Capitalism doesn't and IS NOT working, it's destructive and creatives poor social incentives

a reply to: Amagnon

capital is not savings at all. capital is any non-financial asset used to produce goods and services. this is econ 101.

capitalism is a system born and borne by slavery.

a reply to: Amagnon

literally feudalism

a reply to: bbracken677

human nature is an essentially theological notion that has not one whit of scientific evidence behind it. In part because it's a non-falsifiable hypothesis.

I"m finding some of the posts here to be funny. A few are saying how evil America is and how evil capitalism is ... and yet they are sitting on computers and on the internet saying it ... all brought to you be the USA and free market capitalism. And ATS is a product of a free market USA system. What a hoot.

originally posted by: freakwars
a reply to: bbracken677

human nature is an essentially theological notion that has not one whit of scientific evidence behind it. In part because it's a non-falsifiable hypothesis.

That's not true. What we colloquially call "human nature" is a pattern of behavior that has been observed and tested for quite a long time. Human behavior has been scientifically studied and historically observed. Human nature is why your ideal of communism has failed wherever it has been tried and the ideal can never be reached.

originally posted by: NavyDoc

originally posted by: freakwars
a reply to: bbracken677

human nature is an essentially theological notion that has not one whit of scientific evidence behind it. In part because it's a non-falsifiable hypothesis.

.

Humans and animals are the same and behave the same way and can be controlled through the same methods.

There is scientific evidence of it, lots and lots of it....

Humans are just the dumbest and most helpless and most easily exploited members of the animal kingdom.

A lot of people claim the difference between animals and people is that animals defecate where they eat, but that is only true when you put an animal in a cage, it will, by the way, do it's duty in a certain area if it has the space to the same as people will....

Our crap is everywhere if you slow down enough to see it, we breathe it.

A septic system is populated by bacteria, little animals that clean up everything and make it safer and more sanitary to release into the environment, that technology is natural as is everything else.

Mankind never really did anything with anything that wasn't here already.a reply to: freakwars

a reply to: FlyersFan

computers are a product of workers.

a reply to: NavyDoc

it's a pattern of behavior studied within a specific cultural continuity. yeah, there's a pattern of behavior but it's by no means innate and is relatively easily modified.

a reply to: MyHappyDogShiner

not true. humans rose to the top of the food chain through adaptability. that adaptability precludes a fixed human nature.

There is no such thing as a behavior that is universal among all human beings (all right, I'll give you defecation). if there were an innate human nature it would be universal or nearly so. however, that's not what we see. instead we see a dizzying variety of cultural formations in the archaeological record. massively different behaviors. there is not human nature other than this: mutability. humans change either themselves or their environments to suit their needs. there. that's human nature. i see no conflict between this and communism.

originally posted by: freakwars
a reply to: NavyDoc

it's a pattern of behavior studied within a specific cultural continuity. yeah, there's a pattern of behavior but it's by no means innate and is relatively easily modified.

I disagree. There are behaviors that the historical and archeological record shows are both universal and common place and such behaviors and basic driving forces have been studied by science and have not been proven to be "easily modified." Of course, communists in the past have tried to do so and killed an awful lot of people in the attempt. You would have to brainwash and destroy individuality if your utopia had any hope, but then would life be worth living if your were a brainwashed zombie?

originally posted by: freakwars
a reply to: FlyersFan

computers are a product of workers.

Designed and started off and inspired by capitalists. The "worker's paradise" stifles innovation, free thought, artistic endeavors, and individuality. Individual liberty and free market capitalism brought you this computer.

a reply to: NavyDoc

name one such behavior

a reply to: NavyDoc

the first recognizable computers were invented by a man named Charles Babbage, whose thoughts on political economy were very inspirational to a man named Karl Marx.
Babbage was a scholar, who owned no businesses. Babbage was not a capitalist.

The technologies that followed him were largely produced by governments and only elaborated upon by companies. And of course, these elaborations were rarely made by business owners. Most of the developments in computing that catapulted Apple and Microsoft to the top of the industry were created by relatively low ranking employees of companies like Xerox.

Also, if the "worker's paradise" stifles innovation, free thought, etc. then why did the Soviet Union construct the first electronic ternary computer 20 years before the Americans? As to artistic endeavors, I direct you to the fact that the bulk of the modern movement was inspired by Russian artists immediately after the Revolution. Stalin of course crushed them like he did the rest of the revolutionary forces in Russia.

originally posted by: freakwars
computers are a product of workers.

Computers were invented by people in order to make money and to make a business venture better. The inventors hired people to make them. The people making them wouldn't have a job if it weren't for the inventor who was motivated to make them by a free market society and capitalism.

So people are sitting on their computers .... and sitting on a web site on the internet ... both of which only came into being because of a free market capitalist system. And the only reason the computer and the website are still here are free market capitalist systems upholding them.

originally posted by: freakwars
the first recognizable computers were invented by a man named Charles Babbage, whose thoughts on political economy were very inspirational to a man named Karl Marx.
Babbage was a scholar, who owned no businesses. Babbage was not a capitalist.

Babbage is the grandfather of the current cost driven manufacturing paradigm.
2nd.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: sirhumperdink


the angriest people are going to be the ones that are most complacent right now

I agree the ones that worked all their life's to see it end are the ones you are calling complacent right now, ya what does a young person with only an IPhone got to loose?

Everyone with nothing to loose wants change ..lol

you mean our entire futures?
you got to ride the gravy train for decades and now your complaining when the broken system you supported finally crumbles?
good job there....... you just screwed all of us over so you could live beyond your means and pillage the rest of the world by forcing upon them an unwanted reserve currency

for the record i dont have an iphone or any smart phone for that matter

but lol young people are just lazy ignorant tech adicts

(or maybe we see what youve done and are perfectly willing to let you sleep in the bed you made so we can fix it when youre gone)

a reply to: FlyersFan

because computers cant exist in socialist countries amirite?


what inventor of the computer?
the computer has thousands of inventors many of whom did not get rich from their discoveries or ideas or even consider it a motivating factor
same is true of code look at dennis ritchie the guy that invented the C programming language (as well as working on other extremely important thing)
many of your computer programs are written in C or some variation yet this guy did not die an extremely wealthy man
look at linux .....some of the most stable and useful operating systems in existence .....and theyre free..... thousands of people working together on the code every day to make it even better...... all without pay
now you want an example of an operating system created in a capitalist style....take a gander at the turd that is windows
it is very quickly looking like open source is the future of computing
patents stall progress and many times do not benefit the people who put in the most work or contributed the most important ideas


you know nothing about the history of computers if you can sit there with a straight face and say that the modern computer could not exist without capitalism

originally posted by: sirhumperdink
because computers cant exist in socialist countries amirite?

Conceivably, anything can exist in any type of society...a million monkeys with a million typewriters, and all that...where capitalism differs and excels is at getting innovation and invention to the marketplace.

Why? Profit margins increase as implementation time frame decreases.