Christianities Strange Alliance

a reply to: Grimpachi

Nice one.


There was a righteousness about the Prophets which led to them being chosen in their respective Nations, so I understand fully what you mean now!

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Punisher75

I agree... Fully!

But bare in mind I said "rife within"...



I've yet to see a group in my lifetime with such a prevalant trait...
Nor one who claims the moral high ground quite so much while oblivious ignorant to the History of the Church.



I'm all about forgive & forget, but that's with the honest...

Not the holier-than-thou!

I would be interested in seeing the objective evidence to such a claim, that Christians are particular in their persecution complex. I understand YOU have yet to see a group with such a trait however your opinion I would think is no more nor less subjective than my own.
I assume you are a Muslim, based on the Allahu Akbar under your name, thus you have a Dog in that fight so to speak.
I am a Christian so I have an emotional Dog in that fight as well.

That being the case I doubt either of us could be non biased and both of us would inevitably bring up anecdotal evidence, numbers that may or may not have any credibility etc.

originally posted by: Grimpachi
generally speaking Judaism is favored by Christianity over Islam.

The Christian faith has always understood itself as the continuation of Judaism.
Christians are the children of Abraham (see Galatians).
So from that viewpoint, the Jews are at fault only in failing to grasp the "final chapter" of the common book.

Whereas Islam is understood as having introduced additions and variations.
And calling Jesus "a prophet" is by no means enough.

originally posted by: 3n19m470

originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

That is a very interesting thread with some great information though I didn't see the answer to my question there I still S&F it.

That thread is a part of that person's sig. Happens to me all the time too. The dividing line is too faint/nonexistent...

lol, Thanks for pointing that out I wouldn't have realized if you hadn't.


No regrets though because it really is an interesting thread that I had missed when it was posted.

a reply to: Grimpachi

Thank you everyone so far for your replies.

And I applaud what seems to be, your recent fair minded posture Patch.
It is a welcome site on these boards.

originally posted by: FyreByrd

originally posted by: Punisher75
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

To be fair I have yet to see any group on this planet who does not have a persecution complex.

While Buddhists have been pursecuted, I've yet to hear one 'whine' about it. The very premise of Buddhism, first of the four Noble Truths, is that ALL LIFE IS SUFFERING. In fact, Buddhists attempt to be grateful to their oppressors for the opportunity they provide to learn patience and tolerance.

Which brings to mind a teaching of Jesus from the gospels - something about 'turning the other cheek'.

I would offer this.
lankanewsweb.net...

and this...
buddhism.about.com...

a reply to: Punisher75

Based on my time here at least...


Anytime someone says something about Islamic atrocities...
It's generally agreed upon followed by a few "turn em to glass" comments...

In contrast, when we get a thread about Christianity in a bad light it's not long before it's filled with "but look at Islam they're worse"...


Anecdotal of course, & only relating to ATS...


There seems to be a different type of Christian here at ATS than who I used to encounter in the Church & my own Christian family members.


& I noticed this before I converted, so it's not really biased imo.

But anecdotal yes.


Even so, I have no gripe against Christianity itself because personally I have doubts about some of the "Christians" here & whether they actually live by the words of Jesus...

Or whether they throw them about in one post & then turn Demonic in another.



I'm sure if there was a higher Muslim membership here it would have an equal amount of what I have noticed.

I understand that you have a bad taste in your mouth concerning criticism of Islam.
I don't think a lot of it is fair myself, but I can offer something objective as it concerns any potential anti christian bias of the members here on ATS.
The logo of the Conspiracies in religion forums itself.

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Even so, I have no gripe against Christianity itself because personally I have doubts about some of the "Christians" here & whether they actually live by the words of Jesus...

Or perhaps what you perceive Charlie is the difference between
how some Christians live their lives in the real world and how they
choose not be trampled on in cyber space? To me, the internet is
no place for martyrs. So my attitude for one is to rifle back. Ijust
happen to be good at it. And I have the element of surprise in my
favor. So...

Don't tread on my faith and expect me to lay down.

a reply to: Punisher75

Good spot...

Never really noticed the question mark before!


I'd hope it's not nefarious, but it's easily interpreted as such once you see the symbol fully.

originally posted by: CharlieSpeirs
a reply to: Punisher75

Good spot...

Never rely noticed the question mark before!


I'd hope it's not nefarious, but it's easily interpreted as such once you see the symbol fully.

Well I know that you and I would be likely to disagree on many things, however I am glad that we are remaining civil. =)

a reply to: randyvs

Hmmm...

Don't tread on my faith and expect me to lay down.

Does that work both ways?

BTW

I could've said, because Christians and Jews throughout history
have died for what they believe. While all thru history others have died
for what muslims believe.

Just wondering?

originally posted by: Punisher75

originally posted by: FyreByrd

originally posted by: Punisher75
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

To be fair I have yet to see any group on this planet who does not have a persecution complex.

While Buddhists have been pursecuted, I've yet to hear one 'whine' about it. The very premise of Buddhism, first of the four Noble Truths, is that ALL LIFE IS SUFFERING. In fact, Buddhists attempt to be grateful to their oppressors for the opportunity they provide to learn patience and tolerance.

Which brings to mind a teaching of Jesus from the gospels - something about 'turning the other cheek'.

I would offer this.
lankanewsweb.net...

and this...
buddhism.about.com...

Your first source is about Buddhists pursecuting Christians. Your post that I responded to stated that "all religions FEEL pursecuted" and I don't see any semlance of that in your citation.

The second citation remarks on varying Buddhists opinions and thinking about war. Also irelevant to what I was responding to.

Please read what I actually posted and respond to that.

I never said anything whatsoever about Buddhists being either peaceful or non-violent only that I've yet to hear or hear tell of one "WHINING ABOUT BEING PURSECUTED".

a reply to: CharlieSpeirs

Does that work both ways?

You have me at a disadvantage if you haven't noticed Charlie.
You relate to both, being two ways but, I know only of mine and
nothing of the second.

Are you a muslim Charlie?

a reply to: FyreByrd

The issue I was addressing was the idea that Buddhist act in a way that says persecution is okay and they think it is payment for their bad karma. They obviously do not at least not to a man otherwise they would not go to war on principle, and yet they do.
The reason the article was brought up as it concerns persecution of Christians by Buddhist is to demonstrate that the prevailing idea that Buddhist simply have a live and let live mentality is also false.

I am certain there was whining before the persecution started or do you think the Buddhist involved simply started the persecution out of the blue?
I prefer to think they attempted to make their displeasure known first.

If those were not your arguments then I am not sure I understand what your arguments are, other than to say Christians can be as hypocritical as Buddhist. If that was your argument then I in no way disagree.

By the way the caps yell thing and the three inch fool thing has at least demonstrated to me that you are not terribly rational in this conversation. Maybe you should take a page from my Muslim opponents behavior if you wont take mine?

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Grimpachi


I believe in Jesus Christ. Of Jewish descent.
God favored the Jews in only one way. As the people whereby
God would send mankinds deliverer. And I speculate, that it
was because, they we're a nation which represented all mankind.
Without a corrupt geneology.

I can't add much depth being an atheist but this is something that has always fascinated and confounded me.... great similarities and origins within the three religions yet so much conflict.

Regarding the jews being favored or chosen, could it be purely that they were the original people in that region that held the original monotheistic god at the heart of their culture? Early christians and muslims, choosing offshoot factions, would exempt themselves from being chosen. Perhaps roots of conflict. Its like giving up something, asking for it back and being mad you can't have it.

Not sure my words convey what I'm trying to express though.

a reply to: Punisher75

Isn't it Thailand or Burma where the Buddhist majority is also merrily persecuting the indigenous Muslims? Buddhist are hardly innocent of persecution.

Oh, sorry, it's Myanmar. I think I read somewhere they actually have the Muslims on reservations.

Now, two years after the violence between Buddhists and Muslims in western Myanmar broke out, no quick resolution to the ethnic and sectarian conflict is in sight. Thousands of stateless Muslim Rohingya people remain segregated in camps and villages, deprived of basic rights and services.

Of course, the article implies they are being persecuted for faith, but the persecution could stem just as much from their differing ethnicity, too. In Africa, we see Christian/Muslim violence, but the religious difference is often only part of the story. You have tribal boundaries and hatreds to consider, too.

However, the fact remains that it's the Buddhists pushing the Muslims into segregated camps.

originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: Grimpachi

Thank you everyone so far for your replies.

And I applaud what seems to be, your recent fair minded posture Patch.
It is a welcome site on these boards.

Thanks, Recently I have been reading up on the historicity of the religions and I found a lot more similarities with them than I had previously thought there were especially when you look into the NT and what modern historians have said were the original form. It has made me question where the divide stems from and why they are not being bridged in practice, but I haven't been able to come to a firm conclusion on that hence the thread to simply gain a better understanding.

As you can see there are many opinions on the matter so it seems the question is not easily answered, however I do think I am closer to the answer than I was before.

a reply to: igloo

Not sure my words convey what I'm trying to express though.

I think I get it, but can hardly see that as being the case. Since most
of the early Christians were jews and saw their Christianity as a part
of their religion from the get go. If Christianity is foretold by hebew
scripture? It is not apart from the jewish religion so much as Islam certainly
is as isis is.

a reply to: Grimpachi

The Christian fundamentalist Religious Right in the U.S. and zionists (whether in the U.S. or in Israel) share a common political agenda.