'Christianophobia,' Anti-Christian Hostility Infects Powerful Elite Subculture

a reply to: grandmakdw

Absolutely agree. NO human is perfect - we all judge when we shouldn't, we all get angry when a little patience would be wiser, we all sometimes act in ways we shouldn't. What makes true Christians wonderful is that they are trying - every day - to be as Jesus said they should be.

An example is my aunt, who considers herself a devout Christian - sweet lady. One day, she made a snide comment about a gay person that she knows - it was something about their "gayness". I reminded her of how Jesus might deal with that person, and she immediately stopped and said, "you're absolutely right - I'll be nicer to that person from now on, and I'll stop making negative comments about them."

Another "Christian" may have persisted in justifying their negative comments. It's the "trying" that makes all the difference.

originally posted by: Stormdancer777
People are being crucified in foreign countries, should I remain silent?

People have always been persecuted in foreign countries, and even in this country.

EVERYONE gets persecuted. But if an occupying country (the US) sends missionaries into that country with vastly different, and strongly held religious beliefs, and force their belief system on the Muslim people, they're ASKING for persecution. Complaining that Christianity is not welcomed in Muslim countries is a real "Duh" moment. If they would leave people alone to live their lives, they would not be persecuted.

Disagreement is not persecution.

I was a Christian for 30 years and this victim mindset was NEVER a part of what I experienced.

Have you seen this? www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

force their belief system on the Muslim

And exactly how do they do that? Waterboarding?

a reply to: grandmakdw

No, you are wrong.

Those who reject Christianity are to be loved, to be treated as one would treat a loved family member.

and how far would i have to look to find a christian who says YOU are wrong?

your faith is as definitive a picture of christianity as the next one. and those pictures cover quite a long spectrum. about as many incarnation of christianity as batman and superman put together. the little inconsistencies and contradictions? no matter, as long as we use the same name. but that can mean the difference between you smiling and quietly disagreeing and some other dude putting a fist through my teeth because i say i believe in evolution. and just because you arent willing to take money to kill for your god, doesnt mean a thousand other people wont.

the thing that scares me is the possibility that some charismatic revolutionary sent by god will convince everyone that heathens and blasphemers and heretics are no longer really "people"...and therefore have no right to share gods creation with the righteous.

originally posted by: kaylaluv
Yes, it is everything about how they act. I personally know Christians who genuinely try to follow Christ - they struggle every day, but they try, and I can see it. I also know many "Christians-in-name-only" who have much hate in their heart, zero compassion, and judge pretty much everyone they come across, ESPECIALLY those who don't identify as Christians.

I have never known Christians to hate or have zero compassion for those who dont identify as Christians. I think that is mainly in your own mind and a perfect example of what the OP addresses. As a matter of fact you statement is a text book example of bias.

One thing that surprised me is that so many British people have an abnormal view of Christians and they are very vocal about it if we were to go by internet postings. I think they feel that Christians stood in the way when they went on invasions.

originally posted by: TzarChasm
a reply to: grandmakdw

No, you are wrong.

Those who reject Christianity are to be loved, to be treated as one would treat a loved family member.

and how far would i have to look to find a christian who says YOU are wrong?

If you looked hard enough, you would find someone,

however, from a New Testament standpoint

(the writings of the New Testament do away with (supersede)
much that is in the Old Testament
and loving others is one area that the New Testament overrules the Old)

loving others and not judging others is exactly what Jesus himself commands Christians to do.

Those who don't treat others as they would themselves, are
not following the very core and heart of what Jesus said
a Christian should be.


Because Christians try to be better,
Christians fail
The mandate of Christianity is to
pick yourself up when you fail
and try to be better next time

No authentic believer claims Christians will ever be perfect,
or ever not make mistakes
That is the reason we need Jesus,
to help us see when we don't follow his #1 commandment that overrides all the rest of the entire bible.
Love others as you love yourself, treat others as you would treat yourself.

Those who say they are "Christians" and don't follow the
most important rule given to Christians by Jesus himself
well....
there are people in every group
(atheists / agnostics /Muslims/Jews conservatives/liberals
/socialists/capitalists /Republicans/Democrats etc.)

who are just awful people who do not represent the core values of their group
and give the rest of the people a bad name and reputation.

Are we to judge all of the people in the group YOU identify with (whatever it is)
by the hundreds of fringe people who besmirch the name of the group with their actions
(and there are hundreds of fringe elements in each of the groups listed above)

who claim to be ____ but live and speak
in such a manner as to poison people against the group as a whole?

a reply to: grandmakdw

I thought Commandment #1 was "I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other Gods before me"

a reply to: ladyinwaiting

I think its more a juxtaposition of values. They see the invading threat as primarily Christian, grow to dislike the way of life of the invading threat, then juxtapose those values onto all Christians, even the ones that already lived in the country with them. I mean can you blame them when the President who started this whole "War on Terror" said this?

originally posted by: ladyinwaiting
And exactly how do they do that? Waterboarding?

No. That was our government and one of the reasons some of these people in Muslim countries are so hostile toward ANY Americans. The missionaries practice Christianity, build churches, evangelize, convert people and have religious services in countries where all of that is illegal. They do not have religious freedom like we do.

a reply to: Harvin

Au contraire - I even know a few Christians of a certain denomination who hate on other Christians of a different denomination (Baptists hating Catholics)! Not to mention what I have heard some Christians say about the whole Muslim religion. I have heard self-professed Christians saying they don't want their hard-earned money going to help those "lazy people" who don't have jobs and whose families are starving. Definitely not all Christians talk that way, but many do and it's definitely not my imagination.

Don't forget the Westboro folks and the Ku Klux Klan. You may say they are not true Christians (and I agree), but they sure claim to be Christians.

a reply to: Harvin

You've never known a Christian soldier in the Crusades or a Christian emperor who killed those who refused to convert then. I've never met a Muslim who had zero compassion for those who didn't identify as Muslim. Does that mean they don't exist?

Like I said, Christianity and it's followers have just as long a list of persecuting others as anyone else does. Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it's not happening.

a reply to: grandmakdw

If you looked hard enough, you would find someone,

if you look hard enough, you will ALWAYS find someone who disagrees with your interpretation. thats an awfully strange thing to find in a religion based on one, perfect, absolute truth.

What is sad to me is that many people base their understanding of Christianity from people who say they are Christians, but really are not.

This whole "scare you in to believing something or else punishment" is not what Christianity is about.

Jesus detested the self-righteous and those who condemned others. He held company with outcasts of society (the Samaritan woman, tax collectors, the list goes on...)

It makes me sad that when some people hear "Christian" they associate it with feeling condemned or misunderstood.

No one is perfect. And that's the point. Helping and loving each other the way Christ loves us (John 13:34), that's something a lot of people miss.

originally posted by: shieldmaiden
What is sad to me is that many people base their understanding of Christianity from people who say they are Christians, but really are not.

This whole "scare you in to believing something or else punishment" is not what Christianity is about.

Jesus detested the self-righteous and those who condemned others. He held company with outcasts of society (the Samaritan woman, tax collectors, the list goes on...)

It makes me sad that when some people hear "Christian" they associate it with feeling condemned or misunderstood.

No one is perfect. And that's the point. Helping and loving each other the way Christ loves us (John 13:34), that's something a lot of people miss.

what is sad to me is that i never see "real" christians standing up and telling "false" christians to shut the hell up and sit down. if they dont speak for your god, make it known. hopefully thats pope francis' next talking piece.

originally posted by: [post=18942062]windword

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
a reply to: grandmakdw

I thought Commandment #1 was "I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other Gods before me"

True that is the #1 commandment of the Old Testament, the one given to Moses. correction accepted

Here are the actual words from the Bible, which are in the New Testament:


Matthew 22:37-40
Jesus said, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence.’ This is the most important, the first on any list. But there is a second to set alongside it: ‘Love others as well as you love yourself.’ These two commands are pegs; everything in God’s Law and the Prophets hangs from them.”
( This means the second is equal to the first.)


Mark 12:29-31
Jesus said, “The first in importance is, ‘Listen, Israel: The Lord your God is one; so love the Lord God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence and energy.’ And here is the second: ‘Love others as well as you love yourself.’ There is no other commandment that ranks with these.”


Romans 13:8-10
Don’t run up debts, except for the huge debt of love you owe each other. When you love others, you complete what the law has been after all along. The law code—don’t sleep with another person’s spouse, don’t take someone’s life, don’t take what isn’t yours, don’t always be wanting what you don’t have, and any other “don’t” you can think of—finally adds up to this: Love other people as well as you do yourself. You can’t go wrong when you love others. When you add up everything in the law code, the sum total is love.


Galatians 5:13-15
It is absolutely clear that God has called you to a free life. Just make sure that you don’t use this freedom as an excuse to do whatever you want to do and destroy your freedom. Rather, use your freedom to serve one another in love; that’s how freedom grows. For everything we know about God’s Word is summed up in a single sentence: Love others as you love yourself. That’s an act of true freedom. If you bite and ravage each other, watch out—in no time at all you will be annihilating each other, and where will your precious freedom be then?



James 2:8-11
You do well when you complete the Royal Rule of the Scriptures: “Love others as you love yourself.”


To Love one another and to love God are the ONLY commandments given by Jesus himself.

These are the first and foremost commandments given to the followers of Christ,

which supersede all other commandments found in the Bible.

originally posted by: shieldmaiden
What is sad to me is that many people base their understanding of Christianity from people who say they are Christians, but really are not.

True. Replace "Christianity" with "Islam" and the statement is still true. We have these two major religions, basically at war with each other and almost everyone takes a side.

I support people to have religion, whatever it is. But the political arms of both religions have gone WAY too far in trying to force people to live by their beliefs, IMO, and I have a problem with that.

a reply to: grandmakdw

Deuteronomy 17
If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

I am often at a loss for words, are we not all brothers?

As members of the human race shouldn't we be just as concerned for the rights of the homosexual, the atheist, the Christian,Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism, for when others lose their rights your rights and freedoms are soon to follow.

In case you haven't noticed there is persecution in Hinduism, and Buddhist monks becoming extremist.

How can a person proclaim,

COEXIST, when there are those they hate on their coexist list.

a reply to: grandmakdw

And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
Genesis 1:28

No it isn't.

And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.
Genesis 1:28

The second "Commandment" in the Old Testament:

To the woman he said,

“I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;
with painful labor you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you.”
17 To Adam he said, “Because you listened to your wife and ate fruit from the tree about which I commanded you, ‘You must not eat from it,’

“Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat food from it
all the days of your life.
18 It will produce thorns and thistles for you,
and you will eat the plants of the field.
19 By the sweat of your brow
you will eat your food
until you return to the ground,
since from it you were taken;
for dust you are
and to dust you will return.”

Love comes later. Much later.

originally posted by: grandmakdw

originally posted by: ScientificRailgun
a reply to: grandmakdw

I thought Commandment #1 was "I am the Lord thy God. Thou shalt have no other Gods before me"

True that is the #1 commandment of the Old Testament, the one given to Moses. correction accepted

Here are the actual words from the Bible, which are in the New Testament:


Matthew 22:37-40
Jesus said, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence.’ This is the most important, the first on any list. But there is a second to set alongside it: ‘Love others as well as you love yourself.’ These two commands are pegs; everything in God’s Law and the Prophets hangs from them.”
( This means the second is equal to the first.)


Mark 12:29-31
Jesus said, “The first in importance is, ‘Listen, Israel: The Lord your God is one; so love the Lord God with all your passion and prayer and intelligence and energy.’ And here is the second: ‘Love others as well as you love yourself.’ There is no other commandment that ranks with these.”


Romans 13:8-10
Don’t run up debts, except for the huge debt of love you owe each other. When you love others, you complete what the law has been after all along. The law code—don’t sleep with another person’s spouse, don’t take someone’s life, don’t take what isn’t yours, don’t always be wanting what you don’t have, and any other “don’t” you can think of—finally adds up to this: Love other people as well as you do yourself. You can’t go wrong when you love others. When you add up everything in the law code, the sum total is love.


Galatians 5:13-15
It is absolutely clear that God has called you to a free life. Just make sure that you don’t use this freedom as an excuse to do whatever you want to do and destroy your freedom. Rather, use your freedom to serve one another in love; that’s how freedom grows. For everything we know about God’s Word is summed up in a single sentence: Love others as you love yourself. That’s an act of true freedom. If you bite and ravage each other, watch out—in no time at all you will be annihilating each other, and where will your precious freedom be then?



James 2:8-11
You do well when you complete the Royal Rule of the Scriptures: “Love others as you love yourself.”

Thanks for the clarification. I may be a dirty heathen, but like many heathens before me, I have read the bible.