Quantum physics is simply a programming technique

Let's talk about "draw distance". This is a term used to describe how far a user or player can see into the environment of a computer simulated game world. As your avatar moves around on screen the world is dynamically built/rendered and collapsed around you so that only what is focused in your view is generated. This saves on hardware resources. Why tax the computer with calculations to render that pretty beach 5 miles away if you can't see it in game? This leaves the system open to use those resources for other computations such as physics and AI. If you think about it, this is the core concept of quantum physics. According to the double-slit experiment atoms only materialize when observed. To me, this is the smoking gun for a simulated universe.

a reply to: genma

A very good twist and insight on living in a computer generated world. Thanks for the thought, and the post. But in a computer generated world you could have done no different than to realize this and share it with us. So thanks to our programmer, nice work!

a reply to: genma

Yeah but a computer is always limited by space. The only relation would be the Universe is also limited by space. But the results are much different. Within a computer, the random mountains in the background are just pictures. Unless they are programmed in they will never exist for anything other than a cosmetic purpose.

Where as the Universe is Endless. As far as we can tell there is no end to the depth of intricate nature of existance itself.
Computers will always be limited by what is programmed inside. A.I might beable to decide its own choices But will always be limited by its hardware.

If we want to relate to reality. Then yes molecules are simulations of the matter and energy being prepelled.

When objects spin very fast they create surface area along their path. Even if the objects are tiny as long as the speed is equal to the surface area expansion the object will appear much larger than its actual size.

That is why atoms are made of mostly empty space. There is no solid *Shell* that makes up an atom. Rather the objects that orbit a neucleus creates an atom. Or rather any bonding pairs of sub-atomic particles form *atoms* which chain into molecules. Some particles will remain in their magnetically synch pairs such as light which is an electron travelling with a photon.
We can't exactly see pure electrons unless they are rapidly combining with something. Like electricty that seeks a ground.

With computers we can simulate a mind. But this mind will always have boundaries unless we feed it ideas where it can draw up conclusions. However the human mind is not limited by this boundary the same way machines are. A machine can learn much faster but as for imagining completely forign ideas would be very unlikely.

Where as humans can draw ideas up from dreams of psychotic attacks of hallucinations. Many inventions that have changed society into what it is now today were brough about in such a way. Nicola Tesla is not exempt from this but is a pretty good example.

Now i brought up some good points but im going to mention the paradox crushers.

Paradox crusher number 1.
If we live in a simulated universe where our universe exists within a computer. Then that means that such computer outside our universe is probably running on another computer.
Since this would be the nature of the universe, then all universes would be spawned from an infinite creation of universes all spawning to one universe or computer.
Should any of these computers fail, with a probability of infinity since the chain of universes above and below us would thus be infinity as well then that means that it's impossible to go back to the very first computer because the nature of any and all universes come from computers. So since universes do expand and destroy. Even if we want to think about the first universe. It is irrelivant. As all it takes is one of the simulated universes simulating our own to destroy itself and break this chain of simulated universes among the infinite ammount of simulations.

Paradox crusher number 2 Why would it matter if this is a simulated universe or not? we can already estimate that the probability of advanced life existing in the universe is garenteed. So are humans just a program or the original programers? What grants us authority over everything in space and time over say, another alien that may actually be the ones simulating it? In that case what does it mean for us the programs? If we have no chance of existing as a real living entity? What about the aliens that are being simulated here from the universe beyond ours? Are they also programs? and not the original creators of their universe within a computer matrix?

And the chain goes on and on.
Infinitly actually. And since each computer exists within technology of each universe. The probability is definite that our universe would be cut off by say even an *In game* occurance* since all computer simulations branch off of other simulations infinitely.

However our universe can't just be one matrix. If it is that's just messed up.
Maybe computers put us in this matrix? That would be the only explaination. And they are feeding off our memories and energy by hording us within energy harvesting towers.

Of course, To get that far ahead would be like.... Well Matrix the movie.

Have you seen any Mr. Andersons guarding this place? Does the universe run on windowsXP?

BTW thinking of a simulated universe will only drive you insain. Unless you think you are Neo. In that case if you break out of the matrix to fight the robots from harvesting our energy and life sustainance let me know.
We will need to reclaim our planet back somehow. Of course i'm being serious if you are even considering a simulated universe where we exist outside of this one Then yeah. TOTALLY.

The entire universe HAS to revolve around us right? There's no way the universe can't revolve around us? That would be insain if it it didn't right?

I have always felt this as well. I am a game programmer and the double slit experement does seem just like some sort of L.O.D. (Level of detail) optimization. We are either seeing a creators programming, or some higher intelegence at work. Either way it is hard to deny the simulation argument. I would welcome an explanation for these if someone belives differently but I am nearly 75% convinced we do live in some sort of simulation.

a reply to: AnuTyr

I started typing "Probably one of my favorites posts I've read on ATS", then I thought about it a moment, and realized it was my favorite post I've ever read on ATS.

The studies came out that used the phrase "holographic universe" and from then on people (who never even clicked on the article, much less read a couple of wikipedia pages to get a vague idea of what they were talking about) have ran with this "Matrix" idea.

Just another extension of the myriad forms of nihilism we find on ATS!

a reply to: AnuTyr

A very good analogy of reality..... but you lost me at windows XP, the Universe would be constantly rebooting if it was true.

originally posted by: RazielBlaze
I have always felt this as well. I am a game programmer and the double slit experement does seem just like some sort of L.O.D. (Level of detail) optimization. We are either seeing a creators programming, or some higher intelegence at work. Either way it is hard to deny the simulation argument. I would welcome an explanation for these if someone belives differently but I am nearly 75% convinced we do live in some sort of simulation.

Or maybe humans are just recreating nature...

Our DNA is computer code and our brains act like an advance computer and remember will are only on the first rung of the ladder when it comes to computers and already they are taking over.

A.I is fast approaching a level that the programmers don't fully understand quite how it works when they try to reverse engineer the logic created by A.i Programs.

I can think of nothing that cannot be programmmed so yes we do live in a matrix but its nothing that is physical with some demon feeding of our blood.

a reply to: Xeven

Or maybe humans are just recreating nature...

I think you are down the right lines but took a wrong fork in the road.

Ask yourself what we use computers for ?

No i don't think we are just some type of advanced avatar in a computer game or a simulation like happens in a petra dish to see what kills what virus and which one survives in XYZ conditions.

What I do think after much thought is that we have a purpose much like a program thread running inside a computer which people won't like to hear becaause it just makes us cogs in a machine even if the logic is right.

You see we use computers to try to better ourselves (even if it's a right mess) and seek more knowladge and to allow us to have eyes and ears all over the place just like happens when you use Google earth or comunicate on-line.

"God made man in his own image" as maybe but who's to say that God is not trying to better himself just like we are and each one of us are not cogs in the machine that God is using to better his understanding because this theory at least gives us purpose even if we don't want to beleive it.

Within 20-40 years the latest X-Box games will be plugged in to the back of your neck via a socket that has been connected to parts of your brain using nano-bots making us slaves to the machine over time but that's evoloution for you and this will tuen gods 8bit machine into a 16bit machine if you catch my drift.

originally posted by: AnuTyr


Yeah but a computer is always limited by space. The only relation would be the Universe is also limited by space. But the results are much different. Within a computer, the random mountains in the background are just pictures. Unless they are programmed in they will never exist for anything other than a cosmetic purpose.

Where as the Universe is Endless. As far as we can tell there is no end to the depth of intricate nature of existance itself.
Computers will always be limited by what is programmed inside. A.I might beable to decide its own choices But will always be limited by its hardware.

I've been awake for almost 40 hours at this point, so please forgive any incoherent ramblings...

Are you referring to very distant backgrounds in games, the areas that you can see but never visit? Sort of like the hills and pipes you see in the distance when playing Mario World 3? Not sure where I was going with that, but as for the computers being limited by space, that is true of our systems in use here in our reality. If the idea of a simulated universes is true, why would the tech function in the same way as our current computers? We don't have a fraction of the computing power needed to simulate a universe worth of data, and I don't think it is possible with our current tech. However who are we to say that there isn't some completely mindblowing computing method that is capable of handling information on a universal scale...

Just to comment on how our tech has changed over the years, specifically in gaming (and by proxy simulations)...

I've been gaming since NES. Wasn't around for the earliest home gaming, but games like Mario, Double Dragon, Zelda...these were the games I started out with. Throughout my life I've had all the major consoles, I've watched gaming go from a directional pad and two buttons used to guide little more than a blob of pixels through various challenges...all the way to fully destructible HD environments, where more and more individual objects are interactable (is that a word?). Then you have games like The Sims and SimCity, literally playing 'god' and taking control of another being's life (or a whole city in SimCity.). There is a game called Spore where you design a microorganism and lead it through evolutionary changes, with the end goal of space exploration. Hyper realism is becoming the norm for games, and if you combined all the top tier engines and the top tier games from each genre...racing, shooters, RPG, etc...with enough processing power you could create a pretty convincing virtual reality. I've been toying with starting a thread with my ridiculous thoughts on it all...

If we live in a simulated universe where our universe exists within a computer. Then that means that such computer outside our universe is probably running on another computer.

In my limited research, I've never understood this point. Why would it suggest that the computer running our universe is also being simulated?

a reply to: ChaosComplex

why would the tech function in the same way as our current computers

Because it works

We don't have a fraction of the computing power needed to simulate a universe worth of data

Man has only just discoverd computers and already we have games that are almost life like but give it time and these games will allow you to open a cubard, take out a can of beans, open it and view the contents using a microscope if thats what people want and the data needed to show a carbon atom inside a bean needs only be held in memory once.

Who needs to simulate whats happening on the back side of Mars if no one is looking in any case.

I've been gaming since NES. Wasn't around for the earliest home gaming, but games like Mario, Double Dragon, Zelda...

I was around poking machine code into a ZX-Spectrum 48k Machine and i tell you that everything that makes up a human can be programmed and that our DNA is computer code that uses quads (ATCM) instead of bits and bytes.

What i don't get is why each cell has a complete copy of our DNA libary or quite what happens to the DNA during conception.

When we consider things like superposition we understand that we are far beyond any matrix and appear as the infinate made limited due to our current limited perceptions. Its just a matter of time and perception before we experience the infinate again known to us as death, however it is just a death of our limitations in my opinion.

originally posted by: genma
According to the double-slit experiment atoms only materialize when observed. To me, this is the smoking gun for a simulated universe.

Except for the fact that what you're describing is a really flippant interpretation of the raw data in that specific experiment. Truth is that while the jury is still out concerning exactly what is beneath the indications, declaring Solipsism as the only possible explanation requires the obliteration of nearly (I'd say literally, but I'm not that irresponsible) every other possible and/or plausible explanation behind every other experimental indication that's ever been observed within a experimental system setting.

If you limit your view enough, you can "prove" the bible as being a science textbook. The "collapsed wave" theory (superposition) wasn't much more than a quick intellectual rationalization offered to explain why no one could predict the future location of a particle if that particle was sufficiently free of contextual predetermination. "Settled science" is often the least preposterous interpretation of what no one really understands.

a reply to: genma


Yes, but even when atoms are not closely observed to "materialize", it still exists as energy/waveform. This doesn't mean the "universe" is a simulation, but it does mean that our experience o the universe as matter/physical is an illusion while it is actually spiritual/energetic.

There is no difference between the two (matter/waveform energy and physical/spiritual) but some people (observers) separate the two.


We can focus/observe energy-spiritual (connectivity/love) or matter-atom-physical (separate/selfishness)

a reply to: genma

Actually, the double slit experiment shows the observer effect, which is the result of the measuring device (observer) interacting with what is being measured (the observed). Atoms do not simply materialize when observed.

No we cannot see that far. This isn't a limitation of physics, but of our human body.

Superposition and the structure of the universe

a reply to: genma

We must accept it, the interdependence of mind and reality.

Perhaps advanced technologies will actually affect both the mind and reality in tandem, perhaps the key to travelling interstellar distances are devices that manipulate the mind in order to create doorways in reality for us to travel through.

The question is: what information about its original position in the third dimension of space does a photon carry and transfer to the cones on the 2-dimensional surface of the retina in order to construct via the optic nerve the 3-dimensional reality whence it came? According to physics, photons as the quantum messenger particles of the electromagnetic field are inbued only with phase and frequency/energy - that's all. These bits of information tell us nothing about how far away from the eye the electron source of the photon was. Despite this, the brain/mind magically (I say this deliberately because the process is still beyond scientific explanation) interpolates the missing information, for it needs three dimensions of space in order to make the experience of physical reality meaningful, otherwise everything would be just like the unorganised, unintelligible mess of colours spread over a 2-dimensional, painter's palette. Is this gestalt an illusion, like the Hindu doctrine of "maya"? Of course! We are not passive spectators of a hidden reality - like inhabitants of Plato's cave watching the flickering shadows of an unseen world outside it. We are not in the Matrix - we are it because we belong to mind-fabricated duality. The whole point about religion is that it urges us to shift consciousness beyond all levels of duality to a unitive state in which subject and object merge into a single, irreducible reality (Parabrahman, Nirvana). That means going beyond mind to ......

(sssssh!) the Spirit.

originally posted by: SystemResistor
a reply to: genma



We must accept it, the interdependence of mind and reality.



Perhaps advanced technologies will actually affect both the mind and reality in tandem, perhaps the key to travelling interstellar distances are devices that manipulate the mind in order to create doorways in reality for us to travel through.

I think you may be correct, considering that atoms may hold all the keys to the universe itself. If we could quantum tunnel to any and every part of the universe eventually we would be omnipervasive, maybe we already are.