What is acceptable proof of GOD?

a reply to: Klassified

Haha! Well you have some good points there. Edited my post.

Hey what do ya know, this is my 666th post!

a reply to: WakeUpBeer
No need to edit. It was a good addition to the thread. Congrats on the 666th post.

a reply to: deadeyedick

Doing something contrary to the known laws of physics in a big way. For example : rotating the moon 180 so the back now faces us and make it orbit in the opposite direction. Clearly not natural and it won't screw up the earth too much although all those tide tables will have to be re-written.

Or take a team to the opposite side of the galaxy to see what's there, after all God can be everywhere at all times therefore perfectly capable of transporting someone over that vast distance instantly.

a reply to: deadeyedick

"...draw the line between proof of GOD and decption or mental illness."

Are you declaring that the acceptance of God is solely opposed by deception or mental illness?

If that is the case, then perhaps the dead eye of dick sees nothing.

(I am being argumentive; I have more faith in d.e.dick.)

originally posted by: My_Reality
a reply to: deadeyedick

Acceptable proof would be very easy to believe yet extremely difficult to witness. It would be as simple as seeing a person transmute water into wine. As simple as laying hands on a blind man and curing his disability. As simple as restoring life to a dead man or woman. Parting the sea with the raising of a hand. Simply anything that ancient religious texts claim has been done.

Short of that nothing would convince me of the existence of a specific deity or god. Better yet, I don't need proof. I sense higher powers in this reality and give them their due. The funny thing though is they do not resemble the petty, spiteful, destructive, vengeful personalities of the deities or god that many major religions insist exists.

That would only prove that a person or persons could do those things. It would not prove the existence of God.

the easiest solution would be that the god presents itself for examination. no risk, no loss, 100% customer satisfaction guaranteed. i would imagine that any being that is a god may prove itself by demonstrating the qualities that define one as a god. the first step of course being that we need to determine those qualities. quite a wide spectrum of profiles to look at there...

In all fairness, who are we to question someone's faith?

Is it not down to the the individual to decide what they believe in?

People question the fact that religious faith should not be rammed down someone's throat, which I agree. However, I also believe that we shouldn't jump on people that have the belief, why should people want to attack someone who has this belief?

Love is what it's all about, real love that is, regardless of beliefs.

originally posted by: Cobaltic1978
In all fairness, who are we to question someone's faith?

Is it not down to the the individual to decide what they believe in?

People question the fact that religious faith should not be rammed down someone's throat, which I agree. However, I also believe that we shouldn't jump on people that have the belief, why should people want to attack someone who has this belief?

Love is what it's all about, real love that is, regardless of beliefs.

everyone is intent on doing everyone else a favor by showing them how theyve been lookng at it all wrong. then they fix the picture and change someones life for the better. just another brick in the road of good intentions...

Belief in god is an act of faith, as such it precludes, in fact spurns the very idea of proof. A demonstration of proof would deny the reality of god as the god figure is based on faith. A quandary indeed. I myself am not a follower of any religion.

originally posted by: Jonjonj
Belief in god is an act of faith, as such it precludes, in fact spurns the very idea of proof. A demonstration of proof would deny the reality of god as the god figure is based on faith. A quandary indeed. I myself am not a follower of any religion.

is that a historical understanding, or just according to modern spirituality?

a reply to: deadeyedick

If he related himself to the family, I would begin to believe. If he left high scientific information in an ancient document, I would be moved more to believe. If he called himself the Aleph (Strong) Bet (House) as the word Father, I would just think he was joking with us. Aleph Bet, since DNA represents the letters of creation. I would need to really stand up and notice at this point. If he then called the Mother Aleph (Strong) Mem (Water), then I would start to really question what was going on. How could he know that the letters in the seed of a man entered the woman's water, leaving it in an ancient document, if he were not the real God? At this point, that would be my answer.

I still wouldn't believe.

If 4000 years later, he then called his Son the Word, I would then have no doubt. Words are made of links of letters. At this point, I would start to seriously believe that something is going on. If he then called his son Bet (House) Nun (Seed), then I would just start laughing at how I could have missed it all these thousands of years. Such simplicity.

Later, after believing, I might start seriously looking at the rest of the evidence. Maybe I began to doubt. I might look at the most universal of religious words for evidence. What if the word Amen had a secret message mirrored between the two languages of the Bible. I might believe if I found something like that.

Amen means true in Hebrew. In Greek it means Lamb. If I were to find only three words related to child birth, I might believe again.

AMN - Lamb
AMNI - River of Life
AMNIO - Bowl catching the blood of a sacrificed lamb
AMNION - Sac covering the baby in the womb
AMNIOTIC - Fluid of the womb
AMNESIA - Condition of the baby
AMNESTY - When God forgets
dAMNATION - When God remembers

Now, if I found eight words that directly relate, I might still be a bit skeptical. What if I were to then discover that there was a metaphor for baptism that fits all the information I had found so far. If I were to discover, like all mirrored things in nature, that evolution had a counterpart, then I might believe. If I were to, say, find that involution is the cause of evolution, the I might find proof that God really told us how this whole thing works.

If I then found that the Aleph (Strong) Bet (House) also had a relation to the Strong Nuclear force in nature, I might begin to wonder how it is possible anyone could doubt. If I were to then find that the weak force was indeed female compared to the strong force, I would then start my proof over again with the family. What if I were to find the Father was a Neutron and the Mother was a Proton? What if the son (symmetry breaking ) was the Son? I might then discover that the Strong House (force) is Proton and Neutron in one nucleus. Astounding! I would proclaim it on ATS! What if I found that the Son indeed did break symmetry with the Mother and Father? Again, I can't imagine anyone else not noticing this before. Finally, I would be totally sold out when I found this:

Ecclesiastes 4

8 There was a man all alone[Son of God / electron];
he had neither son nor brother.
There was no end to his toil,
yet his eyes were not content with his wealth.
“For whom am I toiling,” he asked,
“and why am I depriving myself of enjoyment?”
This too is meaningless—
a miserable business!

9 Two are better than one [Male Female and Image of God],
because they have a good return for their labor:
10 If either of them falls down,
one can help the other up.
But pity anyone who falls
and has no one to help them up [Yahweh / Son of God].
11 Also, if two lie down together, they will keep warm.
But how can one keep warm alone?
12 Though one may be overpowered,
two can defend themselves.
A cord of three strands is not quickly broken.

Father is Aleph Bet. His son is the Word. Today, we have two strands of DNA. What happens when all three are given to us when the Trinity is together at last?

I believe. Three is better than one. I have so many other proofs, but why do I need them when I have the best in DNA / Aleph Bet? Nature proclaims. We have no excuse for not believing.

I didn't even mention that the Strong Force is invariant symmetry. God never changes. I didn't even mention that the weak force is translational symmetry, meaning it is translated by the symmetry laws of the Strong Force. The weak force does change, which implies that the Son (Electron) is heeled by the Strong Force. How about that. The Mother and Father raise their child.

I a sold. Sign me up.

a reply to: deadeyedick

How about you show me the human being that created everything inside and outside of the Universe... Solve that before you question the existence of God.

originally posted by: deadeyedick
I just thought it could be educational to hear from people about where they draw the line between proof of GOD and decption or mental illness. Let's say that he decides to come and convince everyone that he has always been real. What would it take to convince you and how would you discern any signs from illusion or someone calling you ill? With todays technology growing will there ever be irrefutable evidence that you would accept?

Read Revelation 20, If God sitting right in front of there faces isn't considered "acceptable" proof, then no other form of "proof" will ever be "acceptable".

a reply to: deadeyedick

The acceptable proof....that religions are all a lie and The Dead Sea Scrolls are the true source from which the New Testament was written, is that in 1990 a scholar came out because of an issue in his conscience. If you are unaware, there has been important people for the last 70s telling us, the general public, that there is an academic scandal specifically a cover up involving the release and meaning of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

It is 'the first time that the term "Son of God" has been found in a Jewish or Palestinian text outside the Bible.'

originally posted by: EaglesFan
a reply to: deadeyedick

How about you show me the human being that created everything inside and outside of the Universe... Solve that before you question the existence of God.

How about you show me a supernatural deity who can create anything.

originally posted by: greyer
a reply to: deadeyedick

The acceptable proof....that religions are all a lie and The Dead Sea Scrolls are the true source from which the New Testament was written, is that in 1990 a scholar came out because of an issue in his conscience. If you are unaware, there has been important people for the last 70s telling us, the general public, that there is an academic scandal specifically a cover up involving the release and meaning of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

It is 'the first time that the term "Son of God" has been found in a Jewish or Palestinian text outside the Bible.'

Obviously, you haven't checked when the Dead Sea Scrolls were written.

IMO?

Let the sky open and God's voice come thundering down.

Let all humans on the planet hear him in our native tongues, at the same time. Show us miracle work right before our eyes.

Some suggestions:

1. Clean up the ocean.
2. Revert some deserts back to rain forest.
3. Cure a major ailment or disease instantaneously.

Other than that..

I'm probably not going to bite.

I know I'm asking a lot, but people claim God can do a lot of things. Seems like the 3 above would be a drop in the hat for Yaweh.

~Tenth

a reply to: deadeyedick

The problem with all these types of arguments is that true spirituality is entirely personal. I am against formalized religion in the respect of evangelizing others or preaching beyond having a friendly conversation between people who actually know each other. That would be sharing.

Trying to make a community based on an intimate and personal affair as spirituality has always failed eventually since it is imposition to a degree. Spirituality leads to growth, and as such makes people become different than that which they were. Even if everyone shares a way of thinking about spirituality at a starting point, they will change and evolve over time. The group will then become divided or worse be at odds with each other. There is no reason why they have to take the same path as everyone else in their group. Organized religion creates an imbalance.

God is what life is, what you make of it.

Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. And many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect--if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time. "So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the desert,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. (Matthew 24:4-5; 11; 23-27)

Is hard to prove the existence of God, when you have quotes like the one above. Even Him is telling us not to believe in anything that comes saying "I'm God, I'm the Christ". So it will be quite hard even for Him to prove His own existence (Even performing miracles or other type of show).
We can have all the faith in the world, but since the quote says not to believe in anyone saying that he is the Christ, well that kind of nullifies any attempt.
So at the end the thing is: Go live your life with the highest moral standard you can have, be good, just believe in God. And will see what happen when the day comes.

originally posted by: Abednego
Jesus answered: "Watch out that no one deceives you. For many will come in my name, claiming, 'I am the Christ,' and will deceive many. And many false prophets will appear and deceive many people. At that time if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or, 'There he is!' do not believe it. For false Christs and false prophets will appear and perform great signs and miracles to deceive even the elect--if that were possible. See, I have told you ahead of time. "So if anyone tells you, 'There he is, out in the desert,' do not go out; or, 'Here he is, in the inner rooms,' do not believe it. For as lightning that comes from the east is visible even in the west, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. (Matthew 24:4-5; 11; 23-27)

Is hard to prove the existence of God, when you have quotes like the one above. Even Him is telling us not to believe in anything that comes saying "I'm God, I'm the Christ". So it will be quite hard even for Him to prove His own existence (Even performing miracles or other type of show).
We can have all the faith in the world, but since the quote says not to believe in anyone saying that he is the Christ, well that kind of nullifies any attempt.
So at the end the thing is: Go live your life with the highest moral standard you can have, be good, just believe in God. And will see what happen when the day comes.

Self-Fulfilling Prophecy

The fallacy occurs when the act of prophesying will itself produce the effect that is prophesied, but the reasoner doesn't recognize this and believes the prophesy is a significant insight.

www.iep.utm.edu...

i actually looked this up to see if it was a thing. you would be surprised to learn how much of Christianity relies on psychological tricks you can find in any psyop training camp.