British police calling for knife ban

I stepped on a thumb tack the other day. I don't know how much more "thumb tack violence" I can endure. Ban all thumb tacks!

originally posted by: Kromlech
I stepped on a thumb tack the other day. I don't know how much more "thumb tack violence" I can endure. Ban all thumb tacks!

Very droll...

From the OP's "source":

A call from the British Medical Journal was published several years ago, arguing that “many assaults are committed impulsively, prompted by alcohol and drugs, and a kitchen knife often makes an all too available weapon,” according to the BBC.

Researchers “consulted 10 top chefs from around the UK, and found such knives have little practical value in the kitchen. None of the chefs felt such knives were essential, since the point of a short blade was just as useful when a sharp end was needed.”

Again, we remind our readers outside of the UK, that this is not satire, just another example of the government claiming they are here to protect us from ourselves.

In the UK, the rate of knife violence is approximately one in every 374 people victimized, compared with a rate of one in 750 people victimized by gun violence in the United States.

As you can see, it wasn't the "British Police" - there is no such thing - calling for a ban, but merely a tacked on paragraph at the end of the article about a British Medical Journal article from years ago - also discussed here on ATS at the time.

It also conflates this article as apparent Government policy. The BMJ has nothing to do with the Government and is in fact just one journal of the medical community.

In short, the OP article is just a load of old bollocks, written in such a manner to stir the pot to make something out that it isn't.

a reply to: Skid Mark

Just last week a 14 year old boy was murdered in my county, in the city of Carlisle , he was stabbed repeatedly in the head and neck and dumped in a cemetery, the three suspects are 18, 19, 19, they have been remanded in custody.

This type of thing is so rare the county has been left shocked, and I reckon if it wasn't for knife carry laws it would happen more often.

Just over 5 years ago, a taxi driver, only 7 miles away from me, took his LEGALLY owned guns and slaughtered 12 people, injuring 11 more.....this kind of thing hadn't happened in the UK for over 13 years after they banned handguns.

The UK has appropriate laws, these laws work for us. There may be the odd time something bad happens, but it is no way near as often as in a place like the US.

originally posted by: Xtrozero
So what we see in England is mob rules. Three guys can take down any one guy, so you have no equalizer....

No disrespect, but that's a really silly example! Whereas in the UK everyone will be unarmed, so the worst that would happen in a three against one fight is someone being beaten up, or someone would be able to run away. In the US there's a chance the three would be armed, so what's the worsed that would happen?

We can draw only one conclusion from this, and it is supported by the cold, hard statistics. You are four times more likely to be murdered in the US than you are in the UK.

originally posted by: paraphi
We can draw only one conclusion from this, and it is supported by the cold, hard statistics. You are four times more likely to be murdered in the US than you are in the UK.

Is that because of guns or is it because America has a different culture and environment? Everyone wants to correlate the violence in America to guns, but correlation does not mean causation. As example, violence has continued to decrease in America since 1992, and that is due to legalized abortions... go figure.

Also, are you suggesting that if guns were introduced in UK then you all would go on a murder spree, maybe? I guess for me I just do not like the Government telling me what I can do or not do since I feel that I should have the right to make my own decisions and not be treated like a bubble boy needing adult supervision my whole life.

If you like stats here ya go..

Violent crimes..

UK
2000 per 100,000

US
400 per 100,000

AND since we are 50 United States there are many more very safe places to live outside of what we see as our dangerous areas than the UK has.

a reply to: Xtrozero

If we had guns incidents on where before hand it may have been a punch up would now be a shoot up and it would result in more deaths.

originally posted by: boymonkey74

If we had guns incidents on where before hand it may have been a punch up would now be a shoot up and it would result in more deaths.

Ok so? If someone(s) feel the need to put me in the hospital with the likely hood of maybe a long term disability there is a good chance they might die trying... so maybe they don't try....hmmm

I just payed £200 for a knife..(Bushcraft).. you can have it when you pry it from my cold dead fingers......or...give me £200 + Postage and paypal fees.

originally posted by: bastion
a reply to: Skid Mark

1 - Guns aren't banned in the UK, just highly controlled

2 - I'm from Lancashire. It was just an amnesty - police ran a high profile campaign about how people are more likely to be injured if they carry a knife and encouraged people to surrender them, which40,000+ people did and knife crime fell.

3 - There is absolutely no ban on knives. The story on the site bears absolutely no resemblance to what actually happened.

Both are common sense procedures to me.

right. that is why british survivalist sites talk about the restrictions of survival knifes that have already occurred. discussions of is this or that hunting knife legal are common.

a reply to: Xtrozero

You can compare homicide rates as that's pretty final. No arguing. I described the statistics back on page 4, with sources.

You cannot compare things like "violent crime" because different countries record this in different ways, as has been previously described several times. In the UK "violent crime" can include attacking you with a stinging nettle, or throwing a biscuit at you - I kid you not!

Mad crime reporting

In the US violent crime is less (er) general. Therefore, this is apples and oranges.

Yes, I think there is a cultural element. For example, in the UK we are less tolerant of gun crime, hence strict gun controls, while in the US gun violence is high (for a developed nation). The culture goes down to policing as that's quite a topical discussion. In the UK the police are unarmed and "keep the peace", whereas in the States the police seem to be out of control and "enforce the law". If a policeman in the UK fires a shot, then this is subject to endless inquiry and investigation, but there seems to be less redress in the US.

a reply to: stormbringer1701

I was stopped once at a train station by two cops because I had my machete strapped to the outside of my backpack and one said I shouldn't have it but the older one said as long as it is not concealed and it is obviously going to be used for a certain task (camping in the woods) it was legal.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: paraphi
We can draw only one conclusion from this, and it is supported by the cold, hard statistics. You are four times more likely to be murdered in the US than you are in the UK.

Is that because of guns or is it because Americans are more violent due to culture and environment? Everyone wants to correlate the violence in America to guns, but correlation does not mean causation.

Well approximately 12.000 of your approximately 16,000 yearly homicides are committed with a firearm. What other conclusion could you make from that?

I guess for me I just do not like the Government telling what I can do or not do since I feel that I should have the right to make my own decisions and not be treated like a bubble boy needing adult supervision my whole life.

Considering how notorious the US is for putting minor drug offenders in prison and how the US has the highest prison population in the entire world, it's kind of comical that you think your government gives you any kind of right to make your own decisions, lol.

Anyway........... I think you'll find that most developed countries have laws about carrying knifes around in public, if you have no good reason to be doing so. I'd also argue that most people (outside of the US) consider it a perfectly rational and appropriate stance.

In a civilized society, why on earth would anyone want others walking around packing a knife?

a reply to: Xtrozero

Look you choose to defend yourself with a gun we don't we do it with our fists and help from others.
The thread is a joke tbh attempting to turn it into something it's not.
We can own knives we can own guns just that many choose not to.
Different cultures and I know the one I want to live in.

a reply to: Skid Mark

I guess they might as well ban meat that needs cutting! Want some steak now? EAT IT WITH YOUR FINGERS, LOWLY MISCREANTS! If they actually pass this, there will surely be riots.

Cut your steak with a butterknife! Oh wait! If this goes through, they will eventually ban those too! What a joke. A very nasty bad one! I wonder if the royalty will have knives banned for their use as well?

Where is that asteroid I've been waiting for (lol!)? If this kind of activity continues on planet earth, I see utter chaos erupting someday.

Megadeth - Á Tout Le Monde (Set Me Free):



Edit: Ok, so it is not an official ban. Just remember one thing: You give them an inch, and they will take a mile. An outright ban may be in the future of the country. Making people register to own knives is a little overboard. With all of the CCTV they have over there, you would think that should deter some of this type of crime. I imagine there are those who just don't care if they are seen by CCTV murdering someone, but this all seems a little ridiculous.

a reply to: InFriNiTee

You have not read the rest of the thread have you?.

a reply to: boymonkey74

Not yet, but I suppose I'll take a look at it. I usually read the entire thread, but I haven't looked at this one yet. I may change that post after I read everything here!

originally posted by: InFriNiTee
Edit: Ok so it's not an official ban, but the Police want people to turn in their knives-with a pointy tip. All I can say is that I'd like to see them try that in America! No matter how you slice it, that sounds ridiculous!

As Boymonkey74 suggested - you need to need the thread. In that way you will be able to see how wrong your above statement is.

In recent years, the knife crime figures in the UK have been unnaturally inflated by the influx of eastern european migrants tbh. Before anyone thinks i'm racially stereotyping, from personal experience with people i know, the carrying of knives seems to be culturally a norm in many of those regions. To the vast majority of them it's just a knife, like a bunch of keys, a mobile or whatever.

The crime figures get hyped when a dude get arrested for drunkenness or brawling and an "illegal" knife is found on them.
I live in a region of the UK where there is a large eastern european population, many of the people i know carry knives but there isnt a significant peak in VIOLENT knife crime. The problem seems to be where the comunities are adjacent to the predominantly english born areas and the local chavs see it as a challenge to their manhood and have to tool up in response.

Just a viewpoint from my perspective.

a reply to: paraphi

I will get through reading the whole thread, but any help on the post you guys are referring to? I read through threads all the time, but I've noticed on ATS it helps to have an update every 10 or so pages as to what has been discovered in the thread so far. Sometimes, I guess I don't have the time to read a whole thread, and pick through all of the posts to decide where the facts are, versus people's opinions.

It might be nice to link to the post you two are referring to, if you have the time-and thanks-if you do.

originally posted by: Freeborn
Just finished reading all 9 pages of this thread and I've got to say it was a pretty painful exercise.

How many times have we had this 'discussion'?

The fact remains that you are around 5 times more likely to be murdered in the USA than you are in the UK.
Whether it be by a knife, gun or frigging pea shooter its pretty much irrelevant how the victim was murdered....unless of course one has a separate agenda to push.

Still after all these years I find it amazing that people still believe this drivel.
Does anyone really think that anyone is calling for an all out ban on knives?
Just how stupid are YOU to believe that such a thing would be taken serious by anyone?

Despite testament from numerous people who actually live here in the UK it seems that some prefer to believe anonymous blogs etc and uncited Wiki entries.

There is no knife ban and there never will be.
It preposterous to even suggest such.

There are however, as explained already by several posters, regulations about exactly what types of knives can be carried on one's person in public.
Could someone please tell me what exactly is wrong with that?

Comparing UK society to USA society is apples and pears.
What's right for you isn't necessarily right for us, and vice versa.

I don't care about the Right to Bear Arms in the USA - keep it, change it, do what YOU want.
Your country, your laws.
Please afford us the same respect.

But please, please, apply a little common sense when reading such nonsense as this and don't allow your preconceived ideas to cloud your opinion.

And have any of you wondered why every single UK member who has posted on this has pointed out just how incorrect this 'report' is?

And don't repeat that 'because you've got no balls' nonsense - anyone who knows anything about the UK and its people knows that nothing could be further from the truth.

Opinions from anonymous blogs. Your post was helpful. Basically, it sounds like this was a waste of time, even clicking on this thread. I guess in reading this and posting my irrelevant replies I wasted at least 30 minutes of my life! I guess that threads like this on ATS make me feel as though I waste time on here. This isn't the first time it has happened.

There are useful bits of information on ATS, but more and more of this type of disinfo has been appearing lately. I haven't been spending nearly as much time here lately. It it keeps up, I think I may just check ATS once a month or so! There is a Hoax bin section, and mods are usually on here most of the time. I know one thing-life is limited-and I hate wasting time.