Two Questions for Transgender people

a reply to: Kojiro

It was intended to be cold hearted at all. I'm trying to point out that this girl was suffering enormous pressure to fit into a female label from so called allies. She was always going to be different. Her inability to accept that, most likely caused by people constantly claiming there is no difference is why she killed herself. That's incredibly sad.

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: Kojiro

It was intended to be cold hearted

Your Freudian slip is showing.

originally posted by: Crazy Diamond
Here is opinion of a straight male from Serbia, place where acceptance and equality is still lagging behind more civilized countries but we are catching up.

Also, you guys sound as if someone is physically forcing you to have sex. Reality is sexual intercourse comes with many risks from unwanted pregnancies, STDs and, apparently to some, having sex with trans people. Out of those three, to me, the last one is by far the least worrisome. You can always chose celibacy and not have to worry about any of them.

You do also realize that the biggest, in not only, reason why they are so secretive about their past is because of the way society has been treating them? Try to imagine how it would feel for someone like Jade to hear terms like "not an authentic or genuine woman" as has been used in this thread. And that's mild, I am sure she's heard much worse. That is actually the root of your problem. No matter how good the operation was, no matter how much the brain scans show, to you she will never be an authentic woman. And I say "your problem" because that's what it is. It has noting to do with her. Do you ask every girl you are about to have sex with if she had her tonsils or appendix removed because, after all, if she did have them removed, she is not an "authentic" woman, the way she was born.

OMG!!!! :heart: :heart: :heart:

That is exactly the point i've been trying to make to Domo and others.

I don't know how to say "I LOVE YOU!" in Serbian... but i think i'll have to learn.

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: Crazy Diamond

originally posted by: Annee

originally posted by: Crazy Diamond

But my question is if they found out after having sexual intercourse, how can that fact cause "serious psychological effects"? I mean they were clearly completely "fooled" to have sex with that person in the first place, meaning up to that point she was a woman through and through.

I personally consider that your own "head" issue. Obviously, you're talking casual sex -- for the sake of having sex. Chalk it up to another interesting event in your life.

Fooled? You were fooled about being a willing partner in having sex?


She IS a woman. It's not up to a certain point.

I personally as a hetero woman keep my sex life separate from anything else. I don't mix it with my work, personal life, or friends. I've had some interesting experiences. They're mine. I don't share them. It's no one else's business.

Relationship? That's something else.

I am sorry but you completely, like 180 degrees, misunderstood what I was trying to say. Probably my fault, English is not my native language. Please read this post, everything will be clear. I purposefully put fooled in quotes.

First, thank you for saying English is not your native language. I always appreciate people who do that.

Understand my post is not really directed at you. It's just my thinking on the subject.

I understand that your post wasn't directed at me but I still feel that you got completely opposite meaning of what I was trying to say. It was ongoing discussion between Darth and myself, and that one post taken out of context could surely be interpreted the way you did. If you have time, please read this post(if link doesn't work it's first post on page 10) .

a reply to: Kojiro

Meh, sloppy typer on iPad.

originally posted by: Kojiro
a reply to: TrueBrit

I know I said I was done, but considering you're one of the few with deep, inquisitive, thought-provoking posts; I just had to answer. In a way, I kind of felt for your quest there. It seems so... romantic.

Unfortunately, I do not think the woman you seek exists at all, so you may be dooming yourself to a life of solitude. This is genuine concern here. Every other woman I've known has felt some form of dissatisfaction with their body, whether it be over weight or hair or some other cosmetic feature. And, if you ever do encounter such an elusive woman, I'm not sure she'd be the type of person you'd want to be with in terms of personality; she'd likely be the most extreme of narcissists—more in love with herself than with you, that is if she even notices you at all.

I think your search might be a little unhealthy.

I agree. I've heard that even some of the most beautiful models in the world had serious issues with their body at some point.

Add in the fact that in most of Western society advertising targeted towards women is very good at making us question aspects of our body even if there are no real issues in the first place. It's why there are teenage girls who are already thin who end up anorexic-bulemic. It's why there are breast implants and other common cosmetic surgery are lucrative industries.

TrueBrit's search is likely to end in loneliness because I am not sure such a perfect woman as he is looking for actually even exists.

WOOOOO!!!!! Im back B*i*t*c*h*e*s and I mean that as a term of endearment so for all you sensitive types don't get your panties in a bunch, chillax. I feel good today, I took a little stroll on a lovely beach this morning that was nice. So ladies, gentlemen and everything in between allow me to share some perspective on this in a sincere attempt to play nice and be helpful.

I speak to my own when I say girls we need to be understanding and supportive of people who have no sexual interest in us yet are supportive in every other way otherwise. They mean us no harm by being put off by a concept that we are just now starting to get people to loosen up on. Also for those that sleep casually with a guy without revealing their identity (as Batgirl) and keep it moving well that is on them and their conscious. I'm not saying that I think that it is or isn't ok to do that just that if the other party does not know and no actual harm came to them due to the encounter then all is for all intents purposes well.

Someone like myself really has no choice but to be open with someone for the obvious reason of plumbing. I would most likely get an Ace Ventura reaction right in front of me if I were lucky and did not get viciously attacked. As for the young woman who took her own life because she was mocked I say that that is horrible, tragic and my deepest sympathies for her family. However I have already stated that I have no sympathy for THE INDIVIDUAL who does that and this has nothing to do with equality rights. I just believe most of us suffer in some way at least at some point in our lives and we keep pressing on and trying to make things or hoping things better one day at a time. It also undermines all of the girls who were BEATEN TO DEATH, they WANTED TO LIVE and didn't have a say in the matter.

One last thing to all my lovely sisters I love and appreciate you all, you all are so very important to making the world a better place not just for ourselves but for all.

a reply to: JadeStar

Care to link me in on that JadeStar?

I couldn't locate the post with the link.

originally posted by: JadeStar


OMG!!!! :heart: :heart: :heart:

That is exactly the point i've been trying to make to Domo and others.

I don't know how to say "I LOVE YOU!" in Serbian... but i think i'll have to learn.

That would be "Volim te"

As a straight, white, male in predominantly white, patriarchal country, meaning I've never experienced any sort of discrimination for who I am, I cant even begin to imagine what life must've been for you. And when you finally think its over and you can finally be who you are some people still want to add prefixes to your being like trans-woman. I do have hope that in near future through better education and understanding, in large part thanks to internet, people will finally accept others for who they are.

a reply to: JadeStar

On the subject of my search being bound for a lonely end, if that is the end it must have then so be it. I am not going to settle for anything less than I am after, because to do so would be hideously unfair to anyone I settled on.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: JadeStar

On the subject of my search being bound for a lonely end, if that is the end it must have then so be it. I am not going to settle for anything less than I am after, because to do so would be hideously unfair to anyone I settled on.

I so agree with you here TrueBrit, I often like your posts. It is hard not too and I have said I would rather be depressed because I am lonely than resentful that I settled. My partner would come to despise me because that resentfulness would eventually show.

a reply to: TrappedPrincess

Saw that happen too many times, from my parents on to my friends, and all over the place in general. Not happening. I will not be responsible for that sort of suffering. I damned well refuse.

a reply to: TrueBrit

Good for you!

I don't doubt that you'll find someone old chap. You're a great guy, and clearly very thoughtful and bright.

Haha! I was strolling back through this thread again and came across the picture that JadeStar posted earlier. I like the shirt idea better than getting a tattoo on my forehead or something.



Then I got to thinking. That chick's hair looks just like mine did before I chopped it all off in May! I can't wait until it grows back out. Maybe not age appropriate because most of the women I know my age have short hair but I'm not ready to go there yet.


Not that anybody cares. I just felt like sharing. FWIW, I'm kind of a jeans and t-shirt gal myself.

a reply to: EKron

t-shirt gal

For what it's worth, I don't think that you have to have your hair short for it to be age appropriate. I think yours looks great!

a reply to: Domo1
Aw, thanks! That was kind of you. Sure felt weird for a few days after I cut it though.

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: JadeStar

Blaming this girl's death solely on a guy being mean to her is disingenuous. Mentally healthy people move on and don't kill themselves if someone is an asshole to them. Her need to be accepted by everyone as a woman, and not a transwoman, perpetuated by people that don't see the very clear difference is what killed her. That is incredibly sad.

Um HELLO.....

If women born differently should have to disclose something that was a corrective medical procedure of no consequence to the one-night-stand sex mentioned because some people would not be able to deal with that mentally if they found out perhaps to the point of suicide then women born differently should not have to disclose something that was a corrective medical procedure of corrective medical procedure of no consequence to the one-night-stand sex mentioned because some of these women born differently might be mentally or even physically abused for doing so perhaps to the point of suicide.

Their lives are just as important.

From page 4 of this thread….

originally posted by: interupt42
a reply to: Kojiro

There are many people that would not be able to cope very well with finding out the truth as the OP suggested. They could act out violently towards you, or even suicidal themselves with not being able to cope with the truth or have other psychological problems.

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: TrueBrit

You said that much better than I did.

That still doesn't change my feeling. It's a crappy spot to be in, but saying that just because someone can't tell the difference doesn't make it OK. I don't think it makes someone gay (and I don't think that should be an issue anyway) if they sleep with a transgender person. I just think that being upfront about such a sensitive topic is very important. Some people would murder a transgender person, some people would commit suicide, some people may prefer it. Let the other person make the decision.

You just said...

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: JadeStar

Blaming this girl's death solely on a guy being mean to her is disingenuous. Mentally healthy people move on and don't kill themselves if someone is an asshole to them.

So imagine if I had posted the following response:

I do not intend to be cold hearted at all. I'm trying to point out that this hypothetical guy would be suffering enormous pressure to fit into a male label from so called buddies. He was always going to be at risk of picking up a girl born differently considering his dating habits. His inability to accept that, most likely caused by people constantly claiming that transgender women are not really women is why he killed himself. That's incredibly sad.

Had I posted that, i'd have been seen as a monster. Yet you posted something very similar.

originally posted by: Domo1
a reply to: Kojiro

It was intended to be cold hearted at all. I'm trying to point out that this girl was suffering enormous pressure to fit into a female label from so called allies. She was always going to be different. Her inability to accept that, most likely caused by people constantly claiming there is no difference is why she killed herself. That's incredibly sad.

So again let's review:

If a guy goes, flirts with, and picks up and takes home an attractive woman like me who was born differently knowing full well she is just a one-night-stand and he has sex with her and he later finds out that she was born differently and commits suicide then THATS THE EVIL TRANSGENDER WOMAN'S FAULT FOR NOT DISCLOSING SOMETHING HE DOESN'T NEED TO KNOW IN A ONE NIGHT STAND.

But if an attractive girl like me is flirted with, and picked up and goes home with a guy who is a serial one-night-stand jerk who upon me informing him that I had a corrective medical procedure to bring my body in line with my brain back in my teens he is free to let loose on me, mentally abuse me and send me on my way to hang myself. AND THAT SUICIDE IS THE EVIL TRANSGENDER WOMAN'S FAULT FOR EVER BEING BORN.

And I would have NO RIGHT to be pre-emptively informed that the guy who picked me up is an ass. That's expecting WAY TOO MUCH right?


I'm so glad that's clear now.

You both just made the best case on why we should never tell. Because we're always going to be at fault whether it is for some guy's fragile mental state or our own fragile mental state after being torn apart by him for being "honest".

That's not at all unfair right?

You've both just convinced me if I ever date again, never to tell.

Because I'm evil either way. I will never be considered equally deserving of the same respect and consideration as the guy according to both of you. So why bother? I will live my life as if I have amnesia. Because if i -really- did have amnesia there would be nothing to disclose. No one's feelings would get hurt. He get's off and goes off on his merry way to the next girl as he normally would have done, none the wiser.

Afterall, the moment i tell. I'm different. Until that moment, in his mind, i'm the best sex he ever had.

Why ruin it?

Thanks for the help guys. I have always informed guys about being born differently before so much as a kiss but if I ever for some god awful reason have to date again I see no obligation to anymore. The last last vestige of social abnormality will be eliminated. I once felt I had a moral reason to keep it but now I don't anymore.

The girl who killed herself once had a life. She had a family who loved her. Just like mine loves me.

Our lives matter just as much as your hypothetical guy who couldn't take the fact that the wonderful sex he just had was with a woman born differently.

If you don't care as much about us, if our feelings and lives do not matter as much as the feelings and life of the ego crushed guy who has sexuality insecurity mental issues why on earth should we care as much about you?

originally posted by: EKron
Haha! I was strolling back through this thread again and came across the picture that JadeStar posted earlier. I like the shirt idea better than getting a tattoo on my forehead or something.

Then I got to thinking. That chick's hair looks just like mine did before I chopped it all off in May! I can't wait until it grows back out. Maybe not age appropriate because most of the women I know my age have short hair but I'm not ready to go there yet.

Not that anybody cares. I just felt like sharing.

FWIW, I'm kind of a jeans and t-shirt gal myself.

Wear your hair long if you want to. Some of those ladies your age who wear their hair shorter might because it has thinned out and yours hasn't yet. By the way I kinda thought that girl is probably how you looked at 20, that's why i thought it was a perfect picture to illustrate that point.

originally posted by: Crazy Diamond

Bravo Braco

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To the OP, interesting questions, I have never thought on it before.

At the end of the day no one can tell you how to feel or react, but after reading testimonies and thoughts here I hope people are little more educated on the subject and have more compassion and understanding on the challenges facing a trans person. I am lucky I never had to produce a birth certificate any time I had sex to disclose anything, and I imagine a trans person who feels 100% they are their chosen gender can never be completely relaxed when fulfilling their sexual and romantic desires for fear of reaction from a new partner.

That would be a significantly difficult emotional place to exist in I imagine.

originally posted by: TrueBrit
a reply to: blackmetalmist

Grand... That's straight talk, and I appreciate it blackmetalmist, really!

I was kind of worried there for a moment that the world had gone utterly mental, and that I, of all people, might end up being tarred with the same brush as all those bloody WBC nutcases.

You're ok. I think.