Russia pulls plug on 'last independent TV show'

nvm.. comment will cause thread drift.


Lets try this -

I have posted the info and answered a lot of questions. If you still think the article or my position is incorrect, then show me using proof / facts / links to sources etc, as I have done.

Try to remain on topic and try to keep it civil... Attack my facts and refute them please.

I will check back in later tonight and will do my best to counter whatever is brought.

a reply to: Xcathdra
I think you need to learn the definition of propaganda.....and why i used the word in the 1st place

originally posted by: Nikola014
Yes we do.
You can't say someone is a killer without presenting any proof. Just because he made some rank during cold war, does it mean he killed people? And if so, I want to see names of those who he had killed. You can't just toss something like this into a thread, and act like nothing happened. Saying someone is a killer is a serious statement that needs to be back up with official documents. Not who KGB killed. But Putin himself.

He has already provided a list of some of those who have been killed as a result of doing something against the Russian state. Sometimes, the accusations are against the Russian mafia, but they are so closely intertwined in the state apparatus anyway, they may as well be one and the same.

Also, simply because Putin may not have pulled the trigger himself, doesn't mean he isn't complicit. I'm sure Saddam, Stalin, Mao or Kim Jong didn't actively do the dirty work either, but their culpability is certain.

originally posted by: [post=18232920]Nikola014[/post
Are you saying he's trying to rebuilt Soviet Union?

That is exactly what he wants to do - he has stated as much himself in a variety of speeches.

originally posted by: [post=18232920]Nikola014[/post
I don't see anything bad in trying to create a alternative to west and their banks ruling system. BRICS seems like a fresh surprise, and I can't wait to see more of them.

This "BRICs" nonsense is nothing new - it is simply a term to describe the "upcoming" economies and has been used for at least 10 years by economists. As I said in another thread when someone fawned over BRICs - between them, they only account for around 20% of the world economy. The US + EU equals 46%. They have a long way to go before reaching anywhere near parity, much less be in a position to dominate.

originally posted by: [post=18232920]Nikola014[/post
My mentality is that i hate double standards. I try so hard to make people see that they have them, but it's impossible because they have strong beliefs based on fed lies from western media.

Ironic...

originally posted by: [post=18232920]Nikola014[/post
Thanks for the list of names. I will dig up into it.

You should - and dig further too instead of whining how ill informed we in the West are by our media, perhaps you should practice what you preach.

Here is what I find interesting...

The fact that some call all western media a propaganda hotbed when it doesn't fit in with their way of thinking, and as soon as a story comes across that they feel fit their way they use them as the end all of information.

I am amazed at the hypocrisy that certain members are using to fit their arguments.

a reply to: stumason

Not really a difference. The same people here that are behind the scenes running things are the ones that are controlling our media as well. Nothing gets out that they don't want to. Everything you hear and see in the msm has been carefully gone over and okayed. I see no difference at all. Just because they aren't holding an office that we can see means nothing.

originally posted by: Xcathdra
a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

So if I understand your post your conceding to the point I made and justified it with how the US and EU use social media in other countries?

So Russia does not use social media in other countries to destabilize them? So constantly referring to Ukraine government as a NEO Nazi Junta filled with skinheads who kill babies is what, a jaunty sarcastic exchange meant to invoke humor into a situation Russia created?

Try your logic on the 300 people who died in MH17.

Don't try to tug on the emotion strings of MH17.

Ukraine govt & U.S. still has "evidence" to provide. . .


Well if they Ukraine military & its officials didn't include so many Neo-nazi radicals & mercs -- it would be a non-issue.


Umm, when was the last time Russia used Social media to "Destabilize" a country?

I see this:

Social Media and the Destabilization of Cuba: USAID’s Secret “Cuban Twitter” Intended to Stir Unrest


Care to elaborate?

originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
Here is what I find interesting...

The fact that some call all western media a propaganda hotbed when it doesn't fit in with their way of thinking, and as soon as a story comes across that they feel fit their way they use them as the end all of information.

I am amazed at the hypocrisy that certain members are using to fit their arguments.

Western economies are based on debt. You dont think the Western media is not using propaganda to tell everyone that the system works and its not broke?? :rolleyes

a reply to: Xcathdra

I agree with you on how dangerous it is for a nation to have complete control over its media. My issue is that even if we are to fix the media in Russia and get out the truth to the people, ours are still believing all the nonsense that our media puts out,which is just as dangerous. It has lead us to conflicts over and over again,and the people don't really get to question it before our people are sent in to die.

a reply to: Cantbebothered

I think you need to learn the definition of propaganda.....and why i used the word in the 1st place

Is there more than one definition of it?

pro·pa·gan·da noun \ˌprä-pə-ˈgan-də, ˌprō-\
: ideas or statements that are often false or exaggerated and that are spread in order to help a cause, a political leader, a government, etc.

www.merriam-webster.com...

originally posted by: Nikola014
a reply to: stumason

It's you again. I'm still waiting for your pm. Can't wait to see the revolutions that Russia and Soviet Union started in the past...

I have better things to do right now rather than satisfy your own lazy curiosity. But if you genuinely seeking the info, just look up Soviet involvement in Czechoslovakia, Afghanistan, Hungary, Angola, South Africa, Ethiopia, Somalia- to name just a few. Ignorance is no defence, although I suspect you already know about these...

originally posted by: [post=18232935]Nikola014[/post
So, as a proof, you give me his speech from 14 and 15 years ago? Do you have any idea how many things can change during that period? In politics especially.

Er, yes - you asked for evidence to back up the claims this is part of his "plan". I provide evidence to show he has had this "plan" since he came to power and now you claim it isn't proof simply down to its age? He's been in charge of Russia the whole damn time (even when his mate Medevev (sp?) was President)! Talk about moving the goalposts....

a reply to: tsurfer2000h
Propaganda is information that is not impartial and used primarily to influence an audience and further an agenda, often by presenting facts selectively (thus possibly lying by omission) to encourage a particular synthesis, or using loaded messages to produce an emotional rather than rational response to the information presented. Propaganda can be used as a form of ideological or commercial warfare.

originally posted by: SLAYER69

originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica

And be careful. The U.S. govt is FAST approaching these same "talking points" that you're bringing up. Next week, the U.S. may clamp down on its own media. . . don't be so naive.

That's EXACTLY why it should be discussed and debated freely.

What may happen in the US someday has apparently already happened in Russia.

No outrage?

Watch this:




John Mccain is telling RUSSIA & CHINA that an ARAB SPRING IS COMING TO THEM!!!

How hard is it to see thats what is going on now. . . How about this: "What happens when there is NO more foreign boogeymen to go after?" Who do you think will be next?

American citizens. Harry Reid already came out and denounced American citizens as "Domestic Terrorists" over -- turtles.

a reply to: Cantbebothered

So Putin is waging war on his own people.

a reply to: Cantbebothered

Western economies are based on debt. You dont think the Western media is not using propaganda to tell everyone that the system works and its not broke?? :rolleyes

And the problem is we have the choice of media outlets and the freedom to decide whether we want to believe them or not...Russian citizens do not have that choice.

Also know that the west has media outlets that have the freedom to discuss the problems we face...Does Russia?

originally posted by: Dimithae
a reply to: stumason

Not really a difference. The same people here that are behind the scenes running things are the ones that are controlling our media as well. Nothing gets out that they don't want to. Everything you hear and see in the msm has been carefully gone over and okayed. I see no difference at all. Just because they aren't holding an office that we can see means nothing.

Perhaps in the US - I do not know so cannot really comment, although I suspect you are blowing it out of proportion due to your own perceptions- but that isn't how it works in Europe or the UK. In the past several years, there have been a great deal of highly damaging revelations in the UK media about Government or "celebrities" that has put them very much on the back foot and there is sod all they could do about it, from a censorship point of view.

Putin = save Millions of Russian lives & prevent WWIII (stated several times already)

OR

WWIII = EVERYONE lives under nuclear winter.

a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

I'll ask

Where is the outrage over Russian Censorship and if the West is so bad why are you still able to post as you do presently?

You do realize your Russian opposite/counterpart would not be able to.

a reply to: tsurfer2000h

What garbage.....Show me one media outlet promoting another economical system that is based on say the GOLD STANDARD. This is how Russian economy works btw..

originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica

Putin = save Millions of Russian lives & prevent WWIII (stated several times already)

Ah save it!

I hear the same type of crap from bible thumpers on my own doorstep, It would violate the sites T & C if I posted my response to them towards you.

a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

John Mccain is telling RUSSIA & CHINA that an ARAB SPRING IS COMING TO THEM!!!

John McCain seroiusly?

You do know that nobody takes what John McCain says seriously, as he is as relevant as your neighbor.

After his ridiculous campaign for president, many Americans saw him for what he really is...incompetent.