NASA Confirms New EM Thruster Violates Laws Of Conservation

a reply to: stormbringer1701

Their theories are a tad absurd, so it's a miracle they were able to get their device to work.

I'm willing to bet they are producing some kind of double layer in the plasma they are creating, which is what is actually causing the observed force to arise.

These guys are presently basing their work on MHD theory, which was proven to be an invalid abstraction by the guy who came up with it in the first place.

Oh I'm sure it works, and I'll bet the military has already played around with it.

If I had to speculate, we'll hear very soon that, "Whoops! We were wrong, it really doesn't work!". Sometimes civilian scientists stumble onto advanced technology that others would prefer to keep classified.

originally posted by: AnarchoCapitalist
a reply to: stormbringer1701

Their theories are a tad absurd, so it's a miracle they were able to get their device to work.

I'm willing to bet they are producing some kind of double layer in the plasma they are creating, which is what is actually causing the observed force to arise.

These guys are presently basing their work on MHD theory, which was proven to be an invalid abstraction by the guy who came up with it in the first place.

well they are not alone. there are several quantum thruster em drive type devices that are being taken seriously. including one invented by a 16 year old egyptian girl which is being considered for satellite propulsion and station keeping.

sometimes established science needs a kick in the ass. this may be the boot a coming.

originally posted by: stormbringer1701

originally posted by: AnarchoCapitalist
a reply to: stormbringer1701

Their theories are a tad absurd, so it's a miracle they were able to get their device to work.

I'm willing to bet they are producing some kind of double layer in the plasma they are creating, which is what is actually causing the observed force to arise.

These guys are presently basing their work on MHD theory, which was proven to be an invalid abstraction by the guy who came up with it in the first place.

well they are not alone. there are several quantum thruster em drive type devices that are being taken seriously. including one invented by a 16 year old egyptian girl which is being considered for satellite propulsion and station keeping.

sometimes established science needs a kick in the ass. this may be the boot a coming.

Yeah, I have no doubt the devices work. I just doubt that their theoretical descriptions of why it works are actually representative of what's occurring.

What's interesting is the guy who came up with this device is claiming that it could potentially generate up to a ton of thrust per kilowatt of power consumed. If they could pull that off, interstellar spaceflight, flying cars, and a whole new Jetson's world will become possible.

Consider that Blackight's new device will be capable of providing tens of megawatts of power in a device that weighs less than a car. So put two and two together, and suddenly you have unlimited thrust and unlimited power to move anything anywhere.

a reply to: rickymouse

I am afraid you are suffering from small town thinking and nostalgic for pastoral fields.this planet is ours to do wuth as we please and neanderthals and Luddites be damned.

There are trillions of planets out waiting for us to exploit and your whining whinging about this one?

Once we have star travel we can dump you on a WHOLE
pastoral planet all by yourself and or with similar like minded folks like yourself.You can wear togas and shepherd some sheep.

originally posted by: rickymouse
So it works as the guy said it would. Nobody paid attention to the guy for many years, thinking he was nuts because it was in contradiction to what they were taught. Now NASA tested it and is trying to figure out how it works, trying to use Occams Razor to explain how it works. Who cares how it works, it works, it can be utilized and just because it defies the law does not mean it is a crime to use it.

This sounds normal to me, reality is based on beliefs. Breaking misguided beliefs is hard to do.

It's always the way though isn't it ricky, we report on these energy endeavours, the debunkers with a text book stuffed up their backsides debunk and claim it violates this law or that one, and dismiss anything that doesn't chime with their 20th century paradigm.

Well...looks like the majority of us were right all along, all that had to be understood, all along, was discovering alternative methods to manipulate current physical understanding rather than anything else.

It was and is all about discovering short cuts, different method, and exploits to the increasingly elastic 'laws' we have restrained ourselves by.

These guys seem to have discovered such a short cut...i wish them and us all the best.

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

So that solves the mystery of why my microwave range sometimes floats when I have it on high power with a light load inside.

A short video on the EmDrive, No information on the video.





The patent and all articles,

www.rexresearch.com...

First of all, thank you for bringing this to ATS. These are exciting projects. I'm afraid though, like Slayer69
said, this project may fade away after a while.
We already are aware that classical physics' "so-called laws" don't apply to quantum interactions. That doesn't
make them less real.
It's a big step from demonstrating a curious effect to building a machine with practical applications. One that usually takes many years. When the laser was invented, we knew it was important,
but the development of practical uses for it played out over decades.
I will try to keep up with this one.

Did any of you catch this nugget from SPR's website?

A paper entitled "Second Generation EmDrive Propulsion Applied to SSTO Launcher and Interstellar Probe" will be presented at the 65th International Astronautical Congress 2014 at Toronto in September.

SPR Ltd

Notice the 'Interstellar Probe' bit!

Wow.

Not Solar system probe, but Interstellar, they obviously think BIG.

Thought this was an interesting snippet too:

Based on Shawyer's calculations, a solar-powered Emdrive thrust would be capable, in theory, to carry a manned mission to Mars in 41 days' time.

(from same link above)

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

Roads? Where we're going, we don't need...roads.

They need to find a way to make it their own invention, without having to give credit to the inventor.

Can't let some nobody profit from a potentially lucrative invention.

Bet the legal departments and NASA contractors are working overtime on it.

originally posted by: Parthin
First of all, thank you for bringing this to ATS. These are exciting projects. I'm afraid though, like Slayer69
said, this project may fade away after a while.
We already are aware that classical physics' "so-called laws" don't apply to quantum interactions. That doesn't
make them less real.
It's a big step from demonstrating a curious effect to building a machine with practical applications. One that usually takes many years. When the laser was invented, we knew it was important,
but the development of practical uses for it played out over decades.
I will try to keep up with this one.

you might be right if it was just one dude. its not. Dr White of NASA has his own similar thing called a QVPT. Dr March and Woodward have one. and an Egyptian girl has one. the guys in the wired article have one each. there is too much smoke for it not to be fire. if it was one lone inventor by himself, yeah it could go away.

originally posted by: ausername
They need to find a way to make it their own invention, without having to give credit to the inventor.

Can't let some nobody profit from a potentially lucrative invention.

Bet the legal departments and NASA contractors are working overtime on it.

Eh Not fair. Dr White has been working on his version of this for years. everyone knows of his work on detecting warp fields but he has an even older project on this type of device. his does not use a resonant cavity but takes a different approach. that experiment is classified and all he can say is it's much further along than his warp drive. he does describe what it could do at the beginning of his presentation that i have on my youtube account:

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

Typical of the scientific community, dismissing something because it's not in one of their textbooks. It's always the madmen that think outside the box and stumble onto something genius; did these people not take a history class in university? Plato put it best " A wise man speaks because he has something to say, a fool because he has to say something"

Sounds similar to the Mach-Lorenz drive that was a theory about 10 years ago. Someone was trying to get NASA to build it but they 'weren't interested'.

I sure hope this doesn't go the way of the electric paint two Canadian profs invented a few years back.....
First the announcement....then....nothing......theyre either dead or disappeared I guess.....along with their electricity producing house paint.

originally posted by: CryHavoc
Sounds similar to the Mach-Lorenz drive that was a theory about 10 years ago. Someone was trying to get NASA to build it but they 'weren't interested'.

well Dr Woodward is still working on it. and Some say that Dr White's QVPT was "stolen" from woodward. soooo NASA is still interested in it albeit at low funding and in a spare time sort of way. though Dr Whites QVPT project is classifed. he says he cannot discuss it in detail. but here is a thing about Dr Woodward. you see woodwards work adressed both the first term of Mach's equation and the second term. so it applies to both space drives such as in the OP and warps and wormholes.

www.dailymotion.com...

I wonder what color an EM thruster "burns" at?

Wonder if it could be GREEN? ;-)

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

People do that, not science. You can hardly blame science for a closed-minded scientist with a closely held belief refusing to accept that questions that belief. Sadly, it's human nature to be defensive of things they believe. It's worth noting that not all scientists are that way - plenty of folks working in that field WANT to prove those deeply held beliefs wrong. Science is about making new discoveries, just like the ones outlined in this thread.