Ukrainian Su-25 warplane detected heading toward Malaysian Boeing

originally posted by: spy66

originally posted by: whyamIhere
What about the video of the Russian Missile Truck with two missing ?

I thought a credible News Agency shot that video.

Not saying the Russians did it....but, it really is a Specialty.

The question is: were the missiles missing or just not loaded onto the BUK?

This is also one of the questions the russians had, because they had not observed any BUK missiles being fired from any of the 9 BUKs active.

Well they weren't on the truck so logic says they were SOMEWHERE. Either in the BUK or missing. Either ways they are not there...

-SAP-

a reply to: whyamIhere

I think it would be too stupid for any side to drive through the city in the middle of the day, with the stuff that can incriminate them.
I think this just some military men, having been caught on camera, but the video itself got used to push agenda.
The cameraman could have at least provided gps details or filmed the nearest street sign.

originally posted by: whyamIhere

originally posted by: rustyclutch

originally posted by: whyamIhere
What about the video of the Russian Missile Truck with two missing ?

I thought a credible News Agency shot that video.

Not saying the Russians did it....but, it really is a Specialty.

some guy in the bushes with a cameraphone isnt a news agency. That video came from a pro-ukrainian youtube page.

Are you saying that it is a fake video ?

Did they just grab the local missile truck and yank off a couple of projectiles ?

Then they hid in the bushes with a camera phone while uniformed men drive away ?

Could the video be real ?

It's a real video...lol Of what? Who knows.

originally posted by: whyamIhere

originally posted by: rustyclutch

originally posted by: whyamIhere
What about the video of the Russian Missile Truck with two missing ?

I thought a credible News Agency shot that video.

Not saying the Russians did it....but, it really is a Specialty.

some guy in the bushes with a cameraphone isnt a news agency. That video came from a pro-ukrainian youtube page.

Are you saying that it is a fake video ?

Did they just grab the local missile truck and yank off a couple of projectiles ?

Then they hid in the bushes with a camera phone while uniformed men drive away ?

Could the video be real ?

I'm saying that if you don't know who is driving the truck, you can't say who was in possession of it can you? If you don't know where the picture is taken, you can't say where it was going or coming from. Sure it could be the launcher that fired the shot. Doesn't mean the Rebels are driving it. All I am saying is that video doesn't prove a single thing one way or the other. All it does is muddy the water. Something for people to dwell on that really has no substance.

a reply to: rustyclutch

How far away were those BUKs away from the crash site? While a BUK has a tracking range of about 85 miles the longest range on one of its missiles is 30 miles. So if the Su-25 didn't shoot it down and none of the Ukraine's BUKs weren't in range that kind of narrows down the culprits.

As to why they were deployed, Kiev had reason to believe Russia was penetrating its airspace and had possibly downed at least one Ukranian plane. Seems like reason enough to deploy some BUKs.

a reply to: rustyclutch

It doesn't show who was driving, Ukrainians or rebels, but it does show that there were two missiles missing...

Now if it's true or not, that's a different story.

-SAP-

originally posted by: whitepanther999
a reply to: whyamIhere

I think it would be too stupid for any side to drive through the city in the middle of the day, with the stuff that can incriminate them.
I think this just some military men, having been caught on camera, but the video itself got used to push agenda.
The cameraman could have at least provided gps details or filmed the nearest street sign.

Maybe the cameraman lives in a war zone and does not want to die.

Maybe he sold the video so he could leave the hell being brought to his front door.

This is surely an accident. Nobody benifits from this.

Both sides are trying to spin the loosely gathered facts.

Nobody blames the Russian People.

Clearly every Government has their own agenda.

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: rustyclutch

How far away were those BUKs away from the crash site? While a BUK has a tracking range of about 85 miles the longest range on one of its missiles is 30 miles. So if the Su-25 didn't shoot it down and none of the Ukraine's BUKs weren't in range that kind of narrows down the culprits.

As to why they were deployed, Kiev had reason to believe Russia was penetrating its airspace and had possibly downed at least one Ukranian plane. Seems like reason enough to deploy some BUKs.

You make a good point about Russia invading their airspace. At the same time though....all of them were active when the plane was shot down inside of Ukraine. There is no proof the rebels had one operational. By all accounts of every article I read, if they did have one it would only be the part that fires the missile, I don't think they operate independently. There are other vehicles used to acquire targets. There is no proof they possess the whole system. At best just the launcher.

originally posted by: rustyclutch

originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: rustyclutch

How far away were those BUKs away from the crash site? While a BUK has a tracking range of about 85 miles the longest range on one of its missiles is 30 miles. So if the Su-25 didn't shoot it down and none of the Ukraine's BUKs weren't in range that kind of narrows down the culprits.

As to why they were deployed, Kiev had reason to believe Russia was penetrating its airspace and had possibly downed at least one Ukranian plane. Seems like reason enough to deploy some BUKs.

You make a good point about Russia invading their airspace. At the same time though....all of them were active when the plane was shot down inside of Ukraine. There is no proof the rebels had one operational. By all accounts of every article I read, if they did have one it would only be the part that fires the missile, I don't think they operate independently. There are other vehicles used to acquire targets. There is no proof they possess the whole system. At best just the launcher.

Buk operates in multiple modes.
1) Integrated weapon system (Normal engagement),
2) Stand alone mode (built in radar),
3) target - detection mode (autonously engagement of targets in Forward Field of View).

IFF is central to autonmous mode. If no IFF reply is incomming, in autonmous mode, it is not seen as a positive foe , but, I wouldnt want to be in your plane

originally posted by: whyamIhere

Nobody blames the Russian People.

But they really seem to. That is what bothers me.

Russian people have had a #ty reputation for a loooong time because of many factors, true or forced.

Majority does not seem capable of differentiating between the government and its people. The same goes for Russians talking crap about the US and, citing "Gayropa". Really. People are homophobic here, that is true. Close-minded people.

And now the hatred aimed at Russia is very much controlled, I just wish I knew - why? Sales of newspapers? Dirty politics? It seems to escalate quickly.

Does the world really realize how devastating and horrifying real war is? I for one am sure that government of the US doesnt...

And do these loud people on the Internet really want war? Then I would invite every single internet warrior who screamed their lungs out "Russians are scum, drop a nuke on them" to join the army, and have a chance to put a bullet in one of the villains. Prove their loud brave words with action.

I realize that, perhaps, this is typical loud minority. But now it doesn't look like a minority.

I'm just so sick of it. Naturally, this situation keeps me in stress.

Don't want war, want honest and naked truth. Doubt that we will see it.

Sorry for off-topic rant.

Waiting tomorrow for the results of the examination of black boxes, then...

a reply to: spy66


Anyone cares to comment this crazy crazy theory -this pure speculation.

what if:
- MH370 was diverted, only with one purpose. The Black Box's;
- MH370 identical twin of MH017, haves very few or no difference in Black Box's;
- MH17 was forced to war zone to be crashed and create an International incident with Russia: Main purpose start a WW
- MH17 had to fall in rebel zone or near Russia boarder to ensure rebel's would get there first and temper with crash site and Black Box's;
- the BB's from MH370 previously gathered were erased, pasted with new data/info and flight conditions, previously obtained in a flight simulator;
- Air traffic control data at Kiev, has been compromised and altered since the day of the crash, to check with info on the new "twin" black box's (from MH370);
- Between the process of analyzing info/data on the BB's, someone is going switch the BB's from MH017 for MH370 BB's.;

Add this, it is impossible to a plain completely vanish from the surface of the earth or ocean with out leaving something behind.
Where is MH370?? The answer could point for responsibility of the crash MH017, in this theory at least.

Edit: Not to forget the identical Boeing 777 stored in Israel, like Dahboo7 made reference on youtube vid. Was this third plain secretly used to test and study the mechanisms to go off the grid and apply them to the flight MH370?

a reply to: Cablespider

Are you being serious?

static2.businessinsider.com... emitic-neo-nazi.jpg

John McCain, really?

A block of moldy cheese has more relevance than McCain.

And yes I am being serious, because that pic doesn't show the US is involved, as Senators do travel to other countries.

The day of the crash this was Obamas stance:

WASHINGTON: US President Barack Obama on Friday squarely blamed Russia and its President Putin for the outrageous shooting down of the Malaysian Airlines civilian flight that killed 298 people, saying separatists in Ukraine who brought down the plane could not have done it without Russian support, training, and arms.

source

Now...after talkin allllllllll that trash :

WASHINGTON (AP) — Senior U.S. intelligence officials say they have no evidence of direct Russian government involvement in the shooting down of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.

source

See how they scale back the rhetoric now that everything points to Kiev? Now its....oh it must have been an accident by the rebels. LOL. NOW they get nice. After all those accusations and STILL no evidence the rebels did it. Unless of course you count youtube and twitter....LOL

a reply to: rustyclutch

But, the best argument of all now:

Russia created the circumstances, which made this possible.

*facepalm

I mean it is kinda true to some extent, but was it Russia who wanted the revolution in Ukraine? Really? Is it Russian puppet now sitting in the Ukrainian presidential post, or?...

When they back out like that, it doesn't mean they are not guilty of throwing accusations on the highest level in the past.

originally posted by: rustyclutch
The day of the crash this was Obamas stance:

WASHINGTON: US President Barack Obama on Friday squarely blamed Russia and its President Putin for the outrageous shooting down of the Malaysian Airlines civilian flight that killed 298 people, saying separatists in Ukraine who brought down the plane could not have done it without Russian support, training, and arms.

source

Now...after talkin allllllllll that trash :

WASHINGTON (AP) — Senior U.S. intelligence officials say they have no evidence of direct Russian government involvement in the shooting down of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.

source

See how they scale back the rhetoric now that everything points to Kiev? Now its....oh it must have been an accident by the rebels. LOL. NOW they get nice. After all those accusations and STILL no evidence the rebels did it. Unless of course you count youtube and twitter....LOL

Washington back peddles faster than a French bike.

a reply to: moobie

I don't think they are back peddling anything they still blame Russia.

"Senior U.S. intelligence officials said Tuesday that Russia was responsible for "creating the conditions" that led to the shooting down of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17, but they offered no evidence of direct Russian government involvement."

bigstory.ap.org...