal was killed purely for the sake of being able to say "look at what I did, Ma!"

Sure, slaughter animals don't have great conditions to live in blah blah blah. And that sucks. And there are some truly sickening videos of some truly sickening people abusing slaughter animals. But at the end of the day, they were born bred and killed to be eaten. Not posed for pictures and bragging rights.

All that being said, I do find the moral outrage over the lion to be over the top, all things considered.

But that's the "flavor of the week" society we live in.

a reply to: CaptainHook

While I can accept that people are over reacting, with all the murders, and tragedies going on I get that people are going over board with the death threats etc. But seriously comparing the two? Most of the animals that we eat (I didn't read you were a vegan so I'm assuming you eat meat too) are bred for food, I'm not saying that it's better that we dont put them in cages and feed them chemicals etc. but the difference is in how it was done. I mean he was lured out, he was shot the decapitated I think that is what is kicking people up the backside, it has nothing to do with the 'If you eat meat you shouldn't be angry' argument. It was a protected animal, the issue you have is the way we treat animals that we plan to eat and I get that argument and I am just as peed about it as you are but that is a totally different debate that's far from this issue.

But saying that, this will die down, this will fall away and be forgotten in a few weeks and that's fine that's the way the world works, the way animals are treated is disgusting and horrible but this was different, the guy should be named and shamed, fined and banned from hunting but again comparing the two are completely different.

a reply to: CaptainHook

Cows chickens and pigs are not by any standard *Pets* they are called Live stock. Used since ancient times up to present to provide meat for society. There are millions if not billions of them around the world.

How many lions exist? Since Lions are exclusive to Africa.

Nearly a century ago, there were as many as 200,000 lions living in the wild in Africa. Today, the most recent surveys estimate that there are fewer than 30,000 lions living in the wild in Africa today.

You cannot compare cows chickens pigs to something as endangered and rare as a Lion! And to boot the Lion Cecil was also a local celebrity. Was loured off the protected wild life reserve by the dentist douche who shot him!
People are mourning the Lions death because he wasn't by any standard 100% wild. To often tourists and park rangers visited him frequently throughout the day. This is like shooting a Lion in the zoo.

That's pretty savage.

a reply to: donktheclown Ya I agree, but humanity itself is killing animals by our ways. When we build houses or malls over lands. We chase away animals homes. We kill animals we don't condone importance like the great white shark. Many people think it's okay to kill the shark because they appose dangers to humanity (when the fact is the great white rarely kill humans. Shark only kill 5 people a year while a lion can kill 100).

I just think people need to stop treating it as the worst thing on earth and act like they never effect a animal life or ignore the cruelty of some animals when we buy products.

I think we all need to focus our energy on how to help all animals and how they can live with us, not by us.

Since Lions are exclusive to Africa.

I think Asia as well.

a reply to: AnuTyrThat lion death is not more valued then any other lion base on it's life nor more valued then any other animal.

Point of this thread is how we treat animals, not valued base on population. A pain of a chicken is just as worse as the pain of a lion. They're valued base on there life form.

So, if this happened to any other animal where it experience pain for long period of time. They don't condone as a equal because 'there population is not endangered"?

A abused chicken isn't worth less compared to a lion. Both feel the ability to feel pain ect...

a reply to: CaptainHook

I agree that humans are polluting and decimating the planets ecosystem 100%. If i could have it my way i would prefer plants be genetically engineered to have the same flavour and nutrient density as meat. I would prefer if meat was replaced so everyone could let cows pigs and chickens fend for themselves in forests because they would hold little to no economic value at that point. Their numbers would plummet by the millions but thats fine. Lets go backwards on thousands of years of animal husbandry and stop giving them so much space to roam. As well as shut down all the slaughter houses so we can all be on a plant based diet.

The bacon tree will exist sometime soon. Science is working towards this direction right now so its not so much a hypothesis but it is the way research and development is going in the bio-tech feild.

originally posted by: CaptainHook
I know hunting for sport is wrong to some people, including myself but can we honestly be mad while we support slaughter houses who abuse animals?

Ya, ceceil the lion death was tragic but at least that lion never had to live in a small confined area, force to take chemicals ect.. He lived a good life, a free life. The animals we eat never was given that chance. They're purely made to feed us. You see video of chickens growing unnaturally, there becks getting cut off, and stuffed in a small cage. Pigs often spend all there life in a cage where they can't move.

So, do we really have the right to get upset about sport hunters who kill exotic animals because it's condone cruelty?

Something to think about. I am no way saying we shouldn't directly get mad. I'm saying it's something to think about. Are we any better then them?

YES. They are in a reserve for a reason. I reacted to it by crying. Especially the pic of this idiot by the rhino, it was like he killed a dinosaur. That is what it looks like.

I have gone down to almost no red meat. Also reduced consumption of chicken. Have moved over to more turkey. I love veggie burgers. Haven't eaten pork in years. I buy 'parmesan cheese alternative', it has a good texture in cooking. These are for reasons I think promote my personal health, but if I buy less of the non-free range and less red meat...and others do the same...maybe there will be less sold.

We still are not ready to completely cut our dependence on animals for food. It may be a long time. I do HATE videos of factory farms. I go out if my way to buy free range organic. Buy from farms just outside of town, family owned. I am going through hoops to get raw milk from a collective.

Those are the kinds of steps people can start taking.

However, animals in a reserve are there for a reason. Chickens are not going to die out anytime soon, nor are cows. Or are pigs. I cannot pooh pooh people who have not taken the steps I have taken. I can only hope to spread awareness when I type this.

You, hopefully, have gotten a few to stop and think. But using Cecil is kind of not fair.

S&F

originally posted by: CaptainHook
a reply to: donktheclown Ya I agree, but humanity itself is killing animals by our ways. When we build houses or malls over lands. We chase away animals homes. We kill animals we don't condone importance like the great white shark. Many people think it's okay to kill the shark because they appose dangers to humanity (when the fact is the great white rarely kill humans. Shark only kill 5 people a year while a lion can kill 100).

I just think people need to stop treating it as the worst thing on earth and act like they never effect a animal life or ignore the cruelty of some animals when we buy products.

I think we all need to focus our energy on how to help all animals and how they can live with us, not by us.

That is correct. From herds of Deer in Amherst NY to alligators crawling out of ponds in golf courses in Florida...we are WAYYY over building.

I just think people need to stop treating it as the worst thing on earth

a reply to: CaptainHook

Certainly, it isn't the worst thing to happen, but it's up there, evidently. When the Lion is gone, it's gone. What animal is going to be around to remind us that there are rules to follow? Well, rules in the wild, that is.....

a reply to: CaptainHook

you are right, its life isn't any better or worse than another lion. What im saying is Cecil had plenty of humans emotionally attached to him. and to see see his dead body with that noob posed in front of him is like seeing an urban poacher posing in front of a families dead dog.
Its the same feeling, Its not so much the loss of an animal but the loss of what some people thought there was a friend.
I can relate to that feeling because if be pretty choked if the police gunned down my dog and posed pictures with it.

Only its not a family, its a whole community. Which is why it has blown out of preportion.

a reply to: reldraI never actually known about this lion until Norman Reedus posted a picture about it on facebook.

originally posted by: CaptainHook
a reply to: AnuTyrThat lion death is not more valued then any other lion base on it's life nor more valued then any other animal.

Point of this thread is how we treat animals, not valued base on population. A pain of a chicken is just as worse as the pain of a lion. They're valued base on there life form.

So, if this happened to any other animal where it experience pain for long period of time. They don't condone as a equal because 'there population is not endangered"?

A abused chicken isn't worth less compared to a lion. Both feel the ability to feel pain ect...

Yes, we know chickens hurt. Hopefully they are killed quickly. They are not very smart. Cecil was injured by a bow and arrow and hunted for like 40 hours. That isn't done to chickens.

It is still not completely correct as 'chickens hurt'. There is no way completely around that. But people need to eat. Fresh fruit and veggies are expensive, some will argue don't have all the nutrients one needs (though I have seen the counter argument) and we simply need to feed people first. Also, some populations of animals NEED to be hunted in the winter or they die a slow death of starvation.

If we come up with an alternative, sort of like that parmesan cheese alternative I so like, maybe people will be more willing.

If we can collect over population of deer and put them in a reserve, sure, great.

originally posted by: CaptainHook
a reply to: reldraI never actually known about this lion until Norman Reedus posted a picture about it on facebook.

I am a great Norman Reedus fan. The loss of Cecil was bad and is a symbol of so many things. One day, we will all figure out how we don;t need to kill animals for food and how to help starving over-populations in better ways.

a reply to: CaptainHook

Eh, it is what it is.

While I'm not ever going to be a sport hunter and prefer that people who hunt eat what they take, some people are OK with it, and it annoys me to no end when people who are going to eat their kill post pictures of it and get raked over the coals for it as if all hunting was evil. So someone shot a trophy buck? And if they eat it after taking pictures of it and save the head for their trophy wall, whose business is it of yours?

I don't get all this outrage over a lion though. It's one thing to be upset and it's whole other level to keep milking this story day after day like Cecil was a toddler who has no name and was dropped headless into the bay. Zimbabwe is in the midst of a financial crash and deep depression, and the licensed taking of a few big game animals every year is part of what finances the armed guards who shadow the young and healthy animals of the same populations so they don't get poached and ground up into Asian medicine. Each of the remaining Northern white rhinos in Africa has its own armed guard. Where do you think money has to come from?

a reply to: reldraso, you're telling me that if something is dumb/stupid it has no importance? So, if a person who has a mental disability that makes them have a lower IQ. They're not equal to anyone above that IQ?

Animals base on there life form, not there intelligence or population. You can't justify cruelty of animals because they're condemned stupid or simply 'they to feed us humans'.

So, if I killed a lion or any other animal and prolonged it death/abused with the purpose of eating the animal. It should be condemned acceptable?

a reply to: ketsuko These people who killed Cecil wasn't eaten. His corpse was left behind while his head was taken. Not only that is that this dentist cunned the lion off the reserve.

I agree OP.. All these people bitch about hunters then go home and eat a steak or a burger lmao..

Cows and pigs are mammals and are very smart just like lions. they Keep telling themselves hunting is bad so they can feel better about themselves for eating that chicken or fish or deer or cow or pig or duck or whatever.

You are no better if you go home and eat a steak.