Poor Kids Banned from School Carnival - NY USA

a reply to: Texan123

careful, you might find yourself paying more taxes for ski trips and summer vacations to germany!
part of the problem is that the more well off some people get the nicer they want everything to be!!
and well then they start thinking that everyone should be able to afford that niceness themselves and deciding you should have it regardless of weather you can afford it or not.

a reply to: Realtruth

think it's bs? the least you could do is call and ask them why.
PS120 Queens

58-01 136 Street
Flushing, NY 11355

School Tel:
718-359-3390
Fax: 718-460-4513

originally posted by: fixitwcw
a reply to: Realtruth

think it's bs? the least you could do is call and ask them why.
PS120 Queens

58-01 136 Street
Flushing, NY 11355

School Tel:
718-359-3390
Fax: 718-460-4513

Did you? Did you call and ask them why?

I'd like to hear their reasoning.

I think we are missing the point here! Why are schools having carnivals to begin with? Children are coming out of school not prepared for life. They can't balance a checkbook or read to their grade level. Why is school time being used for carnivals not education? Why are we discussing poor students when schools are about education not social functions. What happened to reading, writing and arithmetic? Why does the school need a carnival to balance their checkbook? Why can't the school staff live within the budget assigned to them from their school board? Kids need to be educated not entertained during school time! Let the parents entertain them at home and remove this problem from the school staff.

Everyone has to understand that life is not fair, never has been or ever will be! Schools need to educate the student because that is only legal means by which they can level the playing field.

a reply to: buddah6

That's fine if those lessons are being taught at a middle and high school level. I don't expect an eight year old to balance a checkbook, know what a mortgage is, or to hold a full time job. Social experiences are important at that age. It's what enables them to function in society later in life. A day off from classwork for a carnival, or field day, or trip to anywhere, isn't a big deal.

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: buddah6

That's fine if those lessons are being taught at a middle and high school level. I don't expect an eight year old to balance a checkbook, know what a mortgage is, or to hold a full time job. Social experiences are important at that age. It's what enables them to function in society later in life. A day off from classwork for a carnival, or field day, or trip to anywhere, isn't a big deal.

My youngest grandchildren are just finishing kindergarten. To my surprise, they were expected to know their alphabet and recognize some words just to start. My wife began to tutor them by using a program called Kumon. She insured they would meet the requirement for the first grade. The grandkids, at the finish of kindergarten, can read and do simple addition and subtraction. They can recognize coins and count them. We haven't seen the requirements for the first grade yet but I suspect it will be more of the same. They are 5 and 6 years old.

My point is, that I know adults that can't balance a checkbook and have never had a mortgage or a full time job that has never learned these tasks at any level. Children can learn if motivated but not in a bounce house.

If class time was important enough that the state mandates 180 hours and if class time is lost due to weather/calamity days they must make it up at the end of the year then why must it be wasted by attending a carnival.

originally posted by: buddah6
I think we are missing the point here! Why are schools having carnivals to begin with? Children are coming out of school not prepared for life. They can't balance a checkbook or read to their grade level. Why is school time being used for carnivals not education? Why are we discussing poor students when schools are about education not social functions. What happened to reading, writing and arithmetic? Why does the school need a carnival to balance their checkbook? Why can't the school staff live within the budget assigned to them from their school board? Kids need to be educated not entertained during school time! Let the parents entertain them at home and remove this problem from the school staff.

Everyone has to understand that life is not fair, never has been or ever will be! Schools need to educate the student because that is only legal means by which they can level the playing field.

I think you might want to stop by a school and ask about their bottom line. Yes my taxes pay for the schools in my area, but that's just my taxes. By that I mean I live in Tucson Az. and the biggest problem schools here have to deal with are the kids that are border jumpers. Our schools are full of them. True it's not the kids fault, but the parents. They come here get a cash paying job and fake papers. Then they put their kids into the schools that they pay NOTHING into. On top of this they tend to wait till the last second to enroll them so there is less time for the school to catch their fake paperwork before the year starts. This has the effect of those kids not being counted at the time the school board made out the budget for that year. If it were just a few kids it wouldn't matter, but in truth it's 100s of kids in every grade. This means the schools don't have enough money. That is just one local reason for these fund raisers. I'm sure other places have reasons of their own.

Next how do decide what kids can't afford the $10 ? Should they ask for bank records from the parents who claim poverty ? Because one thing I know for sure, If you tell people that any child who can't afford the $10 will be paid for from the funds raised 90% of those kids WILL suddenly become poor, and saying 90% is most likely the low end of the true number. Tell the truth; if I come to you and ask for money to pay for something in your kids school, say $10, then tell you that if you can't afford it the people next door have agreed to pay it for you. How are you going to react ? I'll tell you how, you WILL say well in that case my bills are too high this month ( or something ) could you get it from the neighbor please. Now you might go next door and thank that person, but chances are you're not going to offer to pay it back next month and you know it...

I don't know how things are where you live but around here budget cuts are closing schools and cutting the types of classes kids can take. Things like wood shop, drivers ed. and so on. Teaching only the basics needed to still call it a school. In fact most teachers here tend to buy class supply's from their own pocket. I volunteer at a grade school and now a lot of teachers who buy pencils in bulk so their students have something to write with. A lot of those students will get a new pencil every day if they allowed it. Now are we to believe that all of these kids parents can't afford 25 cents for a pack of pencils, or is it that those parents see no need to spend their money when others will pay it for them.

Yes this took place during the school day, but did it occur to you that doing it at that time means not having to pay those teachers involved overtime. Doing so would mean less of those funds would go to the school. On top of that would be the added cost of having people on school grounds during non-school hours. Things like the clean up crew, added security to keep the peace and so on.

I guess what I'm saying is that it's wrong to condemn those involved unless you were there and know the reason for doing what they did. It's also VERY WRONG to decide that this woman is a bad person based on her hair or teeth that you got from a single photo. How a person looks has nothing to do with how they act. The witch is the person who would condemn her and say hateful things about her because of a single photo, and the worst is that person who posted the photo in the first place. That is the one you should be mad at because we know what kind of a person they are. They're the type who would bully someone because they dress different, or don't wear the newest styles. You know the type, Oh my god can you believe the way she had on white after labor day, what trailer trash. She should be banned from the country club. Well guess what you're NOT better than her. At least she's trying to help as many kids as she can with what she has. She may not be perfect, but who among is. It's always easy to point out the mistakes of others after the fact. If no one pointed out the problem before it happened then they are just as much to blame.

a reply to: MikeA

we sold chocolate bars when I was in school....and well it was optional if we even wanted to take part in selling them parents really weren't made to feel obligated to buy them. sure there were awards for the top sellers but well those who didn't sell anything didn't suffer the consequences. one of the things we raised funds for was the prom and well no one was denied the priviledge of going simply because they didn't sell enough candy!!!

a reply to: dawnstar

my class picnic consisted of going to a nearby state park for the day, it was fun and pleasant and I enjoyed it.
now, it's trips to mexico, or ny city ect!!! why? is it more fun just because it costs more? I'd like to point to another reason why some schools might be struggling.. banks foreclosing on homes and then neglecting to take possession of them leaving them in limbo with no one paying the property taxes on them!! While the main reason why the cost of living keeps getting higher is inflation I've got to say another is just plain higher expectations! While we might not be able to do much about the inflation we sure the heck could reduce our expectations quite a bit!

a reply to: buddah6

i would expect a kid just finishing kindergarten to know the alphabet. that is not really an accomplishment.
my daughter is not even 3 and will not start head start for 3 more months and she knows the alphabet already.
she can obviously say it and if you quiz her on any letter, upper or lower case she knows it.

same deal with numbers.

she can count to 26 by herself.

maybe standards are low these days.

i would expect a kid to know the alphabet before they even set foot in the door for their first day of kindergarten

The principal should have footed the bill for those students who could not attend.

I agree with Ketsuko though... there could have been other reasons why the students did not pay. Saying that only the "poor" students couldn't attend is a little inaccurate. Some parents are just cheap! And some kids forget to bring the money!

originally posted by: Mugly
a reply to: buddah6

i would expect a kid just finishing kindergarten to know the alphabet. that is not really an accomplishment.
my daughter is not even 3 and will not start head start for 3 more months and she knows the alphabet already.
she can obviously say it and if you quiz her on any letter, upper or lower case she knows it.

same deal with numbers.

she can count to 26 by herself.

maybe standards are low these days.

i would expect a kid to know the alphabet before they even set foot in the door for their first day of kindergarten

Please, understand that I was surprised how much that the kids today have to learn before formal education begins. In my time, there was no kindergarten, head start or preschool. I'm a product of the Kentucky school system where I attended a two room school that had six grades.

I commend you for the time you have invested in your daughter...we need more parents like you. If all parents spend the same time we would regain the number one spot in education and would certainly cure many social ills.

The outrage in this thread is ridiculous and typical of the unthinking Americans that are all heart and no brain that have led our country to where it is.

Yes - the school could have handled the event better. BUT everything just like LIFE is a pay to play event. Poor kids that grow up poor - yes it sucks for them. But there are ALWAYS those kids that have the best tennis shoes, the best clothes, the best toys in grade school (you knew who you were). And there were guys like me that weren't as wealthy.

That last thing we want is society handing out the same shoes, the same clothes, the same toys so everyone can be equal. That is EXACTLY what is wrong with our society today.

a reply to: jr429

We all understand life is unfair…we’re all immersed in its unfairness


All people are saying is what you said yourself: the school could have handled this better.

a reply to: beezzer

If your sweet child was crying and feeling less than due to a situation like this, and you had lost your good paying job and the unemployment ran out, and maybe you were working at the hardware store for all of $8/hr, you might feel different.

When my child was in 1st grade, we were very poor. I couldn't afford "play-doh" for play-doh time. So my child got a book off the shelf - a book about animals -- and proceeded to read. In school. And got berated by the teacher. For reading. He told her his mom couldn't afford play-doh, which was sadly true. I couldn't afford a cup of coffee or gum at work. I counted every penny for rent, bus fare, food, etc.

It broke my heart.

a reply to: Galadriel

so sad. do you feel that either you or your child gained valuable info from that experience?

I wrote a scathingly brilliant letter (back in the day when you wrote letters!) to the teacher. She apologized and said my child could read books during play-doh time.

My son knew I stood up for him and "won" so to speak in a situation that was ridiculous, made no sense (in a school - kid in trouble for choosing to read a book), and often brought it up in years to come. I taught him to question authority when things didn't make sense or seemed wrong, and to stand up for and beside those who were being bullied, picked on, or treated unfairly. And he did.

So, yes, in retrospect, we gained something from the incident.

I wrote a scathingly brilliant letter (back in the day when you wrote letters!) to the teacher. She apologized and said my child could read books during play-doh time.

My son knew I stood up for him and "won" so to speak in a situation that was ridiculous, made no sense (in a school - kid in trouble for choosing to read a book), and often brought it up in years to come. I taught him to question authority when things didn't make sense or seemed wrong, and to stand up for and beside those who were being bullied, picked on, or treated unfairly. And he did.

So, yes, in retrospect, we gained something from the incident.

The article says:

The profit is earmarked for the pre-K, kindergarten and fifth-grade moving-up parties,

The school organized a function to have money for the kids, so obviously their budget does not cover the needs for the children and that looks like the real issue to me.

I can't fault them for finding a way to provide services in the system that has been established. I am also not for robbing Peter to pay for Paul. Maybe they shouldn't have any carnival, but I understand a fund raising event is designed to raise funds.

a reply to: Grimpachi
It's unreal, america supposedly spends way more money per kid than most places in the world, yet they are constantly begging for supplies, and needing kids to raise funds for this and that. I think the real problem is the black hole of bureaucracy, that is a cancer upon the US society. It happens in schools, in "non-profit charities", in medical research, you name it. It's getting ridiculous already.

NY claims to spend $19,552 per student, where the # is all that money going to? It sure as hell isn't going to teachers, supplies and equipment.