"Most People Getting Measles Are Adults." Yep, 60%. Are we barking up the wrong tree?

a reply to: Grimpachi

How strange that your source is also WHO, and yet at this link on their website, the confirmed measles cases for 2014 are over 50,000... suspected cases over 100,000. Yet your graph shows less than 45,000 confirmed cases for 2014.

WHO Measles Cases by Country

(CTL+F to Find China, else needle-in-a-haystack, lol)

And this is also from WHO:

Although 707 measles outbreaks were recorded between 2009 and 2012, the number, size and duration of such outbreaks decreased annually over this period. The number of measles cases reported in the first 10 months of 2013 – 26,443 – was three times the number reported in the whole of 2012 (Table 1).

Source

I'm not saying their unvaccinated migrants are not a factor... I'm just thinking the migrant situation has been around a few years?

a reply to: new_here

How strange that your source is also WHO, and yet at this link on their website, the confirmed measles cases for 2014 are over 50,000... suspected cases over 100,000. Yet your graph shows less than 45,000 confirmed cases for 2014.

It took me a second to figure out, the graph came from the article I posted which was written in July of 2014.

From your 2014 data sheet
46,647 lab confirmed cases
50,960 confirmed cases
107,024 suspected cases

3.99 Annualized measles incidence per 100'000 total population

4.39 Annualized discarded measles cases per 100'000 total population( I am not sure what that means exactly)

Considering that with full immunization 4% will lose immunity it looks like they actually did a good job containing outbreaks. Remember China as of 2013 had 1.35 billion people.

When they speak of migrants it isn;t just people coming into the country many still have a nomadic lifestyle in 2013 they had 245 million migrant workers that accounts for 18% of their population that is a challenge for public health authorities of tracking the mobile population, and many of them are not vaccinated. China estimates its migrant workers will swell to 400 million in coming years. That's more than the entire population of the US.


They are experiencing a resurgence in the disease but 99% of the populace has not been vaccinated. Far from it.

I would say 99% of newborns are being vaccinated but article are saying many are missing their boosters which of course are important to reach the 90% to 96% effectiveness.

Keep in mind the US didn't eradicate measles until 2000, but it was short-lived. Eradication is defined as 12 months or more with no new cases.

Anyway, here is a paper of The Influence of Migration on the
Burden of and Response to
Infectious Disease Threats in China

a reply to: Grimpachi

Thanks for the breakdown. In any case... a surge in incidence of measles. Troubling.

a reply to: new_here

Very. IMO.

As far as I know humans are the only creature that can carry the disease so if we can ever eradicate it world wide in humans then it will never plague humanity again.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Do you have an opinion why smallpox was eliminated, yet measles was not? I thought that smallpox was just as contagious, no? And I would think that 'anti-vaxxers' would be just as opposed to smallpox vaccination as any other. So... measles vaccine not as effective? Loses efficacy? I have no idea. I wondered what your take might be.

Thanks.

originally posted by: usernameconspiracy

originally posted by: InverseLookingGlass
a reply to: new_here

Exactly what the wall of propaganda is trying to obscure and distract from. Kudos to you.

Keep an eye out. Merck is pushing for a 3rd mandatory shot in the child's teens. Cha-ching $$$$$$$.

Cha-ching? Please. Vaccines are often given free of charge. Hell, you can get many of them for under $20.

Do you really think big pharma makes the vaccines and give them away for free? They are charging someone, count on it. Oh and no you can not get most of them for under $20. I know this for a fact. My partner had to get boosters when she recently went back to school. We are dirt poor and they still charged $80 per vaccine or more depending on the vaccine. That was what they charged us at the Health Dept. for the poor folks that have no insurance. We live in poverty, no joke and that was our only option. They charge for vaccines at the 'free' clinic.

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: Grimpachi

Do you have an opinion why smallpox was eliminated, yet measles was not? I thought that smallpox was just as contagious, no? And I would think that 'anti-vaxxers' would be just as opposed to smallpox vaccination as any other. So... measles vaccine not as effective? Loses efficacy? I have no idea. I wondered what your take might be.

Thanks.

I can only offer my opinion.

While smallpox was very contagious it was feared. The fear of catching the disease and complications outweighed most reservations of what a vaccine may do. Almost everyone knew someone who once had it or lost someone from it.

Even then there were those who resisted. The Vaccination Act of 1853 ordered mandatory vaccination for infants up to 3 months old, and the Act of 1867 extended this age requirement to 14 years, adding penalties for vaccine refusal.

In 1905 the Court found in the state’s favor, ruling that the state could enact compulsory laws to protect the public in the event of a communicable disease. This was the first U.S. Supreme Court case concerning the power of states in public health law.www.historyofvaccines.org...

IMO the world wasn't as accessible as it is now so containment was much easyier. Now you can be anywhere in a matter of hours by plane.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Thanks, that makes sense. For eradicating it in the US. Obviously US Gov could not mandate vaccines worldwide, so I do wonder how they kept it from entering the states from other places, like measles did after the US declared it eradicated in 2000. Perhaps the smallpox vaccine efficacy was 100%? I wish I knew!

originally posted by: Khaleesi

originally posted by: usernameconspiracy

originally posted by: InverseLookingGlass
a reply to: new_here

Exactly what the wall of propaganda is trying to obscure and distract from. Kudos to you.

Keep an eye out. Merck is pushing for a 3rd mandatory shot in the child's teens. Cha-ching $$$$$$$.

Cha-ching? Please. Vaccines are often given free of charge. Hell, you can get many of them for under $20.

Do you really think big pharma makes the vaccines and give them away for free? They are charging someone, count on it. Oh and no you can not get most of them for under $20. I know this for a fact. My partner had to get boosters when she recently went back to school. We are dirt poor and they still charged $80 per vaccine or more depending on the vaccine. That was what they charged us at the Health Dept. for the poor folks that have no insurance. We live in poverty, no joke and that was our only option. They charge for vaccines at the 'free' clinic.

Wow! That is expensive! It's been years since my kids got their shots, but they were free at the Health Dept. back then. (Well, free for ME... I do get your point that money does go to Big Pharma. No doubt about that.)

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: Grimpachi

Thanks, that makes sense. For eradicating it in the US. Obviously US Gov could not mandate vaccines worldwide, so I do wonder how they kept it from entering the states from other places, like measles did after the US declared it eradicated in 2000. Perhaps the smallpox vaccine efficacy was 100%? I wish I knew!

Actually eradication was a worldwide initiative and one of the few things the USSR worked together with the US on. It took 150 years after a vaccine was developed to finally eradicate the virus.

I can remember my grandmother talking about it a little. There was a fear that the virus could re-emerge in areas it had been eradicated and many places you couldn't travel without current vaccinations. Herd immunity still played a role for those who were not well enough to take the vaccine. That vaccine wasn't 100% effective and it was known that fatalities were more likely to occur with those who contracted the disease and had been previously immunized than those who hadn't. There are still variants of smallpox like monkeypox but they were rare.

Measles is a different case because immunizations are not required for entering the US. In the past that has been the main source of outbreaks. Usually someone traveling has been the carrier.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Thanks for all of your input, Grimpachi!
I went off on a tangent about smallpox & China an such, so now: back to the topic of the current outbreak and the concern that most of the infected are adults. This article posted yesterday left me curious that they are admitting that adults are infected (hence carriers) in higher proportions, yet they're still 'toting the party line' about vaccinating children...

Five measles patients in the California outbreak actually had the measles vaccine, according to state health officials. Most of the infected in California are also adults older than 20.

Doctors at LSU Health are keeping their eye on the measles outbreak and continue to urge vaccinations. In the 99 cases of measles in California, 59 are adult patients. Dr. John Vanchiere is chief of pediatric infectious diseases at LSU Health. He says adults who have been vaccinated aren't being asked to get a shot, even with the high number of adults with measles.

"At this point, there's no recommendation for a booster shot in adulthood," Dr. Vanchiere said.

...He urges parents to the get their children vaccinated...

Source

I find this curious because adults work in schools, day cares, and sneeze at Walmart just like kids do! Do my friends at ATS wonder if the incidence of the booster's side effects in adults being worse plays into this lack of push for adult vaccination for measles? What do you all make of this elephant in the room?

a reply to: Grimpachi

Grimpachi, you have provided a lot of good information to this topic!
Concerning this...

Measles is a different case because immunizations are not required for entering the US.

I find that reprehensible! It would be so easy to say "No measles vaccine, no entrance to the US." And at the same time, people coming down hard on folks who live here who opt out. It sounds a bit of a double standard to me.

originally posted by: new_here
a reply to: Grimpachi

Thanks for all of your input, Grimpachi!
I went off on a tangent about smallpox & China an such, so now: back to the topic of the current outbreak and the concern that most of the infected are adults. This article posted yesterday left me curious that they are admitting that adults are infected (hence carriers) in higher proportions, yet they're still 'toting the party line' about vaccinating children...

Five measles patients in the California outbreak actually had the measles vaccine, according to state health officials. Most of the infected in California are also adults older than 20.

Doctors at LSU Health are keeping their eye on the measles outbreak and continue to urge vaccinations. In the 99 cases of measles in California, 59 are adult patients. Dr. John Vanchiere is chief of pediatric infectious diseases at LSU Health. He says adults who have been vaccinated aren't being asked to get a shot, even with the high number of adults with measles.

"At this point, there's no recommendation for a booster shot in adulthood," Dr. Vanchiere said.

...He urges parents to the get their children vaccinated...

Source

I find this curious because adults work in schools, day cares, and sneeze at Walmart just like kids do! Do my friends at ATS wonder if the incidence of the booster's side effects in adults being worse plays into this lack of push for adult vaccination for measles? What do you all make of this elephant in the room?

I think it is because most people do not know. About 4 in 100 fully vaccinated people will lose immunity and doctors do not usually test for the antibodies in adults. My next visit I plan to get checked even though I had a booster in adulthood via the military.

I find that reprehensible! It would be so easy to say "No measles vaccine, no entrance to the US." And at the same time, people coming down hard on folks who live here who opt out. It sounds a bit of a double standard to me.

I think you are right about that but we have a problem because in the past 10 years most measles outbreaks have been traced to US citizens who traveled abroad that were unvaccinated then came back as carriers not showing symptoms yet. We get into forced vaccinations again which the US will not do for measles.

It should be common sense to vaccinate yourself before traveling to countries that are having outbreaks but more and more common sense is becoming so rare it should be considered a superpower.

originally posted by: Khaleesi
Do you really think big pharma makes the vaccines and give them away for free? They are charging someone, count on it. Oh and no you can not get most of them for under $20. I know this for a fact. My partner had to get boosters when she recently went back to school. We are dirt poor and they still charged $80 per vaccine or more depending on the vaccine. That was what they charged us at the Health Dept. for the poor folks that have no insurance. We live in poverty, no joke and that was our only option. They charge for vaccines at the 'free' clinic.

Eighty dollars is dirt cheap compared to the lost wages, hospitalization bills, and lifetime disability that can result from vaccine-preventable diseases. An ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure.

a reply to: Grimpachi

"...but more and more common sense is becoming so rare it should be considered a superpower. "

HAHA!!! In light of this serious subject, I really needed a good laugh. That is a 'quotable quote' for sure.

a reply to: new_here

No I didn't but like I posted previously, is 4 of us and my younger brother got it after getting vaccinated. He spend two days in the hospital back in the 70s, beside spending one week out of school and been miserable he made just fine.

I also believe that as the years go by vaccines will lose their effectiveness, but see the benefits for big pharma pushing a new trend of vaccinations for adults.

I wonder if they would make it "mandatory"

a reply to: marg6043

Well, I finally found this information:

Virtually everyone (more than 99%) will be protected against measles and rubella for more than 20 years after two doses of MMR.

Source

So, I wonder how many pro-vaxxers go in religiously for their booster every 20 years? If not, they are just as capable of spreading measles as un-vaccinated children. Thing is, that 20-year time frame is not even in the discussion. I want to know why. This could very well be the smoking gun in these 'mysterious outbreaks' where they can't pinpoint patient zero.