A Video from the Secret Space Program and Breakaway Civilization Conference 2014

originally posted by: Totemic
a reply to: knowledgedesired
. . . ridicule and debunkery are their cheapest and most prevalent tools . . .

This is how ordinary people engage in shooting themselves in the foot unwittingly.

originally posted by: Ectoplasm8
Is it your inherent desire and need to believe?

I know from my research that it's not a ridiculous story.

No.

It's my inquiring mind.

It doesn't mean he's not out to make a buck for himself . . .

He seems motivated by curiosity to me - not money. He was making a good living as an artist when he pursued this information.

. . . or is incredibly naive.

Possibly but he doesn't strike me that way.

originally posted by: knowledgedesired
a reply to: Mary Rose
I agree that it is in the wrong peoples hands now but at least they only want to rule the planet and not destroy it completely.

They seem to be psychopaths so yes they might want to destroy it completely.

If every single person on the planet had access to a power source that could easily destroy everyone I am pretty sure we would not be here very long. If people though having guns was a problem now imagine everyone having access to a particle beam or some other exotic weaponry that could cause destruction.

The average Joe wouldn't have access to a particle beam or weaponry.

He would be heating his home, etc.

originally posted by: Rob48
a reply to: Mary Rose
What on Earth does immigration and politics have to do with physics?

Nothing.

You missed the point.

Here is where I stated it:

I think believing the meme that we're not ready to handle the responsibility of zero point energy is analogous. We're being duped into thinking that.

The powers that be manipulate public opinion through the media, education, government, etc. They're pros at it.

originally posted by: Totemic
a reply to: Rob48

www.forbes.com...

Great article, by someone with no axe to grind. It may not be ZPE, (but who knows). Two things to take from the article. 1. Excess energy is being produced in reproducible experiments, and no one knows why. 2. Mainstream science is willing to ignore, suppress and/or ridicule unexpected science due to labels or just because the observed behavior is "impossible" by their dogmatic understanding of currently accepted science.

Science has become one part Dogma and one part Scientific Method, with a big dash of outside money to encourage certain findings and suppress others.

I am quite familiar with the E-Cat. The point is this: nobody is "suppressing" anything. Rossi has been invited countless times to open it up to outside testers, but he won't do it.
The 2013 (non-peer-reviewed paper) was just a "black box" test. The testers weren't allowed to see what was inside the magic box, and they didn't even check the wiring for any hidden power sources.

If Rossi wants the world to take him seriously, he has to play by the rules of science, and SHOW people how it works, so that it can be reproduced. The way that he claims it works can be shown to be false, because none of the products of nuclear fusion, cold or otherwise, are present. This is why everybody thinks it is a scam.

If the conspiracy theorists were right, then Rossi would long ago have got his car stuck on a level crossing or had a mysterious heart attack. He hasn't, and he is free, in fact has repeatedly been asked to demonstrate his claims in the proper way.

Respectable scientists don't "dismiss LENR" as you claim. Even NASA has people working on it, for example: climate.nasa.gov... (Incidentally, NASA offered to test Rossi's E-Cat, but he wouldn't let them. They might have made him unplug it - they're sneaky like that!)

originally posted by: Mary Rose

The statement about the additional information is made in the context of the non-disclosure documents that he was forced to sign.

Maybe the non-disclosure documents spell out things that one is agreeing not to disclose.

originally posted by: Mary Rose
What do you suppose a non-disclosure document entails? A simple one paragraph statement and a signature line?

According to Wikipedia the formal term for a black project in the United States is "Special Access Program" (SAP).

The Wikipedia article for SAPs mentions specialized non-disclosure agreements.

Apparently, a non-disclosure agreement (NDA) is also known as:

a confidentiality agreement (CA), confidential disclosure agreement (CDA), proprietary information agreement (PIA), or secrecy agreement (SA), is a legal contract between at least two parties that outlines confidential material, knowledge, or information that the parties wish to share with one another for certain purposes, but wish to restrict access to or by third parties. It is a contract through which the parties agree not to disclose information covered by the agreement. An NDA creates a confidential relationship between the parties to protect any type of confidential and proprietary information or trade secrets. As such, an NDA protects nonpublic business information.

en.wikipedia.org...

To research what kinds of things were likely in the non-disclosure agreement that Kent Sellen had to sign, it would be helpful to know which abbreviation or acronym typically applies to the specialized non-disclosure agreement associated with an SAP:

• NDA
  
• CA
  
• CDA
  
• PIA (I doubt it; sounds like strictly business)
  
• SA
  

Does anyone know which one applies?

originally posted by: Mary Rose

Does anyone know which one applies?

None of the above. NDAs would apply to the people actually working on the project, with access to the technical information, not some schmuck who walked past the barn door and saw the exterior of a craft.

Kent Sellen was nothing to do with the supposed project. Why would he be given an 18-hour tutorial on the ins and outs of it, and then made to sign an NDA forbidding him from revealing these things that he didn't have any idea about before the debriefing?

It makes NO SENSE!

a reply to: Rob48

In 1973 he was employed as a crew chief and was sent by his boss to Edwards Air Force Base North Base facility in the course of his job where he inadvertently saw the craft.

He was subjected to an 18 hour debriefing not a tutorial.

A debriefing includes what?

originally posted by: Mary Rose
a reply to: Rob48

In 1973 he was employed as a crew chief and was sent by his boss to Edwards Air Force Base North Base facility in the course of his job where he inadvertently saw the craft.

Yes, he was meant to be going to pick up a ground power unit for an aircraft. Nothing to do with any black project.

He was subjected to an 18 hour debriefing not a tutorial.

A debriefing includes what?

Well who knows? According to Valone's book:

They put a hood over his head, blindfolded him, hauled him off; and they spent 18 hours debriefing him. While they did, they told him things about this vehicle that my buddy Brad didn't even know.

Sounds a lot like a tutorial to me, if after one quick glimpse of the "saucer" they were telling him more about it than Sorensen knew.

originally posted by: Rob48
Yes, he was meant to be going to pick up a ground power unit for an aircraft. Nothing to do with any black project.

And your point is?

a reply to: Mary Rose

My point, as I stated before, is that he wouldn't have been asked to sign an NDA because he wasn't part of the project, He also wouldn't have been given an 18-hour "debriefing" that apparently taught him all about the things that he was then supposed to keep secret. Before this "debriefing", he didn't know anything about the craft other than what he saw. Afterwards, he was given all manner of technical info which he was apparently perfectly able to divulge to McCandlish, NDA or no NDA.

As I said, it makes no sense. If you catch someone about to break into your house, you don't give them a long guided tour of where you keep the valuables and tell them the combination to the safe and all your PIN numbers and passwords, before telling them they have to forget it all!

originally posted by: Rob48
a reply to: Mary Rose

My point, as I stated before, is that he wouldn't have been asked to sign an NDA because he wasn't part of the project

Apparently an NDA is not just for people who are signing on to a project.

It could be for anyone who has to be obligated not to talk about what has been seen - yes, in this case not much was seen.

The fact remains he inadvertently saw something highly classified.

He also wouldn't have been given an 18-hour "debriefing" that apparently taught him all about the things that he was then supposed to keep secret.

You don't know how much of the time was spent on the "additional information."

And you don't know what a debriefing in this context includes, do you?

What research have you done?

I suspect a great deal of that 18 hours was spent putting the fear of God into him as a matter of routine in such a scenario.

We don't know why the "additional information" was imparted. That's what I'm still trying to find out.

That's a heavy metals test, not a drug and alcohol test. Like I said, drug and alcohol probably sealed by the parents.

a reply to: Mary Rose

a reply to: raymundoko

Which is irrelevant if it's true.

And irrelevant if it's not true.

Either way it's irrelevant.

If he only got a glimpse of the craft, isn't it safe to assume that all info beyond what a glimpse could give was given to him during the 18 hour debriefing? If the story went down as he described it, it would make sense for the "debriefers" to be feeding him disinfo, possibly specific disinfo so that if it got back to them, they'd know who leaked it.

originally posted by: conundrummer
If he only got a glimpse of the craft, isn't it safe to assume that all info beyond what a glimpse could give was given to him during the 18 hour debriefing?

Yes.

If the story went down as he described it, it would make sense for the "debriefers" to be feeding him disinfo, possibly specific disinfo so that if it got back to them, they'd know who leaked it.

That's a possibility.

originally posted by: TheSearchforSpork
Hi All, my name is James Gladman. I'm the co-producer of "Zero Point". If you have any questions about James Allen, or the film Zero Point, ask me.

Why didn't James Allen ask Mark McCandlish why Kent Sellen was provided information about the ARV during the 18 hour debriefing?

a reply to: knowledgedesired

This video is of a special briefing that Dr Steven Greer gave in Washington, DC on April 13, 2014.

He talks about the conundrum of the fact that free energy technologies can be weaponized:

originally posted by: Mary Rose
He gave us the Disclosure Project and deserves our respect for putting it together.

A very interesting video about the Disclosure Project:

originally posted by: Mary Rose
Is it your inherent desire and need to believe?
I know from my research that it's not a ridiculous story.

No.

It's my inquiring mind.

Your research of this story? How far and deeply have you researched it? Have you found information about any of his witnesses/sources?

Tell me how this is believable and not ridiculous:
- An old classmate is just allowed into a presentation with high ranking officials to see top secret craft.
- The display of this craft is set up with panels removed giving a cut-away type of view.
- A top secret craft is given a name that's an acronym with "Alien" in the title.
- A stranger tells him he saw this craft in 1973 and was debriefed and given highly detailed information of the mechanical workings of the cockpit.
- He hears an interview with abductees and one just so happens to be abducted in one of these craft. She apparently is given the grand tour and gives him a detailed description of the "engine room".

Bam bam bam... He has it all laid out for him. Or he manipulates people like yourself to believe he did. It baffles me how any intelligent person can so readily accept a story like this. That's why I say you must go into this case with the predisposed belief of alien piloted UFOs, which clouds your judgment.