Greatest Conjunction aka Bethlehem Star

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

In that case, I recommend Mutants and Mystics by Kripal. You'll never read a comic the same way again! Or a bible, for that matter.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Like I said the word lucifer became a proper name by misconception,

True, but Lucifer also became the common morningstar by your stroke of pen.

It really depends on the context of the conversation. If the context is modern theology, I use "Lucifer" as the proper name of Satan for the sake of avoiding confusion caused by the modern misconception that exists in most minds. But, if you want to split hairs, then lucifer is the nothing more than a title.

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Or perhaps they are annointed as reincarnations for a new astrological age.

Good vs evil, truth vs lie, angel vs angel might be symbols of a cyclical change in the stars.

I dont think its wise to rely on astrological ages for any sort of spiritual guidance. While astronomy is a useful tool in confirming short term cycles of history (by short term, I mean 3-4,000 year cycles), there is no garantee that these cycles have always been, or will continue to be.

I believe that just 4,466 years ago, Earth made a sudden shift from 360 days per solar year to 365.25 days. What caused this shift is still a mystery to me.

Several thousand years ago, the alleged "Precession of Equinox" appeared to have a 26k year cycle, now the cycle seems to be shortening to 23-24k years. There are no real constants in science.

According to my analysis of the biblical prophecies, the ENTIRE physical universe will be destroyed in the year 3073 AD. Then it will he recreated. There is a cycle to history, but its not dependant on astrological cycles. Its dependant on collective human free will. A time is coming to cast a collective vote yet again, between 2016 - 2023. Then a new age will come.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

Or perhaps they are annointed as reincarnations for a new astrological age.

Good vs evil, truth vs lie, angel vs angel might be symbols of a cyclical change in the stars.

I dont think its wise to rely on astrological ages for any sort of spiritual guidance.

Well then its a good thing I don't rely on it! It's just one of many systems of divination. All systems of divination, including those found in the Bible, use the principle of synchronicity.

Synchronicity is just one piece of the puzzle. It's a piece that, with all due respect, I don't think you understand.

But the important thing is to avoid a narrow, ethnocentric, myopic perspective that can only look at the world through the lens of one religion - their own.

Comparativism can prevent that, by giving a student a panoramic view.

Never mind, I mis-read your post

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

In that case, I recommend Mutants and Mystics by Kripal. You'll never read a comic the same way again! Or a bible, for that matter.

Thanx! This one here? ==> www.amazon.com...

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Like I said the word lucifer became a proper name by misconception,

True, but Lucifer also became the common morningstar by your stroke of pen.

It really depends on the context of the conversation. If the context is modern theology, I use "Lucifer" as the proper name of Satan for the sake of avoiding confusion caused by the modern misconception that exists in most minds. But, if you want to split hairs, then lucifer is the nothing more than a title.

As always, feel free to believe what you want. Names is everything when you come to detail level of Christendom. Lucifer is not a title of Satan, it is Christian sweet-talk and nonsense. If anyone in the Bible is Lucifer, it is Jesus.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

In that case, I recommend Mutants and Mystics by Kripal. You'll never read a comic the same way again! Or a bible, for that matter.

Thanx! This one here? ==> www.amazon.com...

Yep. Mind blowing stuff.

originally posted by: BlueMule

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim

originally posted by: BlueMule
a reply to: Utnapisjtim

In that case, I recommend Mutants and Mystics by Kripal. You'll never read a comic the same way again! Or a bible, for that matter.

Thanx! This one here? ==> www.amazon.com...

Yep. Mind blowing stuff.

Found this one here too ==> www.amazon.com... ==> "Our Gods Wear Spandex: The Secret History of Comic Book Heroes"

Was Superman's arch nemesis Lex Luthor based on Aleister Crowley? Can Captain Marvel be linked to the Sun gods on antiquity? In Our Gods Wear Spandex, Christopher Knowles answers these questions and brings to light many other intriguing links between superheroes and the enchanted world of estoerica. [...] Chapters include: Ancient of Days, Ascended Masters, God and Gangsters, Mad Scientists and Modern Sorcerers, and many more. From the ghettos of Prague to the halls of Valhalla to the Fortress of Solitude and the aisles of BEA and ComiCon, this is the first book to show the inextricable link between superheroes and the enchanted world of esoterica.

Looks promising.

Acts 7

40SAYING TO AARON, ‘MAKE FOR US GODS WHO WILL GO BEFORE US; FOR THIS MOSES WHO LED US OUT OF THE LAND OF EGYPT—WE DO NOT KNOW WHAT HAPPENED TO HIM.’ 41“At that time they made a calf and brought a sacrifice to the idol, and were rejoicing in the works of their hands. 42“But God turned away and delivered them up to serve the host of heaven; as it is written in the book of the prophets, ‘IT WAS NOT TO ME THAT YOU OFFERED VICTIMS AND SACRIFICES FORTY YEARS IN THE WILDERNESS, WAS IT, O HOUSE OF ISRAEL? 43‘YOU ALSO TOOK ALONG THE TABERNACLE OF MOLOCH AND THE STAR OF THE GOD ROMPHA, THE IMAGES WHICH YOU MADE TO WORSHIP. I ALSO WILL REMOVE YOU BEYOND BABYLON.’

44“Our fathers had the tabernacle of testimony in the wilderness, just as He who spoke to Moses directed him to make it according to the pattern which he had seen.

Moloch means king. The King of Stars is Jupiter. Rompha or Chiun (the word used in the passage from Amos) is Kayamanu the Babylonian Saturn.

There were 2 tabernacles in the wilderness. The tabernacle of testimony was a little tent that covered the ark of the testimony. If you search tabernacle of testimony or testimony you will see it is almost always referring to the ark.

Inside the smaller tabernacle which was the Holy of Holies, was the ark. On that ark were two cherubim. If you look at the cherubim in Ezekiel the face of a calf = the face of the cherubim.

Look at the beginning of the passage from Acts I posted. The context of the Israelites worshipping Moloch and Rompha, is placed with the golden calf incident, and then followed immediately by mentioning the tabernacle of testimony. They are all calf's, and the cherubim on the ark are actually one, they are one piece of metal.

What this incident says to me is that they were worshipping the creation and not the creator. The ark was given as a testimony, or sign, it is a symbol of us. When we dwell in unity as the two cherubim touching, then God will manifest in our midst.

What our tendency to do though is to worship the shiny gold objects, aka the ark, aka Moloch and Chiun, aka the host of heaven.

Thats the negative side, and I was just giving that as a background to show the types laid down in the OT, regarding Jupiter and Saturn coming together as a sign for the birth of the Son. We see the Son of Man in the OT and Revelation theophanies in the cloud, and between the cherubim (Jupiter/Saturn).

originally posted by: zardust

Moloch means king. The King of Stars is Jupiter. Rompha or Chiun (the word used in the passage from Amos) is Kayamanu the Babylonian Saturn.

Indeed, thanks, I never knew that this verse was talking of Jupiter and Saturn, but after going through notes and tracking the passages, it's quite obvious that Stephen is most likely referring to the very same conjunction this thread is centred around. That's just so amazing! Thanks!

Stephen also has another astronomical observation up his sleave. Upon being stoned he said, “Behold, I see the heavens opened, and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God.”

If you release the chains of Draco or simply take a photograph of the apex of heaven on a clear night with no or new Moon and keep the shutter open for a while, and then look at the picture, and you will see the shape of a king seated at his throne. Draco makes out the head and right arm of this king. And by the Father's right hand, what do we see? The Big Dipper aka Ursa Major or the Big Bear. In Norway we call it Karlsvogna in reference to Torekarl (Lit. 'Thunder-Man'), a name for Thor, the Norse god of thunder. I interpret Stephen's last words as him looking up towards the apex of heaven where he sees God (Draco+surrounding stars) sitting on his throne with the Son of Man (Ursa Major and surrounding stars) standing at his right hand side.

...they were worshipping the creation and not the creator. The ark was given as a testimony, or sign, it is a symbol of us. When we dwell in unity as the two cherubim touching, then God will manifest in our midst.

What our tendency to do though is to worship the shiny gold objects, aka the ark, aka Moloch and Chiun, aka the host of heaven.

Like there were two tabernacles, one big and one small, there were also two arks. One big gilded mother and one much smaller, wooden one. To reflect Jupiter and Saturn perhaps.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

I know the ark was made of acacia, which is a black thorny wood, this is a type of our flesh, humanity. It was overlaid with gold, which symbolizes our divinity. I'm not sure about 2 arks???

a reply to: zardust

Well, atleast it's my understanding of it. They sure put a lot of effort into suggesting there were two seperate arks, and two sets of ten commandments. Infact the only ten commandments that are named "The Ten Commandments", are not related to morale and worship, but is a ten step plan of re-conquering the land of Canaan. Moses is discribed as ascending two different mountains to receive two different sets of ten commandments, and there are two seperate arks with different contents. I made a thread about it a few months ago:

==> www.abovetopsecret.com...

ETA: Below is a picture of Red Acacia or 'Vachellia Seyal', the source of Shettim wood, the wood used in constructing the Ark(s) of the Covenant(s).



As you see, the bark on the stems is reddish (like Adama the soil in Eden, which refers 'red ocre clay') and the leaves look familiar to the ones you and Undo discuss at www.abovetopsecret.com...

In that thread i link it to the elusive Tree of Life. In Gilgamesh this tree is a thorny one.

Vachellia Seyal ==> en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Cool stuff !! I'll check into the 2 arks. Its not that I doubt you, I wouldn't be surprised because I think the Moses stories are multiple points of view conglomerated into one guy. The Deuteronomists for instancehaving a very different take on those old liberation tales.

a reply to: zardust

One other interesting thing is how there are 40 consecutive Saturn-Jupiter conjunctions per cycle. Seeing how the number '40 something' refers to "many things" or "long time" in both Hebrew and Arabic, and how Saturn-Jupiter conjunctions seem to be central to the Hebrew culture, the Jupiter-Saturn cycle may actually be the origin of the Semitic use of the number forty to express vastness. Amos certainly seems to suggest such a connection. 40 days of constant raining caused the Flood, Moses walked for 40 years in the wilderness, and Alibaba had his pack of 40 thieves. Jesus didn't taste food or water for 40 days. Amos also contains other astronomical references, like Orion (Kesil) and the Pleiades (Kimah).

originally posted by: BlueMule
The thing about that dream was, I got the feeling that my opponent with metal teeth and claws was only an opponent when we were in the ring. Only an opponent at certain points of the cycle. Outside of the ring, we are almost brothers. That's why he gave me hospitality and a preview of his newfound teeth and claws. Heads up, warrior to warrior.

Maybe it was a teaching in proper conduct when handling Satan? Satan (the adversary) doesn't bother you unless you're doing something wrong. Satan is the famed 'Right Hand of God' and God only smites you if you are disobedient. That's why all the Christians struggle with satans and demons. And to make things worse they blame it on Satan as he stomps them further and further down the mud. What they don't seem to understand is that it is God who smites them. Satan is just the messenger or the fist. No good comes out of killing messengers and hating fists. Seeing your gentle way of life, I suppose some divinity wanted to show you that behind all the teeth and claws, there is a person. I once lived in a collective and me and a namesake there used to fight all the time, only friendly, you know boys being boys. He once dislocated my scapula, damn it was funky, and we broke a few ribs on eachother during the time we lived there. It was just for sports, "in the ring". Learned 'shifting' and fighting all in one take It's good for a man 'to step in the ring' and entertain friendship outside the ring. It's a good thing.

The bethlehem star was a UFO. Constentine witnessed the same type of event and modeled the cross after the way it shined.

ufodigest.com...

a reply to: libertytoall

Why replicate something that actually happened which is central to Hebrew royalty and the source of the rabbinical mystery? And truth be told, leading a handful bleeders from Persia to Jerusalem in a huge light emitting ufo at walking pace is a total bore, not even aliens would be that ineconomical, would be easier sending a guy to guide them. Planets however are very patient and show exactly the same behaviour as the magi mimic'ed by their 40 mile stroll.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

Made a simplified, but at the same time a more vivid chart showing the progression of Saturn-Jupiter triple conjunctions. Each of the black circles shows the occurances of Greatest conjunctions. Note that the more distant dates are estimates since the sidereal year grows ever faster and there is precession and the fact that our orbits are eliptical, and the exact position of the conjunctions aren’t accurate, but based on ideal rounded measures and loosely on Kepler’s notes.



Every third circle marks the estimated position of millennial 'fifth element' Saturn-Jupiter triple conjunctions, so called Greatest conjunctions. The Magenta coloured circles mark future (and/or past) such conjunctions. If we are to believe my interpretation of Kepler. Numbers seem to add up. Have to get back to you, got visitors.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim



Updated pic with "correct" dates. Had to add one between Adam and Noah. Enoch or rather Henok seemed to fit.

ETA: Looks to me that back in Adam's days, days were shorter, which could in part explain how Adam is said to be 930 years old. In 7000 years time between every fifth triple conjunction between Jupiter and Saturn doubles. Then again, I am but an amateur and I may be far off with the dating. For the dates before Elijah I have used the biblical analogies, please tell me if my numbers are completely on the wrong planet.