What I love about the pro-life logic...

a reply to: smithjustinb

Nice memes…

All of which come down to…

Abortion is murder.

Until people, and the courts, understand this, there will be no justice for the unborn.

a reply to: okrian

I'm still shaking my head over your post. Let me see, you're going after smithjustinb, claiming his contribution was not intelligent? And yours was . . .?

Actually, his post was far more substantive than yours. Sometimes ideas are passed more cleanly in pictures. As I scroll up, I see the point that a fetus most certainly is life, any scientist looking at a specimen from some unknown source would declare instantly that it is life. Would you care to disagree?

Or do you disagree that many women suffer from depression and emotional problems after an abortion for the same reason shown in the next poster?

Or, do you disagree that the purely scientific position on the issue is that human life starts with the Zygote?

Would you care to discuss any of the other points in his post?

No, anybody searching for truth instead of hiding it is not part of the problem.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71
As for abortion, anybody that thinks aborting an 8 month old fetus is not murder has a screw loose.
How about meeting in the middle. No abortions after the first trimester and making adoption easy after that with the adoptive parents paying the medical costs..

I'm not an expert here or anything but I don't think 8 month old abortions are common practice. In fact, I don't think they even allow that unless it's for some medical emergency or something. I always thought the rule was nothing after the first trimester like you suggested.

originally posted by: okrian
a reply to: smithjustinb

So… do you have an opinion beyond a series of "oh so clever" internet memes? Nice intelligent contribution. You, my friend, are part of the problem.

Is this what you do? Make a statement and then throw in a jab at the end? I've noticed that about you. It really shows how low you have to stoop to voice your opinion. Talk about the lack of an intelligent contribution and the pot calling the kettle black. Talk about liberal hypocrisy.

The "problem" you are referring to as a problem is your opinion of it being a problem. In my opinion, the problem is pro-lifers. Notice the first two memes I posted.

You asked, "do you have anything other than memes"? Read the post again. Read the science of when human life begins. Its in the post (in case you didn't even read the post in the first place).

I have nothing further to discuss on this matter. Discussing my pro life views with a pro choicer is the equivalent of the first meme I posted. Its a brick wall.

a reply to: adjensen

there will be no justice for the unborn.

What does that even mean?

Hyperbole much?

I read through a lot responses here. The argument the pro-choicers seem to lean on is the right of the woman in this situation. The unborn child doesn't appear to have any... because no-one can decide when said child becomes a human... So, can a feotus in a womans womb, develope into anything BUT a human? Like maybe a goat... a dog... a platypuss... Has that ever happend before?

If the answer is no, then why do we wait so long to confer this grand classification on this unborn being?

a reply to: 001ggg100

Women's ova are human ova. A fertilized human ova is NOT a person.

a reply to: 001ggg100

It's either sad or not, depending on your point of view. We wait that long because there was societal pressure to do so. People refused to make the change at the ballot boxes. Almost every state said "No, we don't do abortions here." We know what happens when the people and the Legislatures refuse to do something. The Courts.

Actually, we know when the child becomes human, at conception. There's no argument about that. The question was, when do we start protecting this new human's rights?

You know Roe v. Wade? That's the case where the Supremes said that abortion was a right protected under the US Constitution, and the states could only mildly interfere with it in specific cases.

It's probably not necessary to get into the legal argument, but even though some of my professors said they agreed with the result, it was the feeblest legal reasoning they'd ever heard come from the Court. This was a case where you didn't want to see how the sausage was made.

But, they drew the lines, and all the States were forced to change their laws to comply. Shameful, but effective.

a reply to: windword

... But it is HUMAN and so deserves the rights of a HUMAN... and the basic right of a Human, is the right to life... regardless of the political bs people use to prop up their argument.

Is that really what it looks like? I haven't heard anyone claim this was photoshopped yet. That sure looks like a little human being to me.

This was discussed in my philosophy of biomedical ethics class. There was no clear answer. So fight away. Post graphic and horrible pictures.

DO YOU EVEN KNOW WHAT A GHETTO ABORTION IS?! Do you even know that most pregnancies end in what the medical community terms a mensuration cycle?!

Its great you consider a baby precious. I do too. What about the women that will go to any lengths to terminate the pregnancy? What about woman that don't want to be pregnant and so refuse to properly care for their pregnant body?

I was not mature when I had either of my children. My grandma says we grew up together. I am grateful I had the choice. Making that choice made all the misery I went through worth while. Can you imagine if the woman didn't have the choice?

I tease my children that I should buy me presents on their birthday, after all I did all the work. Flip that to a person that doesn't bond with the baby, that effects the baby!

The bottom line is people need to make choices they can live with. Idk how a person can live with some of their choices. I bonded with my babies intrauterine. The point is it not up to anyone but the woman.

I did read how that wasn't fair for men, I can't argue that. However men don't have parasites in their body for 40 weeks and then nurse the baby for a year after. That's life changing. Women have much more vested in the baby.

originally posted by: 001ggg100

a reply to: windword

... But it is HUMAN and so deserves the rights of a HUMAN... and the basic right of a Human, is the right to life... regardless of the political bs people use to prop up their argument.

A fertilized egg is not a person, it is a part of a woman's body. A woman has no obligation to her eggs, fertilized or not, or to anyone else, to carry any of them to term.

Conservatives, none of their own lives are anyone's business but...

when SUDDENLY, it's about the abortion of someone they don't even know, want to know or want to care about then, yeah ohhh... it's now THEIR business.

"Oh no don't kill the poor human beings!...even which I WON'T GIVE A CRAP IF HE GROWS UP POOR : PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY HELLO?"

It's not your damn life, if someone feels like taking responsibility is having an abortion, well it's their damn life not yours.
I mean, what's so hard about getting it.

You. Them. You. Them.

You don't like laws restricting YOUR lives, YOUR liberties?
Why don't you just do like you do with every other aspects of other strangers lives and not give a crap?

If you want to stay with your fascist opinion about abortion at least do us all a favor and go adopt a child.

originally posted by: theMediator

It's not your damn life,

It's not the mother's life either.

if someone feels like taking responsibility is having an abortion,

Then, they have a twisted interpretation of the word, "responsibility".

well it's their damn life not yours.

Its the child's life actually. It becomes official shortly after the sperm hits the egg.

I mean, what's so hard about getting it.

I know.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

originally posted by: SearchLightsInc

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71

originally posted by: SearchLightsInc

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71
a reply to: SearchLightsInc

My last line was "when" the baby has rights.
So just for #s and giggles when do you feel the baby has rights?
Myself being an atheist and having low moral standards (being a blasphemer) lol..
I feel the first trimester is a good happy middle ground but what do I know, how bout you?

That's not the question that concerns me, I'm genuinely stumped that some deem the pregnancy a woman's responsibility and yet attempt to remove all decision making from her hands because she's not responsible enough???

Haha!
Now who's avoiding the question?
I agree that men are equally responsible for pregnancy.
Now when does the child get the right to choose to live?

I don't know, why don't you start a thread about it and stop trying to move away from the OP?? This isn't about when the potential human becomes human, it never was.

That's exactly what it's about....
Your wondering why someone has any authority to tell you what to do, but you fail to realize that the baby might have rights.
You have the right to get pregnant.
You have the right to use birth control.
Your organs your rights, simple enough.
But and here's the big but, when you get pregnant there are another set of organs that are not yours.

No, if this thread was about the unborn then the title would be "when does an unborn child gain rights"

No where in the OP is the unborn even mentioned because the unborn has absolutely nothing to do with what this thread is about. This thread is hardly about women's right either, it's about the illogical argument of holding someone accountable for their actions and then removing decision making from their hands because you don't believe they are responsible enough to make decisions.

I don't appreciate you hi-jacking this thread by trying to change the point of discussion. If your concerned about the unborn, go start a thread on it. If you actually want to discuss the issue I've raised, stay on topic.

originally posted by: DarknStormy
a reply to: SearchLightsInc

I think it's illogical to not think about the consequences before you go spreading your legs for your own pleasure also especially knowing that there are many different avenues to prevent women from falling pregnant in the first place.

Okay so, do you deem the women fully responsible for the pregnancy? Because if you do, you're acknowledging her as an individual who had accountability and ownership of her body - and if she has that, you can't tell her what to do because it's none of your business?

originally posted by: SearchLightsInc

Okay so, do you deem the women fully responsible for the pregnancy?

Do you deem the father has half the choice of whether or not a baby can be aborted?

originally posted by: SearchLightsInc
it's about the illogical argument of holding someone accountable for their actions and then removing decision making from their hands because you don't believe they are responsible enough to make decisions.

The baby is incapable of making a decision about its life. A pregnant woman having an abortion has never made a decision about her body. She made a decision about someone else's. The accountability is for the actions they took against another person that had no choice and could take no action.

originally posted by: theMediator
Conservatives, none of their own lives are anyone's business but...

when SUDDENLY, it's about the abortion of someone they don't even know, want to know or want to care about then, yeah ohhh... it's now THEIR business.

When SUDDENLY, the mother wants to abort someone they don't know, want to know, or want to care about, then yeah ohhh... someone needs to put an end to that murder.

originally posted by: smithjustinb

originally posted by: SearchLightsInc

Okay so, do you deem the women fully responsible for the pregnancy?

Do you deem the father has half the choice of whether or not a baby can be aborted?

The word "deem" doesnt really fit in that sentence but i think i know what your griping at.

Again i must point out that this thread isnt about the unborn or the father's rights. It is about holding someone accountable for their body and then saying "actually, although its your fault you got pregnant, you cant make decisions over your own body"

People need to stick on topic.