Motorbike runs on water from a polluted river.

originally posted by: dragonridr

That's why you use hydrogen fuel cells eliminates that problem.

Yes, but hydrogen fuel cell tech runs an electric motor. It's a promising future if and I mean IF we can find a readily available source of hydrogen gas. Because hydrogen is so reactive it is 99.9% of the time bonded with other elements i.e. Oxygen to make water. This means that a lot of energy is required to free the hydrogen up and therefore a rather pointless exercise.

What the motorbike man has done is convert a piston engine to run on the stuff using the hydrolysis method. It will work, but will reduce the service life of the engine because of embrittlement.

Unfortunately this is not the miracle we are all looking for.

a reply to: Bedlam
bedlam, let me summarize... it does not matter whether hydrogen and oxygen burn in an engine or combine in a fuel cell to yield electrical or rotational energy...the energy to yank water apart into hydrogen and oxygen or get it out by combining is exactly the same. no cheating. not allowed in physics, so every water powered car/bike/etc has to deal with this.
now, Meyers water powered car raises this question...and provides a circuit diagram that may not rely on electrolysis as the method of yanking hydrogen from oxygen.

Let me propose an engine that harnesses the Casimir effect. two polished plates are pulled together..but let us attach them to a crankshaft and yoke assembly. as the plate pulls to the other, the crankshaft turns the pull into rotational energy. then when the plates touch, the crankshaft, through clever mechanics (a scotch yoke..) slides the plate sideways, breaking the casimir pull. cancelling it, but not fighting it... now imagine both plates have similar crankshaft assemblies...now imagine frictionless design and momentum allowing it to turn forever etc. so now the casimir pull is harnessed and canceled with each rotation. (hey, einstein imagined himself sitting on a photon to make relativity theory)

so please explain why this engine does not harness the casimir effect. (no fair, already conceded friction..) Now, if this tiny engine is possible, go back to the Meyer water powered car circuit diagram and think about it...

originally posted by: darkstar57
a reply to: Bedlam
bedlam, let me summarize... it does not matter whether hydrogen and oxygen burn in an engine or combine in a fuel cell to yield electrical or rotational energy...the energy to yank water apart into hydrogen and oxygen or get it out by combining is exactly the same. no cheating. not allowed in physics, so every water powered car/bike/etc has to deal with this.

Correct.

now, Meyers water powered car raises this question...and provides a circuit diagram that may not rely on electrolysis as the method of yanking hydrogen from oxygen.

You answered this so nicely above. "the energy to yank water apart into hydrogen and oxygen or get it out by combining is exactly the same". And you were right.

so please explain why this engine does not harness the casimir effect. (no fair, already conceded friction..) Now, if this tiny engine is possible, go back to the Meyer water powered car circuit diagram and think about it...

It's still a non-sequitur, unless you can establish a concrete relationship, and it doesn't really look like there is one. Meyer just stuck a "magic insertion point" in, much as this guy has. If he said "I have a magic car battery that craftily gets more energy from bafflegab space than it takes to recharge", most people would ignore him, being at least faintly aware of the behavior of batteries. Thus, you need to stick in a point of abstraction, of indirection, that is less well understood, in order to pitch your "and thus, magic!". And his is an electrolyzer and a fuel cell.

Similarly, Meyer sticks in a resonance woo spot, with quantum sauce, and frequencies. It's there for nothing more than this guy's electrolyzer-fuel cell combo, and that's to introduce "mystery" so he can hang his scam there.

a reply to: Bedlam

You just need to select the right cosmic frequency using relative inverse spherical harmonic integer math derived from the adverse adjunct relationship of the quantum standing wave function. Dead simple.

I'm selling over unity plans for the low, low price of $99.99 (inc. p&p) right now if anyone wants to get on board. Physicists hate me!

a reply to: GetHyped

I think you might need to add the following: ancients, sacred geometry, dark matter and/or zero point energy, fields, holograms, and possibly something spinny looking, vortex might do. Or 'orbs'.

a reply to: Bedlam

The costs involved in refining and powdering the Aluminium (or other metals) would absolutely be accounted for within the actual price of the powder yes?

So, that brings us back to my point of relative financial costs per X unit of powder and catalyst Vs. financial costs per X unit of Gas or Diesel.

Or do you think the companies that produce powdered metals just ignore their production expenses, including of course the electricity expended in X unit of powder, when they come to sell the resultant powdered metal?

Hmmm..wouldn't stay in business very long would they.

Besides, if the company producing the powders were using renewable sources, the costs of electricity used in manufacture of the powder would be negligible anyway.

So again...If the evolved H from X units of metal powder & catalyst, sufficient to power a motor / genset for the same distance / running time as X units of gas or diesel was significantly financially cheaper than the gas or diesel, using the powdered metal to obtain the motive force would make sense.

Who mentioned 'free energy' anyway? Certainly not i, so i'm at a loss as to why you wrote that...unless it was your intent to deliberately give the absurd impression that i was claiming using powdered metal and a catalyst to evolve Hydrogen gas was somehow 'free energy', which of course it most certainly isn't.

I clearly stated relative financial costs, compared to gasoline / diesel. Please read posts properly before replying.

originally posted by: MysterX
a reply to: Bedlam

The costs involved in refining and powdering the Aluminium (or other metals) would absolutely be accounted for within the actual price of the powder yes?

A large loss in net energy as opposed to a small one is ridiculously inefficient, yes?

So that brings us back to the ridiculousness of refining aluminum into a metal for the purpose of making aluminates out of it, when one could just take the energy without all the horrifically lossy steps between.

Besides, if the company producing the powders were using renewable sources, the costs of electricity used in manufacture of the powder would be negligible anyway.

You're back to having to take this hydroxide sludge and turn it back into metal. And you won't do that for less than the energy you'll be able to get back later. Minus a lot of losses.

Who mentioned 'free energy' anyway? Certainly not i, so i'm at a loss as to why you wrote that...unless it was your intent to deliberately give the absurd impression that i was claiming using powdered metal and a catalyst to evolve Hydrogen gas was somehow 'free energy', which of course it most certainly isn't.

I clearly stated relative financial costs, compared to gasoline / diesel. Please read posts properly before replying.

The op is quite obviously appealing to it. I clearly stated energy efficiency sucking like a Hoover with your powdered aluminum scheme. Please read replies carefully. That aluminum's not going to become a metal by itself. And what it's going to take is far more energy input than you'll be able to get back.

a reply to: Bedlam

Sounds like sir would be most interested in my Platinum Package for the more discerning Free Thinker™

Monthly installments or annual plan?

a reply to: Bedlam
now i really appreciate your reply, but let me throw in another bit of physics..at the quantum level. the wave particle duality at the quantum level is real. its observable. so is the casimir effect due to waves or particles momentarily stepping out of the vacuum flux and pushing those plates together???? the force is real measurable...but generalizable how. i see some relation between the meyers generator...two plates mm apart, with a frequency injected between them by a resonant circuit with an unknown frequency function as worth exploring. if the circuit diagram is complete, it could be built and tested in the lab for a few thousand.
I do not take meyers drive to califonia on water as proof, but i do wonder about his mysterous death..the usual symptom of treading on the toes of the oil and banking oligarchs.
i will have to let this rest abit for some more insight..

originally posted by: darkstar57
...i see some relation between the meyers generator...two plates mm apart

The end. Casimir effect eliminated. Next.

...with a frequency injected between them by a resonant circuit with an unknown frequency function as worth exploring.

You can't inject a frequency. You can impose a time varying electric field that HAS a frequency, but this does not cause/prevent/influence the formation of virtual particles. Resonant to what, or with what, would be the next question.

i do wonder about his mysterous death..the usual symptom of treading on the toes of the oil and banking oligarchs.
i will have to let this rest abit for some more insight..

I think he just died, and his cronies took the opportunity to try for a TDAMH. Never let a natural death go without exploiting it in the free energy biz, I always say.

a reply to: Bedlam

Your right we have never discovered how to pull energy from virtual particles and never will. There is no free lunch either the energy is there or its not. Even fuel cells require other energy to make them work like airpreasure. And yes even gravity and thermal temprature. The trick is to get enough of these potential energies to give us the desired results.

The real advantage of hydrogen is its cleaner burning and can be made as a by product of say a nuclear reactor or solar power. Making it far better than refining petroleum.

a reply to: Bedlam
Ok, i have to list three major energy projects that involve frequencies..Rossis Ecat, the Meyer hydrogen generator, and now the Shawyer rf resonant cavity thruster. The latter is verified in several labs, including NASA. it is simple and should not work, thrust with no reaction from gas or ions. the meyer, i have already mentioned the frequency injected by the circuit (a tank circuit, usual inductors caps and diodes) the ECAT is strange, because 3 phase electrical power supply to a heater results in 180 hrtz plus other resonant frequencies in a small tubular cavity with rossis magic ingredients...mostly nickel hydrogen. (shades of pons fleishman paladium deuterium..look at your periodic table.)
The Shawyer drive has the most detailed and explicit lab confirmation, and i would be you can take the microwave generator out of your oven, shot it in a Shawyer copper cavity , and measure gram changes. keeping an open mind is good, as long as your brain does not fall out...

originally posted by: darkstar57Rossis Ecat

Scam.

Meyer hydrogen generator

Scam.

Shawyer rf resonant cavity thruster

Sciencey sounding thing.

So you listed two scams (notice the pattern here?) and one sciencey sounding thing (probably in the hopes of bamboozling the scientifically illiterate) and conclude "therefore, frequencies!" (cue spooky music).

Whenever I see people throwing the word 'frequency' around like it's some sort of scientific deus ex machina, I know they haven't got even half a clue what they're on about.

Reading list: en.wikipedia.org...

originally posted by: darkstar57
a reply to: Bedlam
Ok, i have to list three major energy projects that involve frequencies..

What you have to always ask is "frequency of what", since "frequency" is an attribute of something else. I can't slap you upside the head with a frequency.

Rossis Ecat, the Meyer hydrogen generator...

Two scams.

...and now the Shawyer rf resonant cavity thruster. The latter is verified...

What it is so far, is that there is so little thrust the results they're getting are tough to untangle from other effects.

The Shawyer drive has the most detailed and explicit lab confirmation, and i would be you can take the microwave generator out of your oven, shot it in a Shawyer copper cavity , and measure gram changes.

Except they WISH it was a gram's worth of change. So far, it's microNewtons. And that's awfully tough to separate out from other things that go on.

a reply to: MysterX

Powdered aluminum added to a solution would react fairly quickly, I'd guess. A chunk of aluminum (a piece of an aluminum can) would probably react in a more managable fashion. You wouldn't need to produce a pure sample as some other posters are suggesting, as the beverage industry turns out millions of them a day. Share a Coke with Bedlam, and you're in business.

a reply to: Bedlam
in the rossi ecat case, the frequency is the em from 3 phase power supply to the heater...that would be 180 cps. in the case of the meyer electronic circuit that would also be em in the low megahertz range, and the exact frequency would be determined by the diodes, inductors, caps, and inter plate distance . since none of these are specified , its only guesswork, but it is absolutely certain that there is a em freq. I think there are 555 timers in there too. I have also download a build-able circuit from a follower...
now the disruptive potential of either technologies is enormous, it would end petroleum dominance over the value of the dollar, and reignite national independence movements, ending the NWO rush to world government. so there are powerful forces behind declaring these technologies to be a scam... like JP Morgans termination of Teslas research.

When riding a motorbike or driving a car, ride safe and don't ride on the wrong side of a 2-way road, otherwise you'll end up into some serious accident against vehicles coming from the other direction.
BTW, when braking hard on a motorbike, be careful with the front brake, you can turn the bike over on itself!

a reply to: Bedlam

Or a point of abstraction like .... Oh idk creating the right local conditions to cause a cascade of positrons you ARE NOT MAKING just show up...?

Something like that maybe?

Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that It's maybe impossible but it's definitely possible if it's not impossible... Maybe.

originally posted by: subfab
a reply to: cuckooold

when i read the title, my first thought was a motorcycle drove across a lake that was so polluted it was able to drive on it.

ha ha ha

Yes, me too. Then once I realized that it was about hydrogen powering it, i quickly came to the conclusion that the pollution headline was just clickbait since any decent amount of water with or without pollution would suffice. I had an old Volvo 240DL wagon that I had running on hydrogen for a while. These things are possible.

a reply to: dragonridr

You really have absolutely no idea what you're talking about and I'll prove it, TWICE!
.
1. You blithely talk about a 1.5 volt electrolysis process like volts is a unit of power and thus a 12 volt motorcycle battery is a perfectly reasonable power source for it.... Volts are not a unit of power and you're so wrong I'm sad for you with this entire assertion.

2. Someone brings up hydrogen embrittlement as yet ANOTHER REASON this is BS and you shoot back with "hurr durr that's why you use hydrogen fuel cells" as if you solved something.... Sadly, you actually believing you said something coherent here says everything... You didn't! Fuel cells solve nothing in an electrolysis based internal combustion motorcycle since they... Oh nevermind... You're just hella wrong and need to learn basic 3rd grade science.