Cincinnati preparing for riots after viewing bodycam footage of fatal UC traffic stop

a reply to: abe froman

This is another typical rush to judgement and burn the cop down at any cost thread. Watch the video slowly and understand it. Here's two examples of why I think he will get off.

The cop is shown clearly reaching in the car and has grabbed the guys shirt or more likely, the seat belt trying to stop him.


The next still shot shows the cop falling down next to the car. From the orientation of the chest camera showing his face he most likely has his legs out from under him and possibly above his head. Look at the driver side mirror in relation. He was dragged.

originally posted by: Urantia1111
a reply to: fartlordsupreme.

So you're saying the cop wasn't removing the driver? Cop just blew the guy's head off simply because he was fleeing? Because what? He forgot the law? He wanted to be charged with murder? Of course not. He was in danger of being run over and "defended" himself. I'm no attorney, but I think the law provides for this. We'll see I suppose.

You know the most unfortunate aspect about of all of this is?

The POLITICS in it all.

And the fact that you're right, the law sometimes protects people in instances like this.

It's too bad it doesn't protect frightened teenagers who have a gun pulled on them and, (cha-ching), "feared for their life."

But I digress - the blue gang always supercedes those they are meant to serve and protect, always.

How anyone can watch that video, and justify being shot in the head for said actions, "because of assault on a police officer," and justify it through our corrupted justice system - for example, reference the off-duty peace officer who threatened to blow a hole through some dudes school, and who was put on leave - and always protect the enforcers and thugs of the police.

You do realize - police DO NOT CARE about the law. Why would they? If they did, they'd become a lawyer, prosecutor, defender, PA - whatever it may be. They need to stop with this tyranny for morons idiocracy.

a reply to: Urantia1111

i think everyone here can see the shifting sands in your arguments
my job here is done

a reply to: staticfl

FINALLY someone making sense...

Exactly, you cannot drive away from a traffic stop AS the cop has grabbed you and is removing you from the car knocking him to the pavement. That will be correctly called "assault" of some kind, and will cause a murder charge to bounce.

a reply to: staticfl

You're right, he did reach in the car.

Which created the situation where he felt compelled to shoot somebody in the dome. He handled a guy who didn't have his license on him in a piss poor fashion. And it would be a lot easier to buy his "I thought he was gonna hit me no wait he dragged me no wait my arm got stuck" story if he had fallen down or been struck by the vehicle BEFORE he let off a round.

He'll probably get off though. I don't see a murder charge sticking. Manslaughter seems more apt than murder to me, but I don't know the Ohio definitions of the two and can't be arsed to look.

a reply to: Urantia1111

and if that happens
the events that follow it will be entirely justified (and by that i mean the massive bake sale being held by the enthused citizens)

originally posted by: fartlordsupreme
a reply to: Urantia1111

i think everyone here can see the shifting sands in your arguments
my job here is done

THIS is your job eh? That doesn't surprise me. I see it's your first day. Welcome friend.

a reply to: lovebeck

I just watched the second full unedited video in the link you provided. I watched how the stop was initiated and skipped the part that is already in the initial video due to the fact once is enough for me and went to the part where the first video ends.

The second video in the link is damning. One does not need to have a psychology degree to digest what is taking place within the mind of that POS officer Tensing. He immediately began lying about what actually just occurred (repeatedly). His tone and breathing also reflects a person who just killed a wild boar on a hunt and not a person. He actually believes he's already in the clear. He was callous.

His supervisor (the one with the brown shirt/that places his glasses on his face/ and gives him the 'Shut the F up for a second and let me collect my nerves and senses' stare) has a look of "I know what you did, kid, I know about your ways...like why the f# are you so giddy atm, I'm f'n standing here in shock as you nonchalantly blab away after just killing a man who is right there 5ft away?"

His breathing and tone reflects a person who is thrilled (excited) instead of one who is flustered (anxious). Thrill kill is what this was. The other officers are gauging his actions very subtly....they know something stinks here....by the way he is "responding". He is not "reacting" in that situation as most would after a kill.

I could be wrong, but I highly doubt it. This is why everybody involved in this case who had access to the video before going public said "It doesn't look good" or "officer Tensing should of never been allowed to become an officer". The piece of # began lying on the spot. That speaks volumes about his mindset and his INTENTIONS. The dude is a psychopath and this is why American policing demands higher standards. Those that preach that "not all police are bad" mantra deserve to get thumped down. To preach that mantra displays a weak mentality and also clearly displays their lack of aptitude concerning the matter. These people lack depth of thought and the ability to discern matters intricately. I cannot wait for the next "Not all police are bad" thread. These people better do their homework before walking into that den; we get it-not all police are bad ---just fix the problem, America! Screw the home brewed P.R campaigns on social media!

Tensing, was waiting for an opportunity to let loose one day. Pay attention to how he speaks with his hands during the initial questioning of Mr. Sam Dubose. Tensing was very arrogant, despite his questioning, and reasons for doing so, were very legit.

I can only begin to imagine the difficult job it is to be an officer in the States or anywhere in the world, and really will never fully understand. Yet, because it is a job that requires not only brawn, but also INTELLIGENCE and a high emotional I.Q, I feel there should be higher standards within the U.S in order to become a police officer. After all, hasn't history shown this to be true?

******

Sam Dubose did not deal with the situation in an intelligent manner. We can all agree that starting up your car and driving off in the middle of a traffic stop is not normal behaviour and asking for trouble. I personally believe he was in an 'altered state of mind' during that interaction and that is why he decided to drive off. His thought process was irrational. His fight or flight response kicked in and overrode the reasoning mind.

Most people, I assume, would tell the officer: "I have a valid drivers license, but do not have it on me."

The officer would then ask you why? and one will explain simply: "I left my wallet at home, it happens."

The officer will then ask you step out the vehicle and ask your name and address which one will submit. The officer will go punch into his laptop the details given to see what comes up to see if the licence plate and car match the name and home address given. If it does match up, he will issue a 48 hour warning to show up at a certain division and present the actual ID. If it does not match, the car gets towed and so on.

*****

Officer Tensing was not in danger as Sam Dubose was attempting to flee. He "reacted" and murdered him in cold blood by shooting him in the face, then "responded" consciously after.

Most police officers (where I'm from) would step back and let you go due to their own safety concerns and then call it in. Over here in Canada we don't have car chases. They let you flee and show up at your door a few hours later. Also, even if the car is stolen, they don't chase you and put people's lives in danger and destroy whole city blocks over a f$% car! Catching a car thief is not a priority for them. That is what car insurance is for.

Also, they don't pull us over for trivial # here like licence plates and failing to signal. They have priorities over here. That is why it is so safe.

I love America, but not your police culture.

* Sorry about that rant, my friend, and for using your comment as a springboard; this killing of someone sworn to protect and serve really touched me, especially after observing that piece of # "response" in the unedited video you provided.

Respectfully,

Involutionist

originally posted by: staticfl
a reply to: abe froman

This is another typical rush to judgement and burn the cop down at any cost thread. Watch the video slowly and understand it. Here's two examples of why I think he will get off.

The cop is shown clearly reaching in the car and has grabbed the guys shirt or more likely, the seat belt trying to stop him.

The next still shot shows the cop falling down next to the car. From the orientation of the chest camera showing his face he most likely has his legs out from under him and possibly above his head. Look at the driver side mirror in relation. He was dragged.

Fair enough. "The cop was dragged."

That poor little guy. As mama not around to tend to his boo-boo?

Does that seriously justify shooting someone in the head?

I remember once in history class, my teacher (high school at the time), talked to us one period about Operation Paperclip.

American government recruiting and giving amnesty to Nazi scientists. Nasty stuff.

I always, even now to an extent, think to myself, "that could never really happen... thats insane," but it did. It really did.

And then I think of the rash of police brutality in America, the inconsistencies of internal investigations, penalties resulting in leaves, vacations, re-hirings at other police departments - and each and every time:

Police Chief: "It ills my gravely that one of my own would partake in such inhumane actions such as etc etc"

It just baffles me. The UN does a report, and scathes the U.S. on the way it's police treat it's populace.

Yet all the while, there are those that defend it, and get away with it.

Every time one of these stories emerge, I always imagine.

What if the victim in this case had a badge, and the officer didn't.

Would it still have the same ruling?

originally posted by: Urantia1111
a reply to: staticfl

FINALLY someone making sense...

Exactly, you cannot drive away from a traffic stop AS the cop has grabbed you and is removing you from the car knocking him to the pavement. That will be correctly called "assault" of some kind, and will cause a murder charge to bounce.

let me pull an urantia here

yeah finally someones making sense
nonsense!

lolololol high five bros

a reply to: Involutionist

There are many Americans who do not like our police culture and who happily take the criticism for asking that they operate on a level they tell us in which they are, that they take accountability for their actions of all officers and justly pursue as necessary, and stop being so quick to resort to lethal measures.

*GASP*

It truly seems like police across the U.S. are doing the exact opposite of that.

There's a former marine and 10 or 11-year former Baltimore police officer named Michael Wood that is talking all about what his divisions and police department(s) were doing.

It's pretty crazy. The war on drugs spiked our prison population higher than the best drug on the market could dream to do. The cash flow was massive, and it still is. This was one of the first steps in creating low-level income, institutionalized racism in which statistics became skewed by unprortionate police records which was caused by illegal frisk and searches and often plants. Later on, the arrest records would be higher in the areas they had previously botched arrests in, and would arrest there.

This process continues itself endlessly. Most that get out of prison resort to selling drugs to survive, and keep weapons to protect themselves.

"Guns and drugs," as the Baltimore PD would say, that's all they cared about.

Pretty damning things happening in today's America.

I appreciate those of you looking from the outside in who can see the issues plaguing our nation while many of our citizens still sleep soundly.

a reply to: fartlordsupreme

Well you just did it again.

"The cop was trying to drag him out of the car."

No, he was not. He was opening the door. For all we know had the victim consented to getting out of the car the officer wouldn't have put a finger on him.

You're speculating that he might have or was going to drag him out of the car. All the cop actually DID was try to open the door. There is a large difference between "tried to open a door" and "drug him out of the car."

One happened, one is speculation.

originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: fartlordsupreme

Well you just did it again.

"The cop was trying to drag him out of the car."

No, he was not. He was opening the door. For all we know had the victim consented to getting out of the car the officer wouldn't have put a finger on him.

You're speculating that he might have or was going to drag him out of the car. All the cop actually DID was try to open the door. There is a large difference between "tried to open a door" and "drug him out of the car."

One happened, one is speculation.

"drug him out of the car."

trying to drag him out of the car
trying
trying
trying
trying
as in was attempting to
he opened the door
then grabbed him by the shirt

of course thats speculation because im not in his head
but its pretty hard to imagine that anything else was going on there

and by your own admission

For all we know had the victim consented to getting out of the car the officer wouldn't have put a finger on him.

he laid hands on him for not getting out of the car.....
so what was the point of laying hands on him?
was he going to beat him?
trying to pat him on the shoulder?
or maybe was he trying to drag him out of the vehicle

your post seems almost schitzophrenic in that you claim the only reason he grabbed him is because he wouldnt get out
but there is still reasonable doubt that he wasnt attempting to drag him out

an inconsequential argument
however i can not get over your lack of logic in this matter

a reply to: fartlordsupreme

Trying to open the door.

Door.

Door.

Door.

Door.

Door.

(I can do this too, should we keep going?)

Make up whatever "facts" make you feel better. The cop was trying to open the door.

Door.

Door.



Oh, and sweet job trying to imply I have mental health issues.

Winner.

originally posted by: Shamrock6
a reply to: fartlordsupreme

Trying to open the door.

Door.

Door.

Door.

Door.

Door.

(I can do this too, should we keep going?)

Make up whatever "facts" make you feel better. The cop was trying to open the door.

Door.

Door.



Oh, and sweet job trying to imply I have mental health issues.

Winner.

well grabbing at the guy sure is a funny way of trying to open the door
and you have already implied that he did in fact grab at the guy (which is unnecessary because its clearly visible in the video)
(and ignoring that why would he be opening the door?)

it seems more and more my assessment was correct

you will not succeed in deflecting this conversation (as is your very apparent intention)

i dont even understand why you are arguing this point
iirc he is legally allowed to remove him from the vehicle (and its almost inarguable that he was trying to do just that)

a reply to: RomeByFire

I feel you, my friend. I have many friends in the States and I have spent much time there myself. In fact, I'm down there a few times a year. I have seen 40 States and stayed a few months at a time in some of them. I know America gets an unfair rep globally. The majority of Americans (like all other first world nation) are intelligent, sophisticated and cultured. I know that for every Sarah Palin there are one million Tina Fey's. But, I am also aware from my own experiences, it is a very unique land with many subcultures with very unique issues that should not exist in nation with so much history and power (including brain power). I honestly cannot figure out wtf is going on down there.

I would like to add: I know most police in the States are good hearts trying their best and their heart breaks when scum like Tensing keep doing what they are doing to tarnish their names. I know that these good officers with the best of intentions become type cast and sometimes are treated as if they are the bad ones. On a human level, that must hurt deeply.

I also know that there a few cops in the states with gang ties and KKK ties and cartel ties and on the take and this is what needs to be cleaned up along with the senseless killing at routine traffic stops. Do you remember the Sean Bell story...? Forget what wiki says or the official story. That was gang s# and money laundering and prostitution. I will give you two guesses who was running that...? Some boys in BLUE. Also, Sean was getting married to a woman who had secrets with two of the shooters....(watch her reaction in court as the officers walked in) The filth runs deep in America and the system has many tentacles.

I honestly do not know how America is going to clean that mess up (criminal ties) but I do know they should at least make an effort to curb killing civilians over trivial interactions. Nobody should die or go to jail for trivial traffic violations. That is simply poor training.

It's pretty crazy. The war on drugs spiked our prison population higher than the best drug on the market could dream to do. The cash flow was massive, and it still is. This was one of the first steps in creating low-level income, institutionalized racism in which statistics became skewed by unprortionate police records which was caused by illegal frisk and searches and often plants. Later on, the arrest records would be higher in the areas they had previously botched arrests in, and would arrest there.

This process continues itself endlessly. Most that get out of prison resort to selling drugs to survive, and keep weapons to protect themselves.

"Guns and drugs," as the Baltimore PD would say, that's all they cared about.

Pretty damning things happening in today's America.

It's big business.

I appreciate those of you looking from the outside in who can see the issues plaguing our nation while many of our citizens still sleep soundly.

I love my cousins (America), and sometimes I can come across as a hater, but deep down I'm not. Nobody who has invested their own money, time and energy to visit 40 States and stay a month or two in some, is a hater. I do have much to say tho based on personal experiences and interactions (most are good!). My opinions do not arise from internet information. Also, I have more good stories about my interaction with police in the States than bad ones. Most are cool (except for that one in South Beach a few years ago...he can kiss my arse!)

Police culture in the States needs to be addressed. How people are policed needs to be addressed instead of bashing the police. I believe that would put an end to the P.R campaigns "not all police are bad" and get people seeing the bigger picture and discussing ways to bring awareness to the matter. Riots and looting are not the way. Bickering is not the way. Coming together in a peaceful manner is the way....NATIONALLY....not city by city.

...but how does a nation like the United States divided by so many subcultures go about that?

Not responding to anyone personally, but just seeing some of the responses in this thread, I just have to ask...

If a person gets pulled over for not displaying a front license plate, though they have a valid back license plate, yet they don't have their ID on them, is it better to:

1. Let it slide, because honestly, it's not that big of a deal

2. Shoot them point-blank in the god damn head

There was no dragging going on, no threat to the officer that could not have been negated by taking a single step back. Just a man with a gun shooting another man directly in the head. That is all.

No wonder they were concerned about this footage getting out.

www.nydailynews.com...

Don't forget this girl ... same neck of the woods, police officer got away with this murder as well. I know, different circumstances, plus she wasn't black. Same idea though, she tried to drive away, and so many people excused the officer by saying that she may have run someone over being drunk.

A friend of mine asked a serious question when this subject came up tonight.
"Is shooting an unarmed person some sort of initiation ritual to some police secret society?"

Back when we were out there, young and immortal, (the '70s) we were well aware that if we got all up in a cop's face and acted stupid, we could expect to be whacked pretty good with a nightstick. Sometimes it was multiple whacks and a smack up side the head. Take a swing at one and he would take you down HARD.
But nobody ever got shot. Nor their dogs. Even after Nixon declared war on drugs, even when Reagan put the war on drugs on steroids. But by the early '90s we began hearing of cops just shooting unarmed people for no good reason. In the '90s our children were harassed by cops continually for no reason, threatened with jail for "improper turn" or some such nonsense.
Now, with the advances in technology, we're seeing it for ourselves. And it seems to be spreading from the targets being minorities to equality of target.
We have to clean out the corruption. Drug testing every single one of these shooter cops is a start to investigation of this slaughter of innocents. And yes, no matter how many arrests or convictions or warrants they have on their record, in that cop's eyes those people MUST be considered innocent.