Attempted "No-Knock" Raid at My House

a reply to: U4ea82
No. Reports like this are simply Grey (or Gray) Area material.

a reply to: nenothtu

Cheers for the insight into an experience most people wont want to experience, and unfortunately aren't prepared to experience. The vast majority of people have been domesticated and those who take certain precautions or question the "rules" are seen as paranoid and a menace.
Its a different set up over here in Belfast Ireland, almost all houses are rows and rows of houses all at ground level, luckily for me and my family I am half way up a steep hill which leads to a small mountain (only in name just fal under the height required so its a hill). I have the benefit of high ground and my house is very secure. Being used to experiencing police brutality here for over 20years has made me a bit twitchy and "paranoid", but I will not be taking any chances when it comes to my 2 young ones and wife.
For those who haven't got the luxury of a reinforced position you should have your escape route planned and practiced thousands of times. Remember while they are organising at your door you should already by away and on your way to you predetermined destination with you "stuff".

Paranoid....yes....but I don't want to be the one watching my helplessly as my wife and kids are taken away.

Just look around its only a matter of time until its your turn.

a reply to: nenothtu

My suggestion:

You first call 911 or tell wife to call 911 and still be able to go for your gun if it's baddies. Within few sec the 911 call police so police know they are in comm with people Inside. They figure it's wrong place: they go elsewhere. No gun at you/far less danger.

Just sayin and happy it ended well without holes in anybody

So, if you two are admittedly not nice guys, and one of you has beaten people, and slit some throats....why should I care what happens to you?

a reply to: nenothtu

Holy crap dude...

Lesson # 11

Pack up, Move north to Canada...

erm... one question...

Mistakes can be made - but sometimes those mistakes can get good people killed permanently dead.

Just wondering if there's another "killed" that ain't permanent?

perhaps its the smart ass in me but...

originally posted by: 74Templar
a reply to: nenothtu

Wow, a lot of hate on this thread so quickly....

Guess they don't know you too well like us veterans, hey Neno.

Nah, I reckon not, so I can't really blame them for not believing. They wouldn't know me if I bit them, have no idea who I am. They can believe or not.

These no-knock raids seem to be the new black in the US lately hey? It's almost like they want a showdown and a shoot out every time they go to someone's door. It doesn't even seem to matter if it's the right house or even the right person any more.

I think if they had wanted a shootout, they could have had one. The cops around here are probably a cut above average, I would think. They did get all kinds of nervous, and so did I. That was why I ducked back into the shadows - nervous people, especially nervous people with guns in their hands, tend towards making me nervous, too. It was an honest mistake - not all of the houses around here can be seen - but it could have been a pretty tragic one. They really believed they had the right house, and me showing up in the doorway with a gun pretty much convinced them. On my end, seeing people sneaking around in the dark in MY yard had me pretty convinced they were NOT cops.

It could've got ugly, and I think we were all pretty glad at the end that it didn't.

So goes the militarisation of the law hey? Kill em all and let god (or the courts) sort em out afterwards. Sad, scary times we live in....

Yup. Soldiers are for battle fields, and cops are for the streets at home. lately, the two are getting horrendously confused, with "soldiers" taking to the streets, and cops going overseas to "investigate" terrorism and arrest suspects and whatnot. it's getting upside down now, and some times you can't tell blue from green.

Oh and I can totally imagine B backing down rows of cops with her stare alone lol. You got yourself a tough cookie there.

yeah, she was great, all gung-ho... but wouldn't listen when I told her to get back inside. See, if I'd have had to dive anywhichaway, she might have been where I needed to be, or even if not, I couldn't dive for the both of us. I told her later that she's gonna need more training....

That didn't go over well, I think - maybe she misunderstood the spirit of it?

She was up on the upper story with me, so it was only bullets she had to watch for, but that didn't make me any calmer.

I have no idea what no knock raids are supposed to achieve.

As more and more people take the same stance that you do, it will become unpopular with LEOs.

As the recent case where the homeowner shot dead a police officer and was found not guilty of any offense showed, the jury will see the situation in proper light.

Until the LEOs identify themselves, they are intruders.

P

a reply to: Catacomb

Don't recall reading the OP asked you to care, and you really don't know who you are being rude to. nenothtu is a valued member of ATS, perhaps you missed the 'Regent' under his user name? Also it is his cousin George who he said is not a nice guy, don't you have family members you wish you didn't? nenothtu is a nice guy, defensive under the circumstances and protective, again understandable.

a reply to: Catacomb

You are missing the point. There is a justice system in place, therefore illegal to run around as judge and jury stiffing anyone you feel have been bad boys :p. Also when you grow up in a dodgy area you make and take a few scars. Ive had my own but grateful they aren't too bad. Maybe I am wrong but most people I know grew up fighting, hiding from the british scum and trying to stay out of trouble while causing trouble.

Also the those involved in this kind of violence most of the time knew whats involved and have participated in activities to know how things happen.

If you are talking while you should be listening.....then its your own fault.

a reply to: ~Lucidity



I was only attempting to use humor to try and diffuse the uncomfortable atmosphere that was forming from the negativity being lobbed at the OP. I in no way expect him to have filmed what he went through, especially not without a trained stunt double who's signed a liability waiver. And I most certainly do not actually believe he has a camera hidden up his bum (ouch).
Perhaps my attempt at humor didn't work as well as I had hoped.

I don't like "strangeness in my immediate vicinity" either, neno. I would have been terrified to see all those people on my property with guns. Good Lord, are they out of their minds? George must have done something really sinister to create such a response from swat?

Glad you are all okay. That could have had a terrible ending. I think one shot from you, and they might all have opened fire.

Would it help to file a complaint?

originally posted by: ~Lucidity

You don't know if they would have knocked or not as you apparently prevented them from getting that far is my point. Hence, "attempted" is totally speculation on your part.

True, point granted. My niece telling me she could hear them trying to open the door probably swayed my opinion on that.

Also, " Evidently, they had a warrant for George."

You never saw it? Or an address on it?

Correct. They said they "had paper" on him, but I never saw it. I'm not George, and I didn't think it a good idea to go down amongst them to see it at the time. I guess George saw it - they carried him away in cuffs. To be honest, the way he was acting there at the end, I think he KNEW there was paper out on him. The house he was in had been recently vacated, and I believe he was probably hiding out from someone - not necessarily the law, but possibly - when he went to stay in it and hid his truck from the road.

That, too, is pure speculation, however. I've not talked to him about it. He was released from jail the same night, about 5 hours later, but is back in again - the story I got was that there were some shenanigans at his arraignment hearing, so they locked him down again.

originally posted by: U4ea82
a reply to: nenothtu

LOL. Ah yes, I'm familiar with the ol' pics or it didn't happen schtick. I suppose the proper thing to do would have been to produce a video camera from your bum and film the ensuing mayhem while dodging bullets. Of course, then you'd be accused of CGI so I suppose this is a no-win situation.

I had a cell phone on me, but it's just so blasted difficult to get nervous, armed men to stand on their marks for that perfect shot...

Come to think of it, there may be some surveillance footage. I'll have to check into that, but don't expect any muzzle flashes, since no one got nervous enough to open fire.

a reply to: nenothtu

I agree. I have a hard enough time taking pics of my family and getting them to stand still for a picture...and I'm usually the one holding the gun in that situation.

All kidding aside, I'm glad you're okay. These situations can turn ugly so very quickly, especially in the shoot first, ask questions later society we live in.

originally posted by: Answer

Suit yourself. Some of us know what's really going on.

"Knowing" and "thinking you know" are two entirely different things, but do as you will.

Which other half is that, exactly?

Well us ignorant, bumpkin, redneck hillbillies, of course! I'm one of those lowlife types that occasionally walks among men!

I DO have some pictures of what the area around here looks like - but they're in daylight. If you'd like to see them, I could probably oblige. I'm not in the big city ghetto any more, like I was at this time last year.

Where I am now is pretty close to the boonies like I grew up in... but there are still too many neighbors for my taste. Anyone can count to "one" when there's only ONE house to count, you know? that might have cut down on the confusion.

originally posted by: LoveSolMoonDeath
a reply to: nenothtu

My suggestion:

You first call 911 or tell wife to call 911 and still be able to go for your gun if it's baddies. Within few sec the 911 call police so police know they are in comm with people Inside. They figure it's wrong place: they go elsewhere. No gun at you/far less danger.

Just sayin and happy it ended well without holes in anybody

Honestly, the thought never crossed my mind. I think I've called 911 once in my life, when i was living in the city and cops were handy. Out here, it takes them a while to get to you, and by then it's usually all over and all they can do is write reports. Where I grew up, it would take a minimum of 40 minutes response time if they were ALREADY on the way, so we just handled it. here' the response time would probably be less, may 20 to thirty minutes, but still too slow when seconds count.

As an example, it seems to have taken them about two hours to get the SWAT team gathered up and equipped, and on-site, assuming that the call was made around the time I was talking to George about the "soldiers in the woods". I'm making that assumption because I have a notion of who called, and that's the only time they would have had to call - when George was out "hunting soldiers". had they made the call when George was around them, it may have gone badly for them. So - yes, it's an assumption, but I believe it's a pretty strong one.

As the old saying goes, "when seconds count, the cops are only minutes away".

It's not so bad living in the UK, where stuff like this would never happen. I'm sure the cops have gone into the wrong house occasionally with the big red key, but I like the fact they're not armed to the teeth. Policing by consent. You should try it America. your police are out of control

originally posted by: Catacomb
So, if you two are admittedly not nice guys, and one of you has beaten people, and slit some throats....why should I care what happens to you?

I don't suppose you should!

I didn't ask you to care - I just put the information out there to show that mistaken identities DO happen, honest mistakes, and if handled properly, no one has to get shot in unraveling them. it's not about ME. Could have been anyone.

Way too often these days, that "anyone" gets shot anyhow, and many of those getting shot ARE nice people. The story that prompted me to come out with this was the one about the seven year old girl who was shot in the head and killed in Detroit by bad policing.

Killed in her sleep, and she was likely NOT a "not nice person" such as myself or George. She was probably a very nice person, and died in her sleep, never knowing what hit her, because of piss-poor policing.

Cops ought to know that it can go the other way, too, if they do piss-poor policing, and run across the wrong folk.

Maybe it'll keep 'em on their toes.

Cops around here are a generally pretty good sort, and don't just indiscriminately open fire. Now, if they take that a bit further, and leave the soldiering to soldiers, they could become the Perfect Cops.

Police should get back to policing.

originally posted by: Akragon

erm... one question...

Mistakes can be made - but sometimes those mistakes can get good people killed permanently dead.

Just wondering if there's another "killed" that ain't permanent?

perhaps its the smart ass in me but...

Because of kids these days.

Life isn't a video game, and I've run across a few who seem not to understand that. there are no respawns, no do-overs.

Once your dead, you're PERMANENTLY dead.

And yeah, I said it like that - "killed permanently dead" - because of the smartass in me, too!

originally posted by: Iamschist
a reply to: Catacomb

Don't recall reading the OP asked you to care, and you really don't know who you are being rude to. nenothtu is a valued member of ATS, perhaps you missed the 'Regent' under his user name? Also it is his cousin George who he said is not a nice guy, don't you have family members you wish you didn't? nenothtu is a nice guy, defensive under the circumstances and protective, again understandable.

Nah, I'm really not a very nice guy, and said so in the OP, so it's understandable that the other poster would take that stance. About the best that can be said of me is that I try to be fair, but there have been times when I was decidedly un-nice.

Thanks for thinking I am, though!

And yeah, I can get out of sorts when I have a house full of women I care about and sneakers are about outside around it.