Interesting article on Ukraine shooting down MH17

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

When your primary missile has a limited ability to target, except from behind, you have to be close, which means similar altitude.

originally posted by: BornAgainAlien
a reply to: Zaphod58

Missiles can only be shot flying at the same hight ?

For a missile to reach a greater height, the aircraft has to be inclined by as much as 45 degrees, very difficult to do at an aircraft's operational ceiling; it would stall out and crash. But then, according to the latest "eyewitness testimony," there were originally three Ukrainian fighters on the scene, two of which crashed. Maybe the two that crashed stalled out in shooting down the airliner. Now all Russia has to do is deliver the wreckage of the two fighters to... hey, wait a minute... there is no wreckage. Never mind; Putin will have six more impossible things for you to believe before breakfast tomorrow.

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Missiles can only be shot flying at the same hight ?

Deflection...beautiful.

Now care to try and answer the question asked?

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

Missiles can only be shot flying at the same hight ?

You do understand the more you try the worse your argument gets, especially when faced with the facts that you cannot seem to understand.

Let us try this one last time shall we...

At one time you said it was an upgraded SU 25 that was upgraded to an SU 39 which was debunked as it wasn't a plane Ukraine actually flies, now it is a plane that has upgraded electronics without upgrading the airframe or engines, so now what's next as your running out of SU 25 variants to use for your ridiculous claims?

a reply to: DJW001

Putin will have six more impossible things for you to believe before breakfast tomorrow.

More like before lunch today.

Ha ha ha you guys are all armchair experts that make each other look equally idiotic there are far more intellectual military men who have flown the plane and know and stated that the su-25 is capable of shooting down mh 17 now you guys can bander about your specs all you want but your paper facts won't change the truth which I can't Wait to see your reaction to let me guess it will be a Russian mig disguised as a Ukraine su-25 lol

originally posted by: RyleeNator
Ha ha ha you guys are all armchair experts that make each other mig k equally idiotic there are far more intellectual military men who have flown the plane and know and stated that the su-25 is capable of shooting down mh 17 now you guys can hander about your specs all you want but your paper facts won't change the truth which I can't Wait to see your reaction to let me guess it will be a Russian mig disguised as a Ukraine su-25 lol

Naturally, you will provide a link to an account by a bona fide pilot who has flown one of these craft in the manner you claim.

No point he is Russian so that makes him a Lying so and so here on above top secret: DJW001

a reply to: RyleeNator

Ha ha ha you guys are all armchair experts that make each other look equally idiotic there are far more intellectual military men who have flown the plane and know and stated that the su-25 is capable of shooting down mh 17 now you guys can bander about your specs all you want but your paper facts won't change the truth which I can't Wait to see your reaction to let me guess it will be a Russian mig disguised as a Ukraine su-25 lol

Really even the manufacturer says it can't do what you and a few others keep trying to say it can.

www.sukhoi.org...

Maybe you should inform them and let them know that you know more than the engineers who built the plane.

Also care to provide the testimony of those men who have flown and know more about this plane than the people who built it?

I will be patiently waiting this testimony.

a reply to: RyleeNator

I can't Wait to see your reaction to let me guess it will be a Russian mig disguised as a Ukraine su-25 lol

That will be coming from Born Again Alien as he is running out SU 25 variants to blame.

a reply to: RyleeNator

No point he is Russian so that makes him a Lying so and so here on above top secret:

So that would be a no you can't provide the testimony...correct, because if you or anyone else had such testimony it would have been posted and the fact it hasn't shows it doesn't exist.

a reply to: Zaphod58

When your primary missile has a limited ability to target, except from behind, you have to be close, which means similar altitude.

Are you saying that an air to air missile cannot be fired upwards or that planes never break the designed altitude of a planes design

Maybe the radar image as reported by Russia was true and maybe the eye witness is telling the truth and this might be why they are taking so long to release a report of what shot down the plane.

if it walks like a duck.....................

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Maybe you should inform them and let them know that you know more than the engineers who built the plane.

Do you know what a safty margin is when it comes to designs of fighter jets and did you know that by adding fule tanks to a fighter that it can break manufacturer distance records.

Jets are being upgraded all the time with modifications that allow records to be broken and they can be stripped down to reduce the weight or are you saying that the dam buster raids never took place.

No point having fighter jets if they cannot intercept a passenger jet if you ask me.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

When your primary missile has a limited ability to target, except from behind, you have to be close, which means similar altitude.

An upgraded Su-25 can use R-73 missiles. And those have a lot more range as the R-60, 10km/30km.

It seems newer models of the R-27 have also the same seeker as the R-73.

Russian sources claim early heatseeking variants used the 36T seeker, and more recent variants an adaptation of the MK-80 seeker used in a range of high off-boresight capable R-73 Archer subtypes.

Source

The R-27 can engage targets ranging in altitude from 25m to 20km with elevation up to 10km.

Source

So to me it seems that a Su-25 with its nose up could target something at 10km from a hight of 7km.

a reply to: BornAgainAlien

What sort of missiles did that sharp eyed witness on Kommsomolya Pravda say they were equipped with?

a reply to: VirusGuard

Do you know what a safty margin is when it comes to designs of fighter jets and did you know that by adding fule tanks to a fighter that it can break manufacturer distance records.

Nice switcheroo... we're not talking distance, we're talking altitude. Adding a fuel tank adds weight, which will decrease the operational ceiling.

a reply to: VirusGuard

Maybe the radar image as reported by Russia was true and maybe the eye witness is telling the truth and this might be why they are taking so long to release a report of what shot down the plane.

If the "eyewitness" is telling the truth, there should be two wrecked fighters lying on the ground. Any reports or photos to verify this part of the story?

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: BornAgainAlien

What sort of missiles did that sharp eyed witness on Kommsomolya Pravda say they were equipped with?

So you don`t even read what people post, you`re only just blindly responding to posts ?

a reply to: VirusGuard

No point having fighter jets if they cannot intercept a passenger jet if you ask me.

Well if the SU 25 were a fighter than you may have something, but the fact that it is a designated ground attack plane you have nothing.

originally posted by: RyleeNator
No point he is Russian so that makes him a Lying so and so here on above top secret: DJW001

On the contrary! I always respect genuine, honest testimony, irrespective of whether I agree with the person's politics. If you can find a pilot, even a Russian pilot, who has had experience with this craft prior to the current propaganda campaign, I would not only accept it, I will publicly apologize here. (If you review my posting history, you will see that this is a genuine promise.) I would suggest a hard-copy book published a few years ago, perhaps the memoir of a Russian ace or test pilot. Just scan the the relevant page and copyright information and post it here.