So where is all the cellphone movie footage if we're visited so often?

Cellphones just can't cut it. As I mentioned before IR is where it's at.

See this video for example, it contains:

- Impossible manouvers
- Impossible dead stops
- An off the charts speedy depature

You must skip to the 7:20 mark or you'll be extremely bored for 7 mins 20
(it appears in the top third of the screen at roughly 7:37. If you're able to keep your eye on it for the remainder of the video, you're in for a real treat EDIT - actually, after more views it appears initially traveling extremely fast in the bottom third, slows down and by that point the cam has moved it into the top third)



"Holy Mackerel"

In case it's too erratic for some viewers, I drew the flight path seen in that section of the vid (as I see it)



So people have been catching the real deal for quite some time now, just not with cellphones cos they don't have IR, decent focus, decent zoom or anything that makes them a legitimate photographic product really.

PS I found this just now. I think it's become my fave UFO video

originally posted by: CirqueDeTruth
Here we go.

Video Link of Potential UFOs caught with NASA AllSky Camera

CdT

CirquedeTruth, Thank you so much for providing the EXACT evidence that grain of sand and jade star stated did not exist. Of course, were they actually serious about the issue, they could have found this evidence themselves instead of petulantly whining about it.

You proved them wrong on their own terms, bravo. I doubt they have the strength of character to apologize for being wrong and wasting our time, but I bet jade star doesn't even have the integrity to be embarrassed. I'd imagine her reaction will be more of the same angry whining that makes up most of her output.

Nevertheless, you have effectively nullified their argument. Well done, and the evidence in your link was quite fascinating, thank you.

originally posted by: theMediator
I got a simpler answer :

80% of cell phone footage and pictures are about CATS

Thank you for your wisdom, you nailed it!

originally posted by: rhynouk
Also part of the reason why we don't see as many UFO's caught on camera phones these days, is because everybody seems to be looking down at their phones.
People walk across roads & push prams while they are looking down at their phones, not a care in the world. On nights out, you see couples across a table, on the internet.

People are looking down, rather than up these days.

Rhynouk, thank you, your answer is the absolute truth. It is a FACT that as cell phone usage has increased, so have incidents of people walking into lamp posts, open manholes, even walking out into traffic and being hit by a car. Emergency room visits for pedestrian accidents caused by cell phone use are becoming more and more frequent, essentially proving that using a cell phone has DECREASED people's awareness of their surroundings. Not increased at all, as jade star and grainofsand would have us believe, but DECREASED. Measurably.

Smart phones have made people dumber, and far less likely to be aware of a UFO right overhead, let alone photograph it.

This entire thread is based on a false premise.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: br0ker
Interesting, 'UFO's' are invisible to the naked eye you say?
Any source to support this new assertive contribution to the thread?

*Edit*
Go on, throw me a bone, I won't mind being considered as a poor researcher or other such whinging if you tell me

There is tons of youtube. Used to be a few REALLY good researchers that did side by side recordings. One normal, one IR with datestamp.
Other than that u will always have the IR recordings released from the mexican military in an attempt to get the US to speak up.. Youll find that one on youtube as well
As well as in a few serious and well made UFO documentaries.

Thanks for all the replies so far folks, it has been a very interesting and entertaining read. Apologies for not responding to everyone individually, but please do continue sharing your thoughts here, either in your own debate with others, or just more backslapping with your fellow believers, it's all good.
I shall respond to Scdfa though, who especially amuses me with his/her obvious emotional responses with anyone who doubts his/her faith in the alien overlords...

originally posted by: Scdfa
Thank you so much for providing the EXACT evidence that grain of sand and jade star stated did not exist.

Nope, you imagined that I stated anything does or does not exist, I have simply asked "so where is..." or "I am not convinced" etc. You are the one making assertions in this thread, not me.

Of course, were they actually serious about the issue, they could have found this evidence themselves instead of petulantly whining about it.

Lol, 'petulantly whining' oh deary me, again you imagine that about my contributions here. No whining, as I've stated before I find your rabid belief in aliens amusing and entertaining. Why would one whine about being entertained?

You proved them wrong on their own terms, bravo. I doubt they have the strength of character to apologize for being wrong and wasting our time

Claims and assertions are required usually for one to be 'proven' wrong. I have made no such claims or assertions, unlike yourself of course who claims aliens /UFO's as fact.
Try again fella...I'm loving the entertainment and your apparent emotion in this thread lol.
---------------------------------------------------

originally posted by: Scdfa
This entire thread is based on a false premise.

Perhaps you do not understand what false premise actually means?
I asked a question "where is all the cellphone movie footage if we're visited so often?" My premise for the question was that there has been an explosion of worldwide camera-phone ownership in the last few decades, billions (which is a correct assertion) and I asked why there has not been a similar explosion of 'sightings' filmed by many people of the same event.
I made no assertions that "there are no aliens/UFO's", I expressed that I am unconvinced by the assertions made by believers.

Now, you can shoot my question down with all the replies I've seen so far:
"People are only looking down on their screens these days"
"People are too shocked to record events"
"It always happens too fast to get the camera out"
"Camera phones only have a digital zoom"
"UFO's are invisible to camera's with their cloaking devices"
...and that's fine, but I remain unconvinced, and the above explanations do not support the assertions by others in this thread that aliens/UFO's are a factual reality.

To all the butt-hurt folk in this thread, until or unless you've got something stronger than presented in this topic I shall continue to consider you believers, and while I do not state you are wrong to believe, I've seen nothing on ATS to draw me towards sharing the same faith as yourselves.

a reply to: markymint

How does that give -any evidence- of/for intelligent, non-human or non-terrestrial controlled flight of a real object?

Just dots in the sky, imo.

originally posted by: Scdfa

originally posted by: CirqueDeTruth
Here we go.

Video Link of Potential UFOs caught with NASA AllSky Camera

CdT

CirquedeTruth, Thank you so much for providing the EXACT evidence that grain of sand and jade star stated did not exist.thank you.

But it doesn't. There's nothing at all unidentified in the clips she posted. We both went through them to find anything truly anomalous. There wasn't anything.

What I did find was someone who edited in almost amateurish manner video clips of planets, satellites passing, the ISS passing over to make them appear more mysterious.

I mean OMFG one of the clips has the light of the sunrise coming up in one clip BEFORE another clip taken previously when the horizon was dark but the object they wanted you to focus on was in another area of sky. Star positions also jump around in many of these which ALSO indicates non-linear editing was done.

That might fool some people but its hard to fool an astronomer or anyone else who is familiar with the night sky.

And most damning was that the Youtube hoaxer removed the time/date stamp. Why? Because it makes it easier to fool YOU (which it must have) if the time is not jumping back and forth between out-of-sequence clips.

CirquedeTruth and I went through and investigated these clips for true UFOS as INVESTIGATORS. I challenge you to do the same. Or do you simply believe they are UFOs because the Youtube uploader put "UFO" in big capital letters?

Apparently you do because you posted this.....

You proved them wrong on their own terms, bravo.

Really? Did you even READ the exchange between CirquedeTruth and I?

Here, I'll refresh your memory:

QUESTION:

originally posted by: JadeStar
Thank you CirqueDeTruth. Star for you.

I'm went through these but all I found were meteors, Iridium flares, satellite, the ISS and high altitude airplanes. Did you find any that are truly anomalous?

You know, right angle turns, structured crafts, etc?

EDIT: I also noticed the uploader: ufoevaluator has tinkered with several of the videos by moving clips in time (often separated by hours) out of sequence so objects appear to jump. It's very crude because stars in the more extreme examples of this also jump and in one case you can see the pre dawn horizon brighter than the clip before it. :facepalm:

ANSWER:

originally posted by: CirqueDeTruth
a reply to: JadeStar

No, I didn't find any either that truly stood out for me as a UFO. I was hoping for some right turns and really bizarre behavior.

When I investigated those clips I didn't see anything that was a UFO but rather than just go by what my eye saw I asked for a SECOND OPINION, in this case from CirquedeTruth who was kind enough to locate the clips.

She didn't see any UFOs in them either.

Seeking the second opinion from CirquedeTruth is part of the scientific process of investigating UFOs. But you didn't need that did you? After all, you already had your belief they were real before even looking at them.

Scdfa, you apparently are so desperate to believe without even investigating these clips yourself that you pushed aside that whole exchange between CirquedeTruth and I.

Thanks for confirming that which you angrily responded to: That you have a need to believe and overlook counter evidence which challenges that belief in UFOs piloted by exterrestrials which apparently is based on simply stamping the word "UFO" on something rather mundane and easily explained like those meteor camera videos were.

You decided to accept and then propagate a pretty amateurish hoax without investigating to see if the camera footage actually represented what the Youtube hoaxer alleged.

I doubt they have the strength of character to apologize for being wrong and wasting our time, but I bet jade star doesn't even have the integrity to be embarrassed. I'd imagine her reaction will be more of the same angry whining that makes up most of her output.

Angry whining? Where have I ever angrily whined on ATS? Lol. I mostly just post information or well reasoned counter arguments to dubious claims. How does that constitute anger or whining?

Character Assassination FAIL.

I base my responses on logic, not emotion. They're usually well thought out before I hit the post button. It seems you've been the one who has reacted emotionally. I feel sorry for you.

Nevertheless, you have effectively nullified their argument. Well done, and the evidence in your link was quite fascinating, thank you.
It's your job to refute the fact that there doesn't appear to be any footage of UFOs on meteor cameras which you'd think would see them if they are supposedly flying around the skies, often in areas where these cameras are installed.

Actually she nullified your point that those videos represented actual UFOs.

Unlike YOU CirqueDeTruth and I investigated and all we found was not-so-clever editing of pretty mundane stuff in videos which originally carried a timestamp which the Youtube hoaxer cropped out

Of course by investigating we found a 'null' result, no UFOS. A null result in science is just as valuable as finding what you were looking for and in this case was useful to ATS as it uncovered another Youtube UFO hoaxer.

Investigating > Blind Belief every day of the week.

Investigator > Believer

Don't be a fool. Investigate before you propagate.

originally posted by: JadeStar
Right, so since you presume to know so much, rather respond to your thinly veiled ad hominem attack I want to ask, can YOU give a scientifically valid explanation for the lack of UFOs captured by All-Sky, 24/7 meteor cameras?

I'll be waiting.

I'll give you one...

Those images and videos doe not provide sufficient data for you to truly identify what is being viewed. And about now you are saying that you identified several things; meteors, ISS, and other known objects...

The reality is that you have provided YOURSELF, and only YOURSELF with sufficient data to make the probability of identification high enough for YOU. Its like when I watch a light hang in the sky for 15 - 20 minutes; believing that it is a commercial aircraft on approach to DFW. When in reality, I actually have no data that indicates that other than the fact that it will presently pass over my head and continue on to what "looks" like a landing in Dallas. This is the very same "kind" of identification you are doing...not really very complete, or scientific...but quite typical of the way people work.

I await your denial of this obvious and logical reality.

originally posted by: tanka418

originally posted by: JadeStar
Right, so since you presume to know so much, rather respond to your thinly veiled ad hominem attack I want to ask, can YOU give a scientifically valid explanation for the lack of UFOs captured by All-Sky, 24/7 meteor cameras?

I'll be waiting.

I'll give you one...

Those images and videos doe not provide sufficient data for you to truly identify what is being viewed. And about now you are saying that you identified several things; meteors, ISS, and other known objects...

The reality is that you have provided YOURSELF, and only YOURSELF with sufficient data to make the probability of identification high enough for YOU. Its like when I watch a light hang in the sky for 15 - 20 minutes; believing that it is a commercial aircraft on approach to DFW. When in reality, I actually have no data that indicates that other than the fact that it will presently pass over my head and continue on to what "looks" like a landing in Dallas. This is the very same "kind" of identification you are doing...not really very complete, or scientific...but quite typical of the way people work.

I await your denial of this obvious and logical reality.

Logic: If it looks like a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor it most likely is a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor.

Your logic: Unless I can prove to you that is a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor it's a UFO.

There's something wrong with your logic, it ignores Occam's Razor.


The burden of proof that it is anything extraordinary falls upon the person who alleges that, which would be you, not me.


By the way happy new year

originally posted by: JadeStar

Logic: If it looks like a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor it most likely is a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor.

I think that's what I said; thanks for confirming...

Your logic: Unless I can prove to you that is a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor it's a UFO.

There's something wrong with your logic, it ignores Occam's Razor.


The burden of proof that it is anything extraordinary falls upon the person who alleges that, which would be you, not me.

Actually, I would likely agree with your conclusions, however, in a rather technical sense, the identity of the object is still in question. I understand that these different "class" of object move through the air differently, and in a manner that is rather easy to identify. However, IF one of those would happen to be alien, it think it is highly unlikely that any "extraordinary" movements would likely NOT happen; making that "normal" moving aircraft not really something of Earth. The nature of the data makes it impossible to get good enough "resolution"...

By the way happy new year

Thank you; I did...wish you the same and a successful 2015.

originally posted by: intrptr
a reply to: grainofsand

most of the 'sightings' are just BS

Most…

UFO's only show themselves to the 'chosen' few,

Few…

but I am interested in how 'believers' reconcile the lack of multiple film recordings in a world of mass camera ownership?

Only the garbage is allowed through…

The Pentagon was blown up in broad daylight by a low, slow big noisy jet and there isn't cell cam footage of that either.

Personally, I'm pretty sure it exists, just not in the public realm.

I don't know where the dozen or so friends and strangers are the night we all saw one back in the land before Internet. Sorry I didn't have a camera. It was night time.

Once in a life time event.

This.

I believe real UFOs exist, but are relatively rare events. And the cases I am interested rarely have video or photo evidence available, because those cases involve military, government civilians, scientists, and pilots. If any video evidence exists,its classified, most likely.

Most cases from civillians are unremarkable, as most involve stars and planets, something most urban dwellers seldom see.

originally posted by: Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
I believe real UFOs exist

Respect to you for being honest with your belief.
You are not alone in this thread, but you may be the first believer who does not attempt to portray said belief as fact.
Happy new year

The last experience of a few that I've had was on October 1st, 2014. My friend and I watched two glowing white orbs fly side by side over our heads from west to east. When the passed directly over us they broke their formation and while still flying east, started weaving between each other. Very intelligently controlled flight but seemed very comfortable. Even thou they were coming very close to each other, it was smooth and effortless. They covered the entire, west to east, clear So Cal sky in about 8 seconds. It wasn't until then that I realized I was holding my phone with the camera app opened up. As photo-ready as you could be. I wasn't too happy I missed the photo op. But I was happy I DID have my buddy there as a witness.
Your brain starts processing a lot of new and very odd input at those times. A camera is further down the list than you might expect, unfortunately.

a reply to: mrscary3721
An interesting story, such a pity you missed it with the camera.

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: mrscary3721
An interesting story, such a pity you missed it with the camera.

Exactly. Pretty much all we have are stories for interesting sightings and videos of mundane stuff for not-so-interesting ones. By now we should have better than that and that fact is the elephant in the room. As far as I can Tell UFOlogy has not progressed in 30 years.

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: grainofsand
a reply to: mrscary3721
An interesting story, such a pity you missed it with the camera.

Exactly. Pretty much all we have are stories for interesting sightings and videos of mundane stuff for not-so-interesting ones. By now we should have better than that and that fact is the elephant in the room. As far as I can Tell UFOlogy has not progressed in 30 years.

Just a thought...it is true that not much has changed in 30+ years on the UFO front. and that is really rather curious. It is in Human nature to embellish things, expand on a story; yet even that hasn't happened much to these old UFO stories...

It all seems almost Static...

I'll agree with you to a point. I showed my friend, Frank, a YT video I found yesterday that showed two orbs very similar to the ones we seen. Same flight pattern, speed, height, etc. They were seen in Montana & Utah and it was dated as being in 1952... 63 years ago. And that does seem almost static. But what they filmed in Montana in 1952 and what we saw here in 2014 was absolutely technology on another level, then and now.
Also, I'm 53. I didn't start seeing or looking for things until I was 50. In the right place at the right time. Insanecrazy and not from Earth. Only to see a different 'thing' two nights later. I've seen quite a few 'things' that need no 'embellishing'. Crazier things than I've ever seen on any pics or videos. And I look at everything. I also look for info and answers only to end up with more questions. And I'm not gonna bore you with their details, you wouldn't believe them and I'm sure you wouldn't trust the very best pic or video I could've produced. But I will tell you the only difference between you and me as far as seeing those things. Day or night, I spend more time than you, looking up. My location in So Cal is a big plus. But, get a camera, go outside, scan the skies. It's a lot easier and you'll get quicker results to look for things than to just hope someday you'll be at the right place... blah, blah, blah... Do it with an open mind as well. Hopefully YOU'LL see something noone will believe (including me). DON'T FORGET TO GET A PIC! A GOOD ONE. Using manual focus.
Joking aside... It's as real as you and I.

originally posted by: JadeStar

originally posted by: tanka418

originally posted by: JadeStar
Right, so since you presume to know so much, rather respond to your thinly veiled ad hominem attack I want to ask, can YOU give a scientifically valid explanation for the lack of UFOs captured by All-Sky, 24/7 meteor cameras?

I'll be waiting.

I'll give you one...

Those images and videos doe not provide sufficient data for you to truly identify what is being viewed. And about now you are saying that you identified several things; meteors, ISS, and other known objects...

The reality is that you have provided YOURSELF, and only YOURSELF with sufficient data to make the probability of identification high enough for YOU. Its like when I watch a light hang in the sky for 15 - 20 minutes; believing that it is a commercial aircraft on approach to DFW. When in reality, I actually have no data that indicates that other than the fact that it will presently pass over my head and continue on to what "looks" like a landing in Dallas. This is the very same "kind" of identification you are doing...not really very complete, or scientific...but quite typical of the way people work.

I await your denial of this obvious and logical reality.

Logic: If it looks like a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor it most likely is a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor.

Your logic: Unless I can prove to you that is a plane, satellite, the ISS or a meteor it's a UFO.

There's something wrong with your logic, it ignores Occam's Razor.


The burden of proof that it is anything extraordinary falls upon the person who alleges that, which would be you, not me.


By the way happy new year

Ah, jade is again whining about Occam's, or Ockham's razor. Occam's razor is a remnant of medieval science at its finest, and completely useless in the UFO debate.

Keep in mind, folks, Occam himself used Occam's razor, and came to the conclusion that the Sun goes around the Earth.

Of course, Occam mostly used it to determine weighty 13th century matters such asGod's omnipotence and the divine nature of angels.

You know, hard science.

a reply to: Scdfa

I just love how 90% of tangible threads about UFOs start off with a bang, great videos, superb stories then digresses into incessant banter, arguments and eventually doubt, disbelief, more questions, revelations and ultimately....nothing.

Never fails.