Guide to the FLAT EARTH

a reply to: AgentSmith

I would suggest you stop watching pathetic videos by pathetic You Tube losers they're not worth your time

My time, and I am quite able to decide what i will do with it, as you can with yours. As is my opinion on what I watch is mine as is yours.

Condemnation before investigation is the height of ignorance

AS I have stated so many times now, this topic is something I find very interesting and I am not trying to push by beliefs on others, like some in this thread, but rather share information I find interesting, and ask questions in my pursuit of the truth.

I have read your replies in this thread and I was the one to report some of them as well.

Not sure you grab the concept off the skunk works.

Even then I thought I would try and discuss this topic with you, but now I see my efforts are and would be wasted.

So with that AgentSmith, I wish you the best in your persuit off the truth.

So thank you, but no thanks.

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance
a reply to: TheDon

I'll go out on a limb and say, yes, perhaps some of the footage could be CGI or otherwise faked. The physical, observable space station orbiting overhead, however, could not be faked using CGI or other such trickery.

I know you're not going to take the word of some anonymous person on a forum, but for what's its worth I can assure you it's not. It's actually quite insulting to me on a personal level when people make such claims. And every piece of what some people call evidence they provide usually relies on a lack of understanding. What's frustrating is when you do understand and try to explain but people choose to ignore or insult instead of learn.

a reply to: AgentSmith

You're preaching to the choir, pal. I know damn good and well that there's no CGI or any such nonsense involved. I was simply conceding that point as a possibility (ludicrous as it may be) for the sake of argument.


Edit: And I know the feeling of frustration well. I'm faced with it every time I venture into the Ancient & Lost Civilizations forum and see another uneducated fool proclaim this and that to be "proof" of some lost technology. But I digress.....

originally posted by: TheDon
a reply to: AgentSmith

I would suggest you stop watching pathetic videos by pathetic You Tube losers they're not worth your time

My time, and I am quite able to decide what i will do with it, as you can with yours. As is my opinion on what I watch is mine as is yours.

Condemnation before investigation is the height of ignorance

AS I have stated so many times now, this topic is something I find very interesting and I am not trying to push by beliefs on others, like some in this thread, but rather share information I find interesting, and ask questions in my pursuit of the truth.

I have read your replies in this thread and I was the one to report some of them as well.

Not sure you grab the concept off the skunk works.

Even then I thought I would try and discuss this topic with you, but now I see my efforts are and would be wasted.

So with that AgentSmith, I wish you the best in your persuit off the truth.

So thank you, but no thanks.

Just offering helpful advice. But I think its clear to anyone the real reason you no longer wish to debate with me is because my points regarding the Open Source GPS processing software bury the FE once and for all.
Nor can you argue against the fact you can calculate the orbital elements of the ISS or any other observable satellite yourself, once again using an elliptical orbit around a sphere.

Shame, I would have been interested in your arguments or an acceptance but I guess this is as close as we'll get.

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance
a reply to: TheDon

I'll go out on a limb and say, yes, perhaps some of the footage could be CGI or otherwise faked. The physical, observable space station orbiting overhead, however, could not be faked using CGI or other such trickery.

But why would they fake it? that is what i ask myself.
Normally when people lie they are hiding something, so if it is fake what are they hiding?

So based on the above and if they are faking footage of the ISS, how do we know that they are not using some other trickery, to quote you, that we don't know what regarding what we see in our skys at night?

IMO, the ISS, is just a small part off the whole flat earth theories, and as I have pointed out, there are things, that just don't add up IMO.

Thanks.

a reply to: TheDon

Let me make myself clear....I do not think anything is being "faked". I was simply conceding that point for the sake of the argument. I still find the entire flat Earth "theory" to be laughable, at best. I'm not going to even respond to the rest of your post, being that I don't believe anything is being faked.

As others have stated before, there are many things (besides just GPS and the ISS) that can be verified, that rely entirely on elliptical orbits around a spheroid.

a reply to: TheDon

1) They're not faking anything, making up that it is to build a pillar for an argument just doesn't cut it.

2) Why are you ignoring the points about the Open Source GPS software?

3) Why arw you ignoring being able to calculate Keplerian elements yourself for the ISS or any other satellite?

The silence is deafening... Don't try and bury these points in the hope that readers will forget.

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance
I understood that your were going out on a limb, with that statement

As others have stated before, there are many things (besides just GPS and the ISS) that can be verified, that rely entirely on elliptical orbits around a spheroid.

Of course, there is, it has been taught to us for the last 500+ years, that is the case.
What I question, is the sources off this information.

Also as I have mentioned before, they are small parts off the theories regarding the flat earth.

One off the other things that I have talked about a little in this thread, is why for 4500+ years earlier, the flat earth model was believed widely, and taught, and also is referred to in all of the major religions, back then, when one looks into it.

As you know or were led to believe, they did not have the technologies we have now, 500+ years ago, so why the sudden shift in belief? and when one digs into this one yet again finds more questions than answers.

Thanks

I don't believe ideas of a flat Earth were nearly as widespread as many today believe they were, but even if they were, I'd say it had to do with the available technology. Your average person 4,500+ years ago couldn't go jump on a plane, or attach a camera to a balloon , as they can now, and see the Earth's curvature for themselves.

Edit: I've got to give you a star or two, if only for your persistence.

a reply to: TheDon

This is a thread that may be of interest to you..

www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: Chadwickus

It took me a minute to even figure out who you were....Clever monkey, hiding his name....


Edit: I guess it's a little easier to see when your screen brightness isn't at -27%. Oh well, it's dark here lol.

a reply to: AdmireTheDistance

Lol I've been hiding in plain sight for months now

originally posted by: AdmireTheDistance
I don't believe ideas of a flat Earth were nearly as widespread as many today believe they were, but even if they were, I'd say it had to do with the available technology. Your average person 4,500+ years ago couldn't go jump on a plane, or attach a camera to a balloon , as they can now, and see the Earth's curvature for themselves.

I will go out on a limb here now as well, from what I have read, and it is alot, remember that once the globe model was introdued, alot off the history was and has been changed to reflect the globe model, but when one digs deep enough, I I believe it was widely believed and taught.

A shameless quote from one of my earlier posts HERE

What I am saying though it is another theory and another path that i found and find interesting when looking at our history and were we come from.

I will admit I have a bias, a little to main stream science, but this in not due to that I don't believe them, but more to the fact that of were it comes from and how we are taught from the moment we go to school that this is it and this is fact and everything else is wrong.

IMO a truely open mind looks at everything, and I mean everything no matter what. Is the earth flat? I don't know, is it round? maybe because that is what i have been taught and what the main stream tells me.

What I do know though is that the mainstream and information that has been spoon feed to me for the last 40 years has many pitfalls and many failing, and only a fool would believe blindly everything what one is told.

So understand as well please, I am not a "flat earther" but I am a person that asks questions and also believes that not ALL we have been taught is true.

Thanks.

a reply to: Chadwickus

So you have. I've seen the avatar plenty, but I usually surf ATS at night, laying in bed, from my phone, and always have my brightness turned down below the minimum, which makes it impossible to see your name.

a reply to: TheDon

Nothing wrong with asking questions and having a little disbelief. That's why we're all here, after all. That being said, I still think (or know, rather) that you're wasting your time with this idea. But hey, to each their own.

Edit: With that being said, I don't think either of us is going to dissuade the other, so rather than continuing to go around in circles, I'm going to respectfully refrain from further argument with you on this topic. Though I will keep watching the thread to see where it goes. Take care, man.

a reply to: Chadwickus
Hello Chadwickus

I have actually read your thread.

I read it before posting this thread as it came up in my search.

Well written as always

I have also read allot more into the history regarding the flat earth beliefs, and religion, ancient cultures etc, regarding what your thread touched on.

I will leave my comments at that as this thread is not the place to discuss your thread

But thanks for the link, I am sure others in this thread will find it of interest.

When you're ready you can address the points I've brought up several times and have been unsurprisingly ignored. Don't worry, I won't forget and will keep reminding you.

originally posted by: AgentSmith

Here you can find GNSS-SDR www.gnss-sdr.org...

It is open source software (source code available from their site) which relies on GPS satellites orbiting a spherical planet and takes into consideration general relativity. Unsurprisingly it works and due to the open source nature no one can claim it is a trick or presenting false information.

You can even get the software running with a cheap $20 dongle used for SDR

gnss-sdr.org...

Nothing is being concealed, it's open source and open for scrutinisation. How do FE believers explain this?

originally posted by: AgentSmith

originally posted by: TheDon
a reply to: DenyObfuscation

Hello DenyObfuscation again,

You have been with this thread pretty much since the beginning, so based on that I will guess that you might have actually read all my posts?

From my understanding, regarding the flat earth theories and what I have researched, the claim is that all satellites and the ISS are fake,

But you should know this already as I stated this HERE in a reply to one off your earlier posts in this thread.

3 off the biggest questions I have and also find interesting is that:
1. then all space travel over the last 50+ years would have to have been faked, and by any means that is one seriously big cover up, and I am fully aware how unlikely that is, but if one does research one can find official NASA videos regarding the shuttles and ISS which IMO are clearly faked, but just because some are faked, it is still a massive claim to say all are fake and the whole NASA and other space programs are fake as well.

The problem is with your link, if we are looking at the flat earth theory is can that information be trusted to be true?

Orbital data provided by NASA

From your link.

As I stated above, NASA would be behind the hoax.

Just to keep in on topic a bit regarding the ISS, what I have found more interesting regarding the ISS, why, IMO, are we seeing some obvious fakes off official videos off the ISS including space walks and alleged astronauts inside the ISS.
A quick google search for example of, ISS HOAX, ISS permed hair, will produce some off the more famous, and there are many more out there,
Why would they need to fake this? and if NASA are lying about the ISS why would I trust anything they have to say. (See my sig)
Now is this related to the flat earth theory? maybe, IMO they are hiding something.

Thanks.

You don't have to trust NASA. You can calculate the keplerian elements for the orbit of the ISS or any other observable satellite yourself from a minimum of three observations.
This is why we can track satellites like the secret X37B - amateur enthusiasts calculate the elements themselves.
It's not some magic that's spoonfed to the unclean masses, just maths and physics.

Once the OTV-2 launched, satellite watchers started scanning the skies for a glimpse of it. Skywatcher Ted Molczan of Toronto developed a set of orbital elements based chiefly on last year's OTV-1 flight to help prospective observers in the search.

And days after the launch, on March 9, Molczan announced that OTV-2 had been sighted by satellite tracker Greg Roberts of Cape Town, South Africa. Roberts spotted the spacecraft "in difficult observing conditions," Molczan reported.

Within days, other observers made sightings as well.

The orbital inclination of the space plane has been determined by Molczan to be 42.8 degrees with respect to Earth's equator, which means it can appear over regions as far north as Boston; as far south as New Zealand's South Island.

It is traveling in an elliptical orbit that measures 214 miles at its high point, or apogee, and 203 miles at its low point, or perigee, and takes 91.1 minutes to circle the globe.

www.nbcnews.com...

Once the orbital elements were calculated it was then possible for amateur telescopes to track and photograph the craft.

www.universetoday.com...

You can learn how to do it yourself, all the information is online. Unsurprisingly it relies on elliptical orbits around a sphere...

I encourage anyone interested to search for keplerian elements, orbital elements and calculating them to see just how much information is out there. Give it a go yourself! You'll learn a lot.

No comment on my post about the open source GPS signal proceasing software BTW? Bit of a sticky one for FE believers as there can be no argument anything is a trick or false and it proves the use of satellites orbiting a sphere...

On a personal note, I was one of them people, that would not even look at a flat earth conspiracy in the past, and belief me over the last 25+ years I looked at all conspiracies in one form or another.

I actually started looking more into the flat earth theories because of another line of investigation i was looking into.

Like many here, I was of the mind, don't be silly the earth is not flat but a globe, and i still question that now.

I asked myself, why would they lie and also need to lie regarding were we live.

But once I started looking into it, it became apparent that there was once again many more questions than answers.

One off the first questions I asked myself when I started looking into the flat earth theories was:

Well if the world is a globe like we have been taught, then by right, were ever I look to prove this, be it space, satellites, history, curvature off the earth, science in general, etc. then I should have all my questions answered without any suspicion of foul play or questionable answers.

Well this was NOT the case, and some of my points of interest I have brought up in this thread and they are just a few of the many questions that will be raised by anyone that seriously looks into this.

If we have been lied to and I say IF, regarding were we live, it would be massive for everyone and I believe change everything, both spiritually and mentally.

It is easy to take the easy root, and rely on a few facts presented by others to prove a theory and what we are taught from the moment we are born and then shut your eyes to everything else, when the stakes are so high. but for me I can't do that I have to question everything,

I believe many people on here, as well, if they actually researched this topic with an open mind, and i don't mean just looking at what we are told, but open your eyes, then you to would start to see what I have seen.

And that is IMO, that what we are told and were we live, there has been many lies told and are still being told.

Is the earth flat? I don't know, it it a globe? maybe, that was what I was taught from the moment I was born.

Peace.

a reply to: TheDon

When you're ready you can address the points I've brought up several times and have been unsurprisingly ignored. Don't worry, I won't forget and will keep reminding you.

originally posted by: AgentSmith

Here you can find GNSS-SDR www.gnss-sdr.org...

It is open source software (source code available from their site) which relies on GPS satellites orbiting a spherical planet and takes into consideration general relativity. Unsurprisingly it works and due to the open source nature no one can claim it is a trick or presenting false information.

You can even get the software running with a cheap $20 dongle used for SDR

gnss-sdr.org...

Nothing is being concealed, it's open source and open for scrutinisation. How do FE believers explain this?

originally posted by: AgentSmith

originally posted by: TheDon
a reply to: DenyObfuscation

Hello DenyObfuscation again,

You have been with this thread pretty much since the beginning, so based on that I will guess that you might have actually read all my posts?

From my understanding, regarding the flat earth theories and what I have researched, the claim is that all satellites and the ISS are fake,

But you should know this already as I stated this HERE in a reply to one off your earlier posts in this thread.

3 off the biggest questions I have and also find interesting is that:
1. then all space travel over the last 50+ years would have to have been faked, and by any means that is one seriously big cover up, and I am fully aware how unlikely that is, but if one does research one can find official NASA videos regarding the shuttles and ISS which IMO are clearly faked, but just because some are faked, it is still a massive claim to say all are fake and the whole NASA and other space programs are fake as well.

The problem is with your link, if we are looking at the flat earth theory is can that information be trusted to be true?

Orbital data provided by NASA

From your link.

As I stated above, NASA would be behind the hoax.

Just to keep in on topic a bit regarding the ISS, what I have found more interesting regarding the ISS, why, IMO, are we seeing some obvious fakes off official videos off the ISS including space walks and alleged astronauts inside the ISS.
A quick google search for example of, ISS HOAX, ISS permed hair, will produce some off the more famous, and there are many more out there,
Why would they need to fake this? and if NASA are lying about the ISS why would I trust anything they have to say. (See my sig)
Now is this related to the flat earth theory? maybe, IMO they are hiding something.

Thanks.

You don't have to trust NASA. You can calculate the keplerian elements for the orbit of the ISS or any other observable satellite yourself from a minimum of three observations.
This is why we can track satellites like the secret X37B - amateur enthusiasts calculate the elements themselves.
It's not some magic that's spoonfed to the unclean masses, just maths and physics.

Once the OTV-2 launched, satellite watchers started scanning the skies for a glimpse of it. Skywatcher Ted Molczan of Toronto developed a set of orbital elements based chiefly on last year's OTV-1 flight to help prospective observers in the search.

And days after the launch, on March 9, Molczan announced that OTV-2 had been sighted by satellite tracker Greg Roberts of Cape Town, South Africa. Roberts spotted the spacecraft "in difficult observing conditions," Molczan reported.

Within days, other observers made sightings as well.

The orbital inclination of the space plane has been determined by Molczan to be 42.8 degrees with respect to Earth's equator, which means it can appear over regions as far north as Boston; as far south as New Zealand's South Island.

It is traveling in an elliptical orbit that measures 214 miles at its high point, or apogee, and 203 miles at its low point, or perigee, and takes 91.1 minutes to circle the globe.

www.nbcnews.com...

Once the orbital elements were calculated it was then possible for amateur telescopes to track and photograph the craft.

www.universetoday.com...

You can learn how to do it yourself, all the information is online. Unsurprisingly it relies on elliptical orbits around a sphere...

I encourage anyone interested to search for keplerian elements, orbital elements and calculating them to see just how much information is out there. Give it a go yourself! You'll learn a lot.

No comment on my post about the open source GPS signal proceasing software BTW? Bit of a sticky one for FE believers as there can be no argument anything is a trick or false and it proves the use of satellites orbiting a sphere...

a reply to: awareness10

Hello awareness10 again,

Sorry for the late reply to your answer to my question, I missed it due to that it was in the quote to my question.

Don, i will honestly say I don't know for sure, but from what i've seen i'm more on the side of the flat/semi rounded earth. Take the United Nations emblem for example, it does not show the Arctic on their map, and their map is flat. Why? I love to ask questions because, the answers are seldom complete or inaccurate and never wet my appetite. I need more! Therefore i Question Everything until i feel i have an adequate answer. And, if that answer is more on the flat earth side vs the round one then so be it, if people don't like that they can go fly a kite. I don't trust much these days. 'Never believe anything you hear and only half of what you see', as the saying goes.

You asked the same questions that I have as well, and I am sure your saw my map post a few pages back, and that post just touched on the surface regarding maps and what we are told, what is used etc.

Not only does the UN use a flat earth map model in there logo and flags since 1947, but also you will find that the
USGS also using this map as well.

Always more questions than answers IMO.

Pease