How to Bog Down Russia in Crimea and Ukraine - All Ideas Welcome!

a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

Go brush up on the topic then come back and join the adults in this conversation.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Your seriously joking right?

The EU is not projected t have an economy shrink by 5%.

projected by whom? EU's propagandists?

Apparently you need to keep up with current events.

Apparently you arent.

Fall in Eurozone Prices Inflames Fears of Deflation

Together, the data reinforce fears that the region could lapse into a sustained period of sluggish or falling prices that could lead to an even higher jobless rate and economic stagnation.

An higher jobless rate and economic stagnation is not a sign of a economy recovered or recovering. Of course the article then uses the economists claims by suggesting there is no reason as the low prices means good for boon for consumers but how can you when the majority of Europeans and Italians cant even afford to buy a single bread?

Belarus is talking about bolting from the newly created and soon to fail EEU.

Your sound a lot like old McCain to.

There are more sanction's coming down the road for Russia.

More sanctions would lead to war but no doubt your going to be cheering for that to.

a reply to: Xcathdra

I find it comical that your not only defending pro American selected government in Ukraine but the EU. The majority of Europeans and British want to get out of it.

a reply to: Agent_USA_Supporter

I see we have another person of the cant read a post and understand it club.

The Russian economy is projected to retract by 5% in 2015. That comes from many sources, including US, EU, world bank, and Russia.

originally posted by: OneManMasquerade

Chechnya would never sign or join with US or NATO, they respect Putin too much and would follow him to hell and back.

I was referring to 'supporting' them, you know, like how the CIA have been known to support various rebellions, regime changes etc.

And some... but not most Chechens would follow Putin to hell and back. The majority would rather see Chechnya become an independent nation. But, is the west prepared for that to eventuate? Nein. Too many muslim extremists for western tastes.

But still, opening up another front against Russia could 'bog' down their activities.

What about stirring up old sentiment in reinstating the Imperial Royal Family?

Come oooooon foreign intelligence services - stir up the proverbial!

What Russian activities are you referring to? I've seen no true evidence of Russian involvement. I've seen volunteers from Russia, yes. But columns of soldiers and armor?

Its a joke. If Russia had even a small percentage of its military assets in Ukraine, the separatists would have repelled Ukraine within a day.

Some Ukraine soldiers won't even fight their kinsmen. The separatists? They'll die for their freedom. Just like we Americans did in 1776. This is no different.

originally posted by: JBurns
What Russian activities are you referring to? I've seen no true evidence of Russian involvement. I've seen volunteers from Russia, yes. But columns of soldiers and armor?

Its a joke. If Russia had even a small percentage of its military assets in Ukraine, the separatists would have repelled Ukraine within a day.

Some Ukraine soldiers won't even fight their kinsmen. The separatists? They'll die for their freedom. Just like we Americans did in 1776. This is no different.

Really how did you miss it?? Let me say those miners in don bass managed to have an arsenal many countries in the world don't very impressive. Managed somehow to outnumber Ukraine in tanks and even grad systems. Since of course they were first introduced into the battle by the sepratists. Ukraine had all there's guarding the border with Russia real bone head move there. Russia fakes an invasion on the border they move all there troops. And when they do Russia ships stuff into donbass even at the time it knew it was a mistake. Russia would never directly invade Ukraine with a conscript army they are poorly trained and casualties would have been immense.

Now about your overconfidence in Russian military takes 6 months to train them and they have a 1 year requirement there military is far from Capable. However there spc ops are on par with any military on th 3 planet and urban combat is perfect for them.

Then sprinkle in chechens shake well and you have a conflict. As for how to stop Russia no need there economy is gone already having to decrease there budget economy is shrinking and they are spending huge amounts of money as well as lives in Ukraine.

Putin took care of any threat Russia may have proposed in 5 he future give it 2 years and Russians will be selling anything not nailed down just lIke last time. Many in Russia are already planning for this buying items with the sole purpose of trading later.

I'm have family there a uncle told me he's buying appliances and putting them into storage. And is currently moving money to the UK. Russians are incredibly smart they know what's going on and why what the west doesn't understand is why they put up with it. Simple answer is they make it work they are used to coruption bribes are part of the Culture. What we see as corruption is business to them everyone knows Putin makes huge money even jokes about it. what will remove him isn't corruption it's when people start to starve on the streets.

Me personally hope it doesn't come to that but what we are seeing is the start of another civil war in Russia Putin thinks he can avoid it with his crackdowns on speech and assembly. Sadly he's just stalling it.One more thing don't think all Russians are against the west there not the narative is being controlled by people in the media.

a reply to: Mehmet666Heineken

Your thread, OP, is just funny trollbait.

Ukraine is a historical product of Russia... Russians have been living for many centuries in this area, much longer than your holy US colony has established itself on stolen Native American land. So that's why about half of today's Ukraine consists of ethnic Russians.

As for the solutions to this non-problem, I don't see why or how I should freely do the job that those Ivy league plutocrats at Brookings and the CFR and National Endowment for Democracy should (not) be doing.

America needs to take care of our own country which is ever on the brink of social and econimic collapse.

Always worried about what some other country is doing and pay no mind to how f##ed up things are becoming back at home.

We need world peace, and trying to destablize other countries will only be tit for tat.

If we mess with them do you think they cant mess with us? If so think again.

If we start a revolt there what if they start a revolt here?
Many Americans would jump on that bandwagon, while many others wouldnt.

I dont want to see more strife and suffering in the world because some moron wants to cause ever more wars around the globe.

We need peace not war, bring order not leave the world in the perpetual darkness of us vs them because we are all the same.

originally posted by: Mehmet666Heineken
a reply to: Plugin


So we let the Russians have their way? We leave the Ukrainians alone because Russia might spank us?

If it was just Russia NATO might be able to deter the event.

The real issue is most of the people in Crimea are Russians and
have been for quite awhile.

Russia will not address the NATO Alliance alone, it will do so as BRICS
and it will continue further financial warfare much like the western
powers are already doing.

Russia knows our leaders are psychopaths who are puppets for
the kleptocrats who control our puppet government.

So they do not trust anything the west says because they
have lied so many times about so many things even to their
own citizens that they follow a method of appraisal similar to
what I use myself.

Do not listen to what they say, watch what they do.

The west has been placing military bases all around Russia
for several years now in former soviet nations.

This is why they developed the KH-555 and KH-102.

KH-102: Nuclear stealth cruise missile

So when your ready to party with radar invisible nuclear cruise missiles
with terrain hugging navigation systems let me know so I can walk over to
my fallout shelter.

Best advice I can give is have Soros pull out his english speaking mercs
that were recently filmed in the Ukraine if you want Russia to move
its trigger finger a few millimeters away from WW3 launch.

The Russians have zero faith in the psychopaths we have running
our nations, and I don't blame them.

If the leaders of the west will do what they have to their own
citizens, then what will they do to the rest of the world ???

Russia would be foolish to trust the puppetized western governments.

Hallmarks of the psychopathic mind are lying even in the face of
evidence and danger, and a lack of concern of well being even
unto themselves.

Fishead - Are our leaders Psychopaths

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
a reply to: Xcathdra

I find it comical that your not only defending pro American selected government in Ukraine but the EU. The majority of Europeans and British want to get out of it.

They want you to think they want out of it.

Disinformation is not just for Russians, but at home as well,
thus operation mockingbird and whatever the current at
home Psyop might be named....

Operation Mockingbird - CIA controlled media

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
a reply to: Xcathdra

The US / EU / NATO will out last Russia. They already outlasted the USSR and with Putins delusions about bringing it back its only a matter of time.

This is hilarious. Keep day dreaming. Your actually talking about the fall of Russia. EU will collapse first.

The EU is not projected t have an economy shrink by 5%.
There are more sanction's coming down the road for Russia.
Belarus is talking about bolting from the newly created and soon to fail EEU.

Apparently you need to keep up with current events.

The whole world is about to see a massive shrinkage based on the Baltic Dry Index
dropping like an anvil from space.

Baltic Dry Index hits 29 year low

In the EU the events that will trigger a drop is Russia providing a safe harbor for Greece.

Then Spain and a few others will see their banks implode and the riots will go
full tilt worse then they already are there currently.

Google images of spanish riots:

tinyurl.com/lykyog3

In fact a few members of the EU are having riots....

EU riots in multiple nations

So the idea that the EU is stable is about as likely as the UKIP party
embracing the idea of staying in the EU.

The EU's days of anything resembling stability is on a short list.

a reply to: Ex_MislTech

right...

The Russia economy (GDP) is expected to contract 5% in 2015.

a reply to: Echtelion

I was not aware the US, as a nation, existed when the Europeans came to the new world and started confiscating native American land.

If you want to take the US to task that's fine. Maybe you should get your facts straight before looking like an ass by making claims that are not true.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: Ex_MislTech

right...

The Russia economy (GDP) is expected to contract 5% in 2015.

Well as the EU is one of their bigger customers I'd say more then 5%
is likely, but they will refocus elsewhere likely.

originally posted by: Ex_MislTech


Well as the EU is one of their bigger customers I'd say more then 5%
is likely, but they will refocus elsewhere likely.

Where? I don't see a mad dash of countries wanting to invest in Russia, let alone buy Russian items. I see Russia shopping around however the only item some nations want to buy would be oil.

Its been proven that Russia's reliance on energy resource exports for the bulk of its budget never took into account a market downswing. China has gone for more imports from Russia but the contract took Russia for a ride on prices and partial ownership in Russia's state gas business.

I seriously doubt Russia is going to find enough new markets that could offset its current predicament. The manner in which Russia has treated some of its customer is also going to be a turnoff to other nations.

Russia has 2 possible chances -
To withdraw from Ukraine, including Crimea and ending support for the rebels in an effort to have sanctions dropped.

or

Putin is removed from office and replaced with a person who does not have an ego the size of the moon or ethics that would raise eyebrows in the court of Caligula.

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: Ex_MislTech


Well as the EU is one of their bigger customers I'd say more then 5%
is likely, but they will refocus elsewhere likely.

Where? I don't see a mad dash of countries wanting to invest in Russia, let alone buy Russian items. I see Russia shopping around however the only item some nations want to buy would be oil.

Its been proven that Russia's reliance on energy resource exports for the bulk of its budget never took into account a market downswing. China has gone for more imports from Russia but the contract took Russia for a ride on prices and partial ownership in Russia's state gas business.

I seriously doubt Russia is going to find enough new markets that could offset its current predicament. The manner in which Russia has treated some of its customer is also going to be a turnoff to other nations.

Russia has 2 possible chances -
To withdraw from Ukraine, including Crimea and ending support for the rebels in an effort to have sanctions dropped.

or

Putin is removed from office and replaced with a person who does not have an ego the size of the moon or ethics that would raise eyebrows in the court of Caligula.

Russia can sell military gear just like the US does world wide, and they already do this.

They recently sold a large number of missiles to 1 or more middle eastern countries.

China uses the Raduga KH-102/KH-555 series and I am sure they might buy a few more.

According to the CIA world fact book their economy is 60%+ services, so I think they can
expand that around the world as well.

Also Greece has been in negotiations with them, and some deals may happen there on
a cash basis due to the Greeks financial woes.

But I still stick to the assertion the entire planet is about to see a major retraction
due to the Baltic Dry Index tanking to a 29 year low.

a reply to: Ex_MislTech

Military exports cannot make up the losses.

a reply to: Ex_MislTech

Weapon dales can't make uP for the loses and many are tied to Ukraine the missile sales you mentioned are using rockets manufactured in Ukraine. Russia is highly dependant on Ukraine for weapons manufacture. This is why China started doing an end run and buying directly from Ulraine. Evenhave a maintainance contract with Ukraine for there fighters. Russia has alot of parts they don't have the ability to make yet there manufacturing is in need of investment. Oddly Putin was planning on doing that but in the current financial crises it's unlikely since they are already having to cut back on there budget.

As far as someone else rescuing them China could problem is China is raping the Russians right now. Look at the last trade deal China came out of it owning part of Russian gas and than later even flipped and what Russia thought was an investment turned out to be a loan. And China made sure to reiterate that Putin had no choice he needed something he could spin into good news. Sadly China took advantage of the needs of Putin and worse even added a clause to opt out of futures if they can find a lowEr price.

So Russia will spend huge amounts of money building a pipeline to China and they have an option to back out but for China it's a win win since they will buy the parts needed from the west sell them to Russia. See Russia doesn't have the capability to build the pipeline without the west.

Sadly everything Putin has done has done major damage to the Russian economy and frankly that's the last thing the west would want. If Russia crashes again just like last time weapons go on the black market and the west has to work overtime trying to prevent them from being nuclear and antiaircraft.