Just....Stop.

I'm reading people's opinions on religion and it's sad because they base their feelings off of a false church. The Vatican is not representative of true faith. If it was do you really think they'd kill millions? Allow priests to molest children? No because it's the seat of evil.

As a Christian I feel love towards everyone. This includes my best friend who's a gay crossdresser, and my Jewish atheist gf. Misinterpretation is the root of hatred towards faith and lack of faith alike. If people want to truly understand religions, they should read the texts themselves and not listen to official dogma which was perverted by TPTB ages ago to keep us divided and hating eachother.

Signed a Christian who thinks the modern church is corrupt and evil. Who doesn't go to church on Sunday because it isn't the true Sabbath. Who gladly interacts with atheists, Jews, Muslims, blacks, gays, etc on a daily basis and sees them as humans, not as "sinful individuals".

@Thecakeisalie
Prezbo369 is right and I show you why.

This is what you wrote:

originally posted by: Thecakeisalie
a reply to: DAVID64
The thing is that atheists and theists have more in common than they'd like to admit-both are stubborn, dismissive folk who would rather eat carpet than to entertain the idea that the other side might have a valid point. Atheists could learn a thing or two about the values that the bible teaches, and the devotees could learn a thing or two about scientific process.

With my limited knowledge of english language, I dare to tell you that the word "they" excludes you.
But Prezbo369 wrote to you, you are either atheist or theist. That´s what you don´t understand.
And this is why he wrote you can get of your horse. Because you excluded yourself from them while you clearly belong into one of the groups.

I noticed this in the first sentence while reading you post, before I saw prezbo commenting on your logic fail, btw.
The fail lies on you side. clearly.

a reply to: DAVID64

very nice rant!

indeed.

I agree completely!

the problem with some atheists is that they don't realize that Atheism is also a belief, they think the science and belief in God are not compatible.

a reply to: demus

Well, considering that science deals in facts that can be reproduced, or theories that can be studied (until they do or do not become fact), and religion deals in taking something on blind faith and can never be proven as fact (ever!)....

Not sure where the compatibility lies. Not to say a religious person can't be intelligent, it's just mind boggling that they also believe in invisible men in magical kingdoms in the sky. It makes it so I have to take anything they say with a grain of salt.

a reply to: Hushabye

so every religious person "believe in invisible men in magical kingdoms in the sky"?

that is what you think?

what many atheists (often born Christians) don't realize that they are against Christian image of God.

a reply to: demus

I am fully aware that I am against religion. I am also fully aware of why I am against religion. I wasn't 'born a christian.' No one is 'born a christian (or whatever flavor your fantasy lies in)'. They are indoctrinated as children in the same fashion as any cult that has ever existed on this planet.

Programmed- and by their own elders. It ought to be illegal. When you tell your 5 year old who 'god' is, tell them about all the murders commited in its name too. Make sure your child knows it all, why don't you. No? Why not?

a reply to: Hushabye

what I meant was "raised as Christians".

some level of indoctrination will always exist - if you leave the empty slate somebody or something else will fill it.

what I was trying to ask is why most atheist always mention "a man in the sky, in the fantasy land"?

that is close to Christian version of God so you oppose it.

I too don't believe in such God.

a reply to: DAVID64
You seem very well balanced to me, hence you not understanding why other atheists feel discriminated against.
These days discrimination is about darn near everything!

I think it's wise to let your children choose for themselves. My father I think is an athiest. He condemns religion and does not believe in God. He goes on and on about it. I do believe in God, so his beliefs have not defined me.

originally posted by: Prezbo369
a reply to: AnuTyr

Care to give a definitive definition for 'spirituality'?

Because I'm fairly sure that every single ATS member that has ever existed and will ever exist, will have a different definition for that word.....

Belief in a consiously oriented universe. Does not mean the universe was created by 1 single consious being.
With spirituality we understand that things have chain reactions with cause and effect. What effects the physical world effects the *Spiritual world* and visa vera, To believe in spirituality means that there are other outlets for consiousness even our own to be housed in. That there is sacred things in the universe. It does not have to be religious however.

Spirituality

Those who speak of spirituality outside of religion often define themselves as spiritual but not religious and generally believe in the existence of different "spiritual paths," emphasizing the importance of finding one's own individual path to spirituality.

"SPIRITUALITY is a state of consciousness that reflects engagement the deep and often urgent NEED to understand, a "need to know." The state of consciousness can be characterized in biological as well as phenomenological terms. The need reflects a biologically relevant need: it is to understand cause and effect relationships, a need expressed in all organisms (and living cells?) that change their behavior as a result of experience (learn, accommodate to their environments). Much of this need is accommodated by automatisms and acquired habit, but at the furthest end of the spectrum of expressions of this need is the awareness of phenomena that cannot be accommodated by our senses or cognition, they exceed our competence to understand and thereby create a sense of inferiority.

The need to know is progressively energized by affect that is recruited by real or perceived urgency. This involves it intimately with the neuroendocrine stress system, the source of emotions. Cause and effect relationships are the building blocks of the narratives --stories-- that affect if not direct our behavior. As such an adaptive tool, to be most useful, the story should be built of valid (veridical) phenomena. And should be reliable (consistently manifest). These are qualities which can be tested or taken on faith. Our confidence in the narrative is important to its utility and can vary with the qualities of validity and reliability. Narratives in which we are VERY confident are regarded as TRUTH." Conscious awareness of an inadequate cognitive competence invites the engagement of NON-CONSCIOUS COGNITION, the "FORCE," the transpersonal consciousness, the transcendental ... on the other hand, "the best things can't be told..."

Read more here

a reply to: blupblup

The article I read on this yesterday said that you could get a bulletin from anybody and use it. You didn't have to even attend church. You could get a bulletin from a neighbor, after church from the trash even, or from anywhere else and they would honor it.

originally posted by: Kali74
The reason this discount for Christians is becoming an issue is because it's discrimination. Christian = discount, while everyone else pays full price.

I don't think this would qualify though. It's not saying the Discount is for Christians only. It said, "%10 off pizza, if you bring in a church bulletin on Sunday."

Anyone can bring in a church bulletin on Sunday regardless of whether they are Christian or not or even religious. Nothing is stopping an Atheist from going and getting a church bulletin on Sunday and bringing it in to get the discount.

It's no different than bring in a Pepsi Can to Magic Mountain and getting their discount. Or bringing in some other readily available coupon which is accessible to anyone should they desire to get one.

I would hope that they would honor a bulletin from any church or temple as well since they don't specify.

a reply to: mOjOm

If that's truly the case, then no it's not overtly discriminatory

originally posted by: Hushabye

All will be forgiven in the magical sky land, so why should it matter what happens here?

That's why religion needs to be stamped down.

You lament history's demonstration of religion as the impetus for many a war and social strife, yet in almost the breath state that "religion needs to be stamped down".

The irony. I can't recall when an ATS theist has ever called for the atheists to be "stamped down", or anything of the sort.

Who's oppressing who?

originally posted by: Kali74
The reason this discount for Christians is becoming an issue is because it's discrimination. Christian = discount, while everyone else pays full price. Can you imagine if this were going on with race? What if Chinese restaurants offered discounts to Chinese and no one else?

But, but, but... I'm being persecuted!

I think I've said this a thousand times by now. A lot of people really need to understand the difference between personal private property (your home) and owning a public business (still private property but with conditions). Learn about Public Accommodation and what business owners agree to with their town, city, state when they open a business.

The deal wasn't "Christian = Discount" The deal was "bring in a church bulletin = discount". I honestly don't see how you could get the two confused. It's like a scavenger hunt. It could have been a buletin to the church of Satan or scientology, or discordianism. And it never said you had to be a member of said church. It's almost like bring in a coke can to get $5 off entrance to the county fair. Or any other kind of deal that has been perfectly fine for as long as I can remember. Heck you could make up your own bulletin and print it out. WHAT'S the big deal? It's a measly 10 per#ingcent!

a reply to: mOjOm

Ah dammit! Oh well. Maybe I can save a little face with a diversionary tactic...

Uh... great minds think alike? *whonk...whonk...who-o-o-o-o-o-onk*

I wonder what group of people would have the most access to church bulletins 99.9% of the time......?

Very clever I'm sure.

originally posted by: Kali74
The reason this discount for Christians is becoming an issue is because it's discrimination. Christian = discount, while everyone else pays full price. Can you imagine if this were going on with race? What if Chinese restaurants offered discounts to Chinese and no one else?

But, but, but... I'm being persecuted!

I think I've said this a thousand times by now. A lot of people really need to understand the difference between personal private property (your home) and owning a public business (still private property but with conditions). Learn about Public Accommodation and what business owners agree to with their town, city, state when they open a business.

I would have no problem with that whatsoever, government needs to get the hell out of private enterprise...period...

If someone wants to discriminate, let them. They'll probably either go out of business or flourish, who cares. go somewhere else if you don't like it.

Jaden

originally posted by: 3n19m470

originally posted by: Kali74
The reason this discount for Christians is becoming an issue is because it's discrimination. Christian = discount, while everyone else pays full price. Can you imagine if this were going on with race? What if Chinese restaurants offered discounts to Chinese and no one else?

But, but, but... I'm being persecuted!

I think I've said this a thousand times by now. A lot of people really need to understand the difference between personal private property (your home) and owning a public business (still private property but with conditions). Learn about Public Accommodation and what business owners agree to with their town, city, state when they open a business.

The deal wasn't "Christian = Discount" The deal was "bring in a church bulletin = discount". I honestly don't see how you could get the two confused. It's like a scavenger hunt. It could have been a buletin to the church of Satan or scientology, or discordianism. And it never said you had to be a member of said church. It's almost like bring in a coke can to get $5 off entrance to the county fair. Or any other kind of deal that has been perfectly fine for as long as I can remember. Heck you could make up your own bulletin and print it out. WHAT'S the big deal? It's a measly 10 per#ingcent!

Exactly, they could bring in a bulletin from the luciferian church and it would still count, hell if some of the paradigm followers would acknowledge the religious aspects of their beliefs, they could bring in a AGW flyer and get the discount.

Jaden

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: mOjOm

If that's truly the case, then no it's not overtly discriminatory

If you read the article, that was exactly the case (and he's still doing it too. ANYONE can receive the discount, if they present the flier...a jewish rabbi could walk in, hand them the flier, and will get the discount).

However.....speaking of it being a case of discriminatory action:

I guess that means that no business should be allowed to offer senior citizen discounts....correct? I mean, that would be discriminating against those who are young...right?

Or what about veteran discounts that some businesses offer? That would be discriminating against people who did not serve in the military.....right?

My wife has a Walmart discount card. It takes 10% off all general store items, and some food items. She received it since she is a full time employee of Walmart and has had it for years. This year, she hit her 20th anniversary, and now gets to keep that card for the rest of her life.
But wait. That's not fair to non-Walmart employee customers, is it? I mean, they should stop doing that! Walmart is discriminating against all non-Walmart employee customers!

So.....where does it start and where does it end? If you'd read the article, you'd find that the lawsuit was started by a group that is not even from the same place as the Mom and Pop Pizza place.

I don't want to see someone denied service because of the color of their skin. I don't want to see someone denied service because of what they may or may not believe in. I don't want to see someone denied service simply because of their sexual orientation.

However.....where do we draw the line? In this one case, there was absolutely NOTHING stopping ANYONE from getting the discount if they followed the directions (just as there is NOTHING stopping someone from using a coupon at a store).

But there are cases were, no, you do not get a discount while others do (my examples above). Do we demand that all those be taken away because they "discriminate"?

So....again...where do we draw the line? Service wasn't being denied. Simply a select group was being offered a discount (and in this case it was possible for anyone to be in that select group). We have many businesses that offer discounts to select groups that not everyone can be in. Do we take those away? If not....why? Are they not also discriminating?

Gets silly after a while in my opinion. I think a line of some sort should finally be drawn.

Right now the pizza guy is loving the atheist..............getting all this free advertising.