IRS Strikes Deal With Atheists To Monitor Sermons And Homilies

a reply to: tsingtao

wow! sounds really bad when it's laid out like that!

wow!! It IS really bad!

all i see is an anti-abortion stance.

You didn't read the article then, did you!?? No, you didn't.
All you see is an anti-abortion stance???

big deal.
the atheists can't talk theology so they politicize it.

I'm NOT an atheist, friend.

Here, let's review the article you (lazily) DID NOT read:

[In 2008] he did participate in the early [presidential candidate] debates and was memorably one of the three (with Mike Huckabee and Tom Tancredo) who raised his hand to declare he did not believe in evolution.

Unlike other Tea Party governors around the nation who have tried out a handful of their more extreme policies, Brownback went for broke. First he and his Koch brother allies (they are Kansas homeboys too, you'll recall) engineered a full-blown Tea Party takeover of the legislature with a well-funded primary strategy in 2012. It is now the most conservative legislature in the nation (and that's saying something considering how conservative Republican legislatures have become). In their minds, they are on a mission from God.

Just "anti-abortion"? No. Nope!

He went after the teachers' union, in one particularly clever move creating what he called "innovation zones" which allow districts to circumvent existing state law regarding curriculum and teacher salaries. He slashed education funding, including cutting the arts programs entirely. He privatized Medicaid. (It goes without saying refused the Medicaid expansion under the ACA.) He defunded Planned Parenthood and signed one of the most far reaching anti-abortion laws in the land, declaring that life begins at "fertilization" and forc[ed] the last remaining Kansas providers to read an anti-abortion script filled with frightening misinformation to women seeking the procedure.

(He doesn't even try to hide his religious motives—he wrote the words Jesus + Mary on top of the bill when he signed it.)

Much more than "anti-abortion."

All of this was to be expected from Sam Brownback. But the results of his equally fundamentalist approach to economics has made a lot of people stand up and take notice. First and foremost, he slashed taxes to the bone. Well, not for everyone. The Center on Budget and policy priorities shows how that tax cut has been distributed:

Yeah!! Woot! Yep. The RICHEST people got a tax cut - everyone else? Well, screwed.

And here's how the "recovery" is going for Kansans!!:



But wait! There's MORE!

Just as other races in the country are reflecting the fight between the GOP establishment and the Tea Party wing, Kansas will be a battleground in the fall for the latest fight for the soul of the Republican Party. But this time it isn't just about race or the culture war or bad political tactics. This one is about all of that to be sure. But this time the Koch brothers' libertarian economic dream agenda has been enacted and it's on the ballot. If America wants to see what the country will look like if the Brownback wing of the GOP manages to get its way nationally, they only need to look at Sam Brownback's Kansas—a disaster on every level.

Not to mention the deficit to the tune of a MAJOR SHORTFALL due to his stupid 'tax policies'.

The Evangelistic Libertarian thing......It's been tried. It failed. But you go ahead and ignore that part if you like.
Coming soon to a state near you.

(all emphases added by me)

a reply to: tsingtao

what's the difference to what obama is doing now? correct, that was 1 state, obama is doing it to the whole country.

Uhh...erm....
NO. The difference is it is the OPPOSITE of what Obama is trying to do.

You have it backwards.

colorado vs kansas?

Yep. Colorado vs Kansas. Which one is doing better now?? Hmmm?? (Hint: It's NOT Kansas)

But hey, you want to vote in the New Apostolic Reformation Seven Mountain Dominionist Evangelical Libertarian Bible-Thumpers? (NOT what Obama stands for.) You go ahead. Good luck. Oh, and it might make you feel safer to know that the mercenary armies overseas are ALSO the spawn of the Evangelicals. And you know how much MORE expensive they are - and that TAXPAYERS are paying those exorbitant wages to create more terrorists....
right? You know that. Right?


Or, not. Maybe you didn't...(It's the same crowd as Hobby Lobby. But you didn't know that, though, didja?)...because....the Bible. Anyway - do what you need to do. Like a member said above: too bad there's nothing in the Bible about treating others the way you'd like to be treated.
/sarc

a reply to: Logarock

Not to mention the american revolution. The very large part of church pulpits became platforms of revolutionary speech.

We wouldn't have had the civil rights era with out churches being so involved. The Rev. Martin Luther King did most of his talking from the pulpit and some of his more famous speeches are made from the pulpit. The racists in the south were not vandalizing and bombing church's for any other reason.

Those are the biggest reasons the government would want to keep tabs on churches

As for the tax exempt for churches some people here are pushing for removal of status.



Most churches are involved in caring and feeding the sick and homeless teaching missionary work various ways of helping humanity.

Politicians have turned Abortion and marriage into a political game those issues have a history in church doctrine for hundreds of years. Churches kept preaching the same thou shal nots they always have. Just now its not politically correct to preach their beliefs . China the central government has to approve church doctrine ( to keep control on them) is that what we are heading to?


Lets look at other tax exempt entities .
Political donation deductible and not taxed.
Super pacs tax haven for politicians . Sara pac Forgot what the Clintons call theirs Hillary made millions in speaking fees not taxed cause she gave it to charity that she owns. And they direct where the money goes. Neat trick .
Political party coffers for elections not taxable .
City county state no tax.
City county state services that are ran for the entities for profit still no tax. Many cities make profit off utilities.
Reservations no tax they run casinos profit share with tribal members and the state. And they are no tax they have mineral leases and other for profit endeavors.
Reservations chapter houses
community centers .
Schools
Colleges
Soup kitchens
Homeless shelters.
Senior centers.
Shriner
Elks
Civtans
Kiwanis
Masons
Domestic violence shelters
Runaway shelters
Jr sports leagues
Hospitals
Clinics
VFW
AARP not sure if they pay income tax but can purchase with a no tax certificate
I know theres many morec
List may be dated 5 years ago it was correct

I have seen every one on this list back a politician or a political agenda . And because a church does it also we should take their no tax status away?

Hypocrisy

originally posted by: Diderot
a reply to: tsingtao

what "protections" do you need that is not already covered?
are you/they adding protections for ALL or trying to take some away for a particular group?
God holds the ultimate truth, unless you mean truth like in "what are going to believe, me or your lying eyes?"

If I were to claim that God does not hold the ultimate truth, would you claim that my eyes are lying?

i would think you are deluded but

i would just ask you, who does hold the ultimate truth?

originally posted by: technical difficulties
Yeah, it does seem a bit orwellian, but not really considering that it's just for tax exempt status. Kind of hard to take sides on this one. Honestly, A better solution would just to get rid of tax exempt status for Religious Institutions altogether like Beezer said. I imagine some will probably cry "religious liberty" over it though.

yeah and separation of church and state, the battle cry of the atheist.

when you can be taxed, they got you by the short and curlies.

i think, only christian churches should be tax exempt.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: tsingtao

wow! sounds really bad when it's laid out like that!

wow!! It IS really bad!

all i see is an anti-abortion stance.

You didn't read the article then, did you!?? No, you didn't.
All you see is an anti-abortion stance???

big deal.
the atheists can't talk theology so they politicize it.

I'm NOT an atheist, friend.

Here, let's review the article you (lazily) DID NOT read:

[In 2008] he did participate in the early [presidential candidate] debates and was memorably one of the three (with Mike Huckabee and Tom Tancredo) who raised his hand to declare he did not believe in evolution.

Unlike other Tea Party governors around the nation who have tried out a handful of their more extreme policies, Brownback went for broke. First he and his Koch brother allies (they are Kansas homeboys too, you'll recall) engineered a full-blown Tea Party takeover of the legislature with a well-funded primary strategy in 2012. It is now the most conservative legislature in the nation (and that's saying something considering how conservative Republican legislatures have become). In their minds, they are on a mission from God.

Just "anti-abortion"? No. Nope!

He went after the teachers' union, in one particularly clever move creating what he called "innovation zones" which allow districts to circumvent existing state law regarding curriculum and teacher salaries. He slashed education funding, including cutting the arts programs entirely. He privatized Medicaid. (It goes without saying refused the Medicaid expansion under the ACA.) He defunded Planned Parenthood and signed one of the most far reaching anti-abortion laws in the land, declaring that life begins at "fertilization" and forc[ed] the last remaining Kansas providers to read an anti-abortion script filled with frightening misinformation to women seeking the procedure.

(He doesn't even try to hide his religious motives—he wrote the words Jesus + Mary on top of the bill when he signed it.)

Much more than "anti-abortion."

All of this was to be expected from Sam Brownback. But the results of his equally fundamentalist approach to economics has made a lot of people stand up and take notice. First and foremost, he slashed taxes to the bone. Well, not for everyone. The Center on Budget and policy priorities shows how that tax cut has been distributed:

Yeah!! Woot! Yep. The RICHEST people got a tax cut

- everyone else? Well, screwed.

And here's how the "recovery" is going for Kansans!!:

But wait! There's MORE!

Just as other races in the country are reflecting the fight between the GOP establishment and the Tea Party wing, Kansas will be a battleground in the fall for the latest fight for the soul of the Republican Party. But this time it isn't just about race or the culture war or bad political tactics. This one is about all of that to be sure. But this time the Koch brothers' libertarian economic dream agenda has been enacted and it's on the ballot. If America wants to see what the country will look like if the Brownback wing of the GOP manages to get its way nationally, they only need to look at Sam Brownback's Kansas—a disaster on every level.

Not to mention the deficit to the tune of a MAJOR SHORTFALL due to his stupid 'tax policies'.

The Evangelistic Libertarian thing......It's been tried. It failed. But you go ahead and ignore that part if you like.
Coming soon to a state near you.

(all emphases added by me)

yeah, he's not done yet.

like i said, abortion. frequent mention of the koch bros. complaining about the taxes the rich pays, cutting money per student by $600.00, oh, lower unemployment than the national ave.

i didn't see much on what the lefty mind readers came up with, tho.

i guess he doesn't want a welfare state.

he is still ahead of davis. who is backed by whom?

originally posted by: Annee

How many times must it be stated? In the USA Christianity is the predominate religious belief.

Quite correct, but there is more to the world than just the US and much bigger problems than some childish fued.

But, it is amusing watching Christians get their panties in a bunch with the growing Muslim faith in America.

As I said, I am already aware that your battle is not justice and equality for all, but revenge.

Atheists do not focus on Christians.

Everything in your post suggests otherwise, even the following lines.

They focus mainly on the infringement of religion in government. Guess who the main culprits are. Go ahead, guess.

I see zealots of all stripes pushing their way of life on others, including atheists. If you only see Christians, you are either disconnected from the real world embroiled in your own personal crusade, or you just ignore those doing the same thing as those "Christians" because you agree with their form of zealotry.

originally posted by: Serdgiam

As I said, I am already aware that your battle is not justice and equality for all, but revenge.

You really need to get a reflective mirror to take a good look at yourself.

That's the second time you've told me I'm revengeful ---- in completely unrelated topics.

It reveals a lot about where you are coming from.

a reply to: tsingtao

No, Davis is ahead. Thank God.

Gov. Sam Brownback’s re-election campaign received about $744,000 in contributions during the same period, putting him behind Davis in fundraising by more than $370,000.

“I think we see a pattern of Sam Brownback trying to trick voters and trying to deceive them and make his campaign look stronger. In reality, Paul Davis’ campaign is outraising him,” Loomis said.

“Kansans are deeply concerned about Sam Brownback’s ‘real live experiment’ and the toll it is taking on our state,” Davis said in a statement. “Kansans are worried about their local schools and the future we are leaving our children. Our donors are a clear reflection of the broad, bipartisan support Jill and I have earned during the past year.”

Davis has significant backing from the legal and education communities: 253 of Davis’ donors listed attorney or lawyer as their profession. Another 113 listed either teacher or educator, and 79 listed professor.

By comparison, Brownback has 32 donations from attorneys and five from educators. The governor had contributions from 80 medical professionals, not including Colyer, who is a plastic surgeon.

Among Davis’ bigger Wichita donors is Slape & Howard, a Wichita law firm that gave $2,000. Thomas Kitch, an attorney, and his wife, Sally Kitch, gave the same amount. Richard Egelhof, a Wichita physician, also gave $2,000, the maximum allowed under Kansas law.

Brownback got maximum donations from Santo Catanese, a Wichita real estate developer; Greg Boxberger, a Wichita physician; and Wichita-based KMG Tool Machine Co.

Brownback also received support from U.S. Rep. John Campbell, R-Calif. Campbell gave Brownback $2,000. His campaign Campbell for Congress also sent the governor $2,000.

The governor’s wife, Mary Brownback, gave her husband’s re-election campaign a check for $2,000 on July 23.

Read more here: www.kansas.com...=cpy

a reply to: beezzer


We had better damn well see these IRS jack boots in EVERY relgious setting. I want proof that they are also visiting Synagogues, Buddhist Temples, and Mosques.

a reply to: chuck258


I want to see IRS scumbags monitoring Rev. Jeremiah Wrights United Trinity Church. If anyone needs to lose a tax exempt status, it is that Hall of Hate they call a Church. 20 bucks says it won't happen because it's Obummer's church, and caters to the Left.

In some ancient cultures, the priest ruled as god kings and were the tax collectors, the temples came first.

Just throwing that out there.

a reply to: Annee

The first time I mentioned it in this thread, it was a vague generalization. So, unless you took that to apply to you, then you must be speaking of some other thread. I stand by it either way, regardless of what assumptions it leads you to believe are fact. Feel free to expand on where you actually think I a coming from, rather than an obscure suggestion that you know.

Regardless, would you explain your history with Christianity?

Do keep in mind that most Christians would consider me a heretic and blasphemer, and have acted accordingly even to the point of violence. Also keep in mind that my goal is to pursue true equality among believers and non-believers on a systematic level. What goal do you pursue?

All I see in threads like this are the same faces parroting the same contrarian ideology that got us "here" in the first place. Do you do anything to help Christians? Do you try to work alongside them equally rather than as a battle?

Freedom From Religion Foundation

The Freedom From Religion Foundation is a national membership organization with State Representatives selected by members and a governing Executive Board of Directors selected by the State Representatives. The Foundation is a non-profit, tax-exempt organization. Non-profit status under the Internal Revenue Code, Section 501(c)3, was recognized originally in 1978, with a final tax-exempt determination in 1980. Contributions are deductible under Section 170 of the Internal Revenue Code for federal income tax purposes. Bequests, legacies, devises, transfers and gifts to or for the use of the Freedom From Religion Foundation are deductible for federal estate and gift tax purposes under the provisions of Sections 2055, 2106 and 2522 of the Code. The Foundation, a membership group open to the public, has been classified as an organization which is not a private foundation.

The Foundation is a non-profit, tax-exempt organization.
ffrf.org...

THe hell you say?

So they are tax exempt, yet they want to refuse churches tax exempt status, on the grounds the churches tax exemption violates the rights of their thought policing, well I think their tax exemption violates my rights.

Hello! I don't believe moral laws, as seen by some are political.

Let's decided who politicized them first.

Am I reading this right.

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic
If you think churches should not have tax-exempt status (as I do), then I don't understand why you disagree with this. This isn't PC thought police. It's keeping churches honest and not having them turn into a political tax-exempt PAC. If churches are going to be political entities, they should be taxed. If they're not, they should not "preach" politics.

I believe there's going to be more of this kind of thing, as religion encroaches more and more into government.

Do you ever make a post WITHOUT using the word "progressive" in a derogatory manner?

Nobody should have tax exempt status. We want to quell the freedom of speech for churches, fine, but also remove the tax exempt status for other politically active "charitable organizations." Why should Planned Parenthood use tax dollars to lobby our government for more tax dollars?

Any word on how many IRS agents are going to be dispatched to the literally hundreds of thousands of churches across the land to monitor each and every sermon? And the vast majority of them between 9 am and 11 am on Sundays?

Or are the sermons now going to be required to be submitted to the IRS for pre-approval?

I'm not busy on Sundays, if the pay is right....

And as an atheist, I'd like to say that I find this hilarious and ridiculous, in equal measure. Talk about getting your 'panties in a bunch' about a logistical impossibility.

originally posted by: Stormdancer777
Freedom From Religion Foundation

The Freedom From Religion Foundation is a national membership organization with State Representatives selected by members and a governing Executive Board of Directors selected by the State Representatives. The Foundation is a non-profit, tax-exempt organization. Non-profit status under the Internal Revenue Code, Section 501(c)3, was recognized originally in 1978, with a final tax-exempt determination in 1980. Contributions are deductible under Section 170 of the Internal Revenue Code for federal income tax purposes. Bequests, legacies, devises, transfers and gifts to or for the use of the Freedom From Religion Foundation are deductible for federal estate and gift tax purposes under the provisions of Sections 2055, 2106 and 2522 of the Code. The Foundation, a membership group open to the public, has been classified as an organization which is not a private foundation.

The Foundation is a non-profit, tax-exempt organization.
ffrf.org...

THe hell you say?

So they are tax exempt, yet they want to refuse churches tax exempt status, on the grounds the churches tax exemption violates the rights of their thought policing, well I think their tax exemption violates my rights.

Hello! I don't believe moral laws, as seen by some are political.

Let's decided who politicized them first.

Am I reading this right.

Good point. The Freedom from Religion foundation is a VERY politically active organization. Why should they maintain their tax exempt status. Let me guess, we want conservative non-profits to lose their status but want to retain it for leftist groups.

originally posted by: signalfire
Any word on how many IRS agents are going to be dispatched to the literally hundreds of thousands of churches across the land to monitor each and every sermon? And the vast majority of them between 9 am and 11 am on Sundays?

Or are the sermons now going to be required to be submitted to the IRS for pre-approval?

I'm not busy on Sundays, if the pay is right....

And as an atheist, I'd like to say that I find this hilarious and ridiculous, in equal measure. Talk about getting your 'panties in a bunch' about a logistical impossibility.

I'm sure that the FFR foundation will gladly provide the brownshirts--er, I mean monitors-- to do that job.

originally posted by: chuck258
a reply to: chuck258


I want to see IRS scumbags monitoring Rev. Jeremiah Wrights United Trinity Church. If anyone needs to lose a tax exempt status, it is that Hall of Hate they call a Church. 20 bucks says it won't happen because it's Obummer's church, and caters to the Left.

Yep. Hit that nail right smack dab on the head.