Brown Autopsy Report Leaked by NYT

a reply to: Kali74

Can it impair your judgement?

a reply to: Libertygal

Your bias is just as obvious.

And I get it now, you can nitpick post's but we are not allowed to do the same back. Good to know.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Sure in the everything is funny/calm/slow kinda way.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Would just like to caveat that it doesn't matter if he had smoked weed 10 minutes prior. Weed does not, regardless of how much smoked, make you violent... rather the opposite.

For the most part, that can be the case, however, it is not known what, if anything else, he had on board.

The point was, however, that people want transparency, and when things don't go as they had hoped, they get wickedly pissed, and shoot the messenger. Just look at the above for proof of that.

The one good thing about it, however, is that the evidence cannot be witheld, because now it is public knowledge.

A lot of things are being done, publically, to sway opinions towards one side. Now, the other side is coming out and presenting information, but, none if it is credible? It is very hypocritical, and obvious of an agenda.

If people want facts, they want facts, whether good or bad for their "side".

Therein lays the problem, however. People are choosing sides, when liberty and justice are supposedly blind.

All of these people crying for justice really want revenge, and if the officer is found to be not guilty, can you honestly tell me they will just go home? Keep in mind all of the agencies involved as you ponder that answer.

By the same token, if he is found guilty, do you think there will be riots or celebrations?

This is part of those "talks" people claim to be wanting to have, but until there is honesty, it just won't happen.

See the sign I posted above. I know it doesn't speak for everyone, but I believe it speaks a deeper truth than many are willing to admit to.

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: Libertygal

Your bias is just as obvious.

And I get it now, you can nitpick post's but we are not allowed to do the same back. Good to know.

I didn't nitpick anything. I attempted to explain the difference, in medical terms, between chronic and casual, the types of drug tests, and how long they take.

Seems to me you were the one that picked a post apart line by line.

Go play crazy somewhere else.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Would just like to caveat that it doesn't matter if he had smoked weed 10 minutes prior. Weed does not, regardless of how much smoked, make you violent... rather the opposite.

But Brown looked pretty frisky a few minutes before he got shot.

The store video shows he appears to be a little "hopped up" if you ask me.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Would just like to caveat that it doesn't matter if he had smoked weed 10 minutes prior. Weed does not, regardless of how much smoked, make you violent... rather the opposite.

If it was laced with PCP or something, it might. My go-to LEO that I ask questions of says they act bat sh*t crazy and their pain thresh hold is off the charts.

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Would just like to caveat that it doesn't matter if he had smoked weed 10 minutes prior. Weed does not, regardless of how much smoked, make you violent... rather the opposite.

But Brown looked pretty frisky a few minutes before he got shot.

The store video shows he appears to be a little "hopped up" if you ask me.

It could have been he was jonesing badly, and anxious to get out of there and get his blunts rolled and smoked. Who is to say? I smoke cigarettes, and I know I can get pretty irritable if I can't get away to go smoke at times. In smoking blunts, which are rolled tobacco leaves, he was also taking in tobacco, obviously, so he may well have been jonesing for tobacco, as well as marijuana.

I suppose the quantitave report may answer to that, the level of thc may shed light, or witnesses, to his frequency of use. Darion, being a Federal witness at this point, may be used as a hostile witness to the defense.

Since he was likely granted immunity for his testimony, he may reveal some shocking truths. He may also be whisked away, afterwards, into a witness protection program, and relocated.

People are making huge assumptions that he will just plain be a witness for the prosecution, but, that may not be the case.

It was discovered he had an outstanding bench warrant from another district from 2011, for failure to appear after he was arrested for a theft. His attorney states, "That has been handled..." hmm.

That, coupled with the situation he found himself in, giving false statements on television many, many, times, he may have actually been 'turned'.

The very fact that his attorney refuses to answer whether or not he has immunity speaks volumes. Otherwise, he would just say, "No, he doesn't have immunity".

I think more shocks are in store for both "sides" as this legal drama unfolds.

originally posted by: Libertygal

originally posted by: queenofswords

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Would just like to caveat that it doesn't matter if he had smoked weed 10 minutes prior. Weed does not, regardless of how much smoked, make you violent... rather the opposite.

If it was laced with PCP or something, it might. My go-to LEO that I ask questions of says they act bat sh*t crazy and their pain thresh hold is off the charts.

Excellent point, as well. And, PCP is not a quick test done on urine or blood, it us one of the longterm screens that will be in the 4-6 week result group.

The quick screens only include
Barbituates
Thc
Cocaine
Acetaminophen
Phenobarbs
Alcohol

ETA left off Codeine

a reply to: Libertygal

Here's the thing, you have Michael Brown delivered as a drugged up thug that attacked a police officer and you have all along.

Most people disagreeing with you are disagreeing with you specifically because of that, at least I am.

Let's say you are correct about everything but leave assaulting the officer off the table. Everything you present is character assassination, and does not in anyway justify the cop shooting Brown to death. Do we really want to condone cops being judge, jury and executioner? I may be wrong but I don't think you want that anymore than any other American does.

The only thing that justifies the cops use of lethal force is if Brown assaulted or was about to assault him. That's it. Now speaking for myself, because I have done a lot of reading about police use of excessive force, unjustified lethal force, civil rights violations... and little to no oversight or repercussions for doing so. I also see the increasing militarization of police forces across the entire United States and I see that as a threat to my liberty and all Americans. I also saw how this particular PD handled the aftermath... Brown's body in the street for hours then loaded into an SUV? Really? The absolute 100% lack of interviewing witnesses on the scene or anytime after. It reeks of cover-up, to me.

You seem to need the man to be a thug, you seem to accept any source (nurse on FB, really?) that supports what you want the story to be. Me? If it turns out the man assaulted the officer or was about to, so be it... still sad but everyone has the right to defend themselves.

a reply to: queenofswords

Yup. But I'm talking about weed, not weed cut with anything.

originally posted by: queenofswords

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Would just like to caveat that it doesn't matter if he had smoked weed 10 minutes prior. Weed does not, regardless of how much smoked, make you violent... rather the opposite.

If it was laced with PCP or something, it might. My go-to LEO that I ask questions of says they act bat sh*t crazy and their pain thresh hold is off the charts.

Mods, the following is for educational purposes only. I do not condone drug use, especially the use of PCP!
Anyhow, people don't usually "lace" marijuana with other drugs...Well, not so much any more. I have read about a "Primo" which is a a blunt (for lack of a better term) of marijuana sprinkled w/coc aine. A Sherm is a marijuana cigarette DIPPED in PCP, but honestly, PCP isn't a very commonly used drug, anymore.

For the most part, people who purchase coc aine or PCP want the FULL effect of what they paid for and do not usually mix marijuana with these drugs.

I've seen (as a medical profesional) people on PCP (YEARS ago) and they don't act like Mr. Brown did.

I highly doubt he was "on" PCP at the time of the shooting. For ANYONE to even speculate what substances he was, or was not on, at this point in the investigation is silly. Toxicology reports take several weeks, in every case, to come back.

But, now that the justice dept. is doing their own autopsy, then maybe they can expedite those results? This is getting out of hand. There are SO MANY OTHERS who have been killed by the police and they're not getting this type of "treatment."

Like this girl killed in April 2014: Samantha Ramsey
This case is just as appalling, but the media kept a tight lid on it. At least Boone County moved the investigation out of their own department...

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Libertygal

Here's the thing, you have Michael Brown delivered as a drugged up thug that attacked a police officer and you have all along.

Most people disagreeing with you are disagreeing with you specifically because of that, at least I am.

Let's say you are correct about everything but leave assaulting the officer off the table. Everything you present is character assassination, and does not in anyway justify the cop shooting Brown to death. Do we really want to condone cops being judge, jury and executioner? I may be wrong but I don't think you want that anymore than any other American does.

The only thing that justifies the cops use of lethal force is if Brown assaulted or was about to assault him. That's it. Now speaking for myself, because I have done a lot of reading about police use of excessive force, unjustified lethal force, civil rights violations... and little to no oversight or repercussions for doing so. I also see the increasing militarization of police forces across the entire United States and I see that as a threat to my liberty and all Americans. I also saw how this particular PD handled the aftermath... Brown's body in the street for hours then loaded into an SUV? Really? The absolute 100% lack of interviewing witnesses on the scene or anytime after. It reeks of cover-up, to me.

You seem to need the man to be a thug, you seem to accept any source (nurse on FB, really?) that supports what you want the story to be. Me? If it turns out the man assaulted the officer or was about to, so be it... still sad but everyone has the right to defend themselves.

His body was loaded into an SUV, that happened to be to Coroner's wagon.

His body lay in the street for hours, because police were attempting to do a crime scene investigation while handling crowd control at the same time.

It was imperative to properly gather evidence, photograph the scene from every imaginable angle, video from every angle, search for bullets, bag and tag and label, every single thing they could find.

Abovr all, it was imperative they prevent any contamination of the crime scene.

Have you not ever been in traffic, snarled up behind a fatal accident? Roads can bebl closed down for 4-6 hours or more as the scene is processed. The bodies, in a fatality, are left in place, until the necessary evidence is gathered. Then, the bodies are removed by Coroner's wagons, which range frin SUV's to station wagons.

I simply do not see the issue here, beyond the fact that people are shielded from death so much, that their sensibilities were offended. What I see in actuality, is ignorance of how crime scenes are processed, and how bodies are handled. In knowingthe stark reality if that, I don't see how anyone can claim anything wrong or improper was done in the way that crime scene was handled.

In fact, they should be commended for doing everything possible for attempting to maintain tbe integrity of that crime scene for best evidence, so we don't have issues during a possible trial, like the TM trial, where it came out how many mistakes were made in the handling and processing of evidence.

It is either by ignorance, or invented anger, that people are literally looking for reasons to be angry over this.

Take some time, go do a web search on five Coronor offices in various locations. They will likely have images of the coronor wagon. Then, come back and tell me how unusual it was.

It's absurd.

As for him being presented as thug from the beginning, that's a bald faced lie.

He was presented as a teddy bear, a Gentle Giant, that never would hurt no one.

It was not until the video of the robbery was released that the "narrative" began to change, and people were shocked. Shocked, I tell you, at the Gentle Giant's behaviour.

You can't change that history, so don't even try, Kali.

a reply to: Libertygal

I said YOU have him delivered as such.

originally posted by: Libertygal

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Libertygal

Here's the thing, you have Michael Brown delivered as a drugged up thug that attacked a police officer and you have all along.

Most people disagreeing with you are disagreeing with you specifically because of that, at least I am.

Let's say you are correct about everything but leave assaulting the officer off the table. Everything you present is character assassination, and does not in anyway justify the cop shooting Brown to death. Do we really want to condone cops being judge, jury and executioner? I may be wrong but I don't think you want that anymore than any other American does.

The only thing that justifies the cops use of lethal force is if Brown assaulted or was about to assault him. That's it. Now speaking for myself, because I have done a lot of reading about police use of excessive force, unjustified lethal force, civil rights violations... and little to no oversight or repercussions for doing so. I also see the increasing militarization of police forces across the entire United States and I see that as a threat to my liberty and all Americans. I also saw how this particular PD handled the aftermath... Brown's body in the street for hours then loaded into an SUV? Really? The absolute 100% lack of interviewing witnesses on the scene or anytime after. It reeks of cover-up, to me.

You seem to need the man to be a thug, you seem to accept any source (nurse on FB, really?) that supports what you want the story to be. Me? If it turns out the man assaulted the officer or was about to, so be it... still sad but everyone has the right to defend themselves.

I very plainly said, if the officer is guilty, he should be punished. I don't care. I have no car in this race. I am busy watching the story unfold. I am busy watching the media stay strangely silent on "Stand your ground". I am watching, from the center, both sides of this play out.

His body was loaded into an SUV, that happened to be to Coroner's wagon.

His body lay in the street for hours, because police were attempting to do a crime scene investigation while handling crowd control at the same time.

It was imperative to properly gather evidence, photograph the scene from every imaginable angle, video from every angle, search for bullets, bag and tag and label, every single thing they could find.

Above all, it was imperative they prevent any contamination of the crime scene.

Have you not ever been in traffic, snarled up behind a fatal accident? Roads can be closed down for 4-6 hours or more as the scene is processed. The bodies, in a fatality, are left in place, until the necessary evidence is gathered. Then, the bodies are removed by Coroner's wagons, which range from SUV's to station wagons.

I simply do not see the issue here, beyond the fact that people are shielded from death so much, that their sensibilities were offended. What I see in actuality, is ignorance of how crime scenes are processed, and how bodies are handled. In knowing the stark reality if that, I don't see how anyone can claim anything wrong or improper was done in the way that crime scene was handled.

In fact, they should be commended for doing everything possible for attempting to maintain tbe integrity of that crime scene for best evidence, so we don't have issues during a possible trial, like the TM trial, where it came out how many mistakes were made in the handling and processing of evidence.

It is either by ignorance, or invented anger, that people are literally looking for reasons to be angry over this.

Take some time, go do a web search on five Coronor offices in various locations. They will likely have images of the coronor wagon. Then, come back and tell me how unusual it was.

It's absurd.

As for him being presented as thug from the beginning, that's a bald faced lie.

He was presented as a teddy bear, a Gentle Giant, that never would hurt no one.

It was not until the video of the robbery was released that the "narrative" began to change, and people were shocked. Shocked, I tell you, at the Gentle Giant's behaviour.

You can't change that history, so don't even try, Kali.

And *I* haven't delivered anything.

As for the nurse on FB, I said all I have to say to that.

Sorry you don't like it.

originally posted by: Kali74
a reply to: Libertygal

I said YOU have him delivered as such.

See below, having posting issues, not sure why.

a reply to: lovebeck

Unfortunately, toxicology results can't be expedited. As I stated, they use tissue samples,.samples from the organs, liver, kidneys heart, brain, pancreas, bladder, etc.

It just takes time to sample and look for the many things they may be looking for, and patience is one thing people are short on.

The good thing is, those various samples will be from at least two ME's. Not clear if Baden did a tox study, or not. He may or may not have.

Either way, at least the alternate one will be done by the DOJ, which I fully support. I fully expect, as well, the DOJ autopsy to present the same results, it won't be any different.

The only difference on the autopsies is the ME, and their testimony in a court of law, when asked their opinion. Until then, they should keep their opinions to themselves, and not make statements like Baden did, "An officer should not shoot that much".

That was a totally uncalled for statement, as he is still unaware of the circumstances, as are we all.

If he were in court, that statement would bring an objection.

originally posted by: Libertygal

originally posted by: DexteramLucifer
a reply to: Sremmos80

Did we not go through this in another thread with one other poster who used this same wapo article as proof of a toxicology report ? This is what I was talking about in saying that stuff like this is what causes stories to become convoluted.

I will say it again, in case it gets lost in the kerfuffle.
This tox report has been confirmed as true and correct by multiple sources now, including Johnson's attorney, several other officials, including an ME that was interviewed, and Ben Crump. It is now treated as fact.

And I'll say it once again, No one has the actual toxicology report in question and until it is released all you are doing is spreading lies and propaganda and selling it as truth.

a reply to: DexteramLucifer

And if you were speaking about Mr Baden the ME, that is an outright lie you just told. He actually admitted during that interview he had not seen the actual toxicology report and that he could only speculate about pot possibly being in his(Brown's) system and the effects it would have.