Today's KORAN not the same KORAN - REVALATION

a reply to: LightningStrikesHere
You are making excuses. What you had asked was if any Jihadists would do things against Islamic teaching. I gave an example. Now you say they aren't real muslims. That's a pathetic excuse. They are Jihadists. And they are going against what you claim is Islam.

originally posted by: glend
But you say nothing of Christian nations like US having the highest incarceration/murder/sexual abuse rates in world.

1 - America isn't a 'christian nation'. We are a nation of secular rule of law.

2 - In Islamic countries crimes against women and children go unreported due to fear by the woman of being further victimized by the courts. (Rape victims being called 'adulterers' and getting 100 lashes and death sentences). Abuse rates in Muslim countries are severely under reported.

3 - The USA doesn't have the highest sexual abuse rates in the world. Not even close. The Islamic and African nations do. Womens Stats Information



More

- 4 out of 5 Middle-Eastern women are sexually abused between the ages of 3 and 6 by family members.
- More than half of all Yemeni girls are married before reaching puberty.
- About 1 in 10 pregnancies in the Arab world ends in abortion. In Pakistan every 6th pregnancy is terminated.
- 94% of Yemeni children (2-14 yrs) subjected to violence from a parent or guardian
- The number of honor killings in Pakistan are estimated to be around 2,500 to 3,000 cases every year

4 - Wanna talk murder rates?
- Muslims are slaughtering each other all over the middle east and persia. All over who has the real 'religion of peace'. These go unreported as murders. As do the 'honor killings'
- 13 Islamic can legally murder a person if the person is atheist.

People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

People shouldn't be indoctrinated to the point that they can't see the truth set before them.

a reply to: LightningStrikesHere
Applaud that which agrees with you ... even though it's wrong .. and Ignore the actual facts presented. Really? So you refuse to admit that the Qu'ran is proven dead wrong and so was Muhammad?
Fact - Muhammad never proved his claims.
Fact - there are tons of errors in the Qu'ran
Fact - Adam and Eve didn't happen.
Fact - Noahs Ark didn't happen.
Fact - Exodus didn't happen.
Fact - People in Muslim countries are put to death for leaving Islam.
Fact - Muslim countries many times don't allow anything in the country that counters Islamic error.
Fact - It's very clear that Muhammad 'borrowed' stories from other religions and then repeated them, poorly, when he invented his religion. He didn't get 'revelations'. If they had been 'revelations' there wouldn't be any errors. And yet .. there are errors ... so no 'revelations'.

ALL of the above have been proven. They are fact.

originally posted by: LightningStrikesHere
Executions, pedofile, drugs,high rate of impresonment , decline in morals , high murder rate, rights being taken away, failed medical system, nationalism , genetically modified foods, invading & bombing country's, false Flagg operations, testing chemicals on its own people, killing its own people, killing innocent children through drone strikes...

Oh brother. Just about everything you listed up there goes on in Islamic countries Execution in Islamic countries for simply being an atheist or a homosexual ... pedophilia and rape at massive numbers ... imprisonment for absurd things like being the victim of rape or for simply being a Christian or for daring to wear sandals without toes being covered (Iran) .... exceptionally high murder rate that goes unreported ... slaughtering each other in the streets with guns and bombs while trying to figure out who is the correct 'religion of peace' .... piss poor medical care .... nationalism ... mass killings, honor killings, calls to massacre those who don't believe in God the same way ... And you say 'rights being taken away' ... HA! thats funny. There is no free speech in Islamic countries. No freedom of the press. No freedom of religion. There is no freedom for women in many cases to learn to read, to get certain college degrees, to drive a car, or to even leave the home to go shopping on her own. Many times there is no freedom to marry the person you love.

originally posted by: DarknStormy
The biggest mistake today is the Bible.

The Old Testament is seriously screwed up for sure.

Maybe it's the reason why the Qu'ran was sent..

The Quran wasn't sent, it was invented. Just like many of the mythological (and agenda filled) stories in the Old Testament were invented. And there is no way that Muhammad could 'fix' any supposed errors in the New Testament. He lived 600 years after the events. And obviously God wasn't speaking to Muhammad because if God was, then there wouldn't be so many errors in the Qu'ran.

a reply to: FlyersFan

Perhaps you should watch a documentary called "Fallujah - the hidden massacre" and tell me exactly how that fits into your model of "US is a nation of secular rule of law" US used wmd against a country that was blamed for having WMD but had none, the hypocrisy of US has no bounds. Yet no-one was convicted in US over the illegal genocide in Iraq. (www.vice.com...).

Many islamic countries have problems with rape and unreported rapes but its not a religious problem, its a cultural problem. US surveys suggest at least 22 million women in US have been raped in their lifetime.

IsUS is funded by the US (www.theguardian.com...). Brzezinski has already admitted US funded Taliban/Al-Qaeda in Afghanistan through Pakistani ISI which is also known to have funded terrorist in 9/11.

Its a strange world, not as black and white as you think,

originally posted by: FlyersFan


The Old Testament is seriously screwed up for sure.

I was actually referring to the New Testament...

The Quran wasn't sent, it was invented. Just like many of the mythological (and agenda filled) stories in the Old Testament were invented. And there is no way that Muhammad could 'fix' any supposed errors in the New Testament. He lived 600 years after the events. And obviously God wasn't speaking to Muhammad because if God was, then there wouldn't be so many errors in the Qu'ran.

The New Testament is the biggest myth out of all of them.

- How many prophets have died and come back to life in religion? Only the Christian one.. Sounds like a fairytale to me. Christians may aswell put their faith in Barbie Dolls and GI Joe.

- The New Testament has been fabricated numerous times.. The Romans and Rabbis made up stuff, The English Royal family changed the teachings so one could get a divorce, The New Testament has no legitimacy. You only have to look at fanatical Christians to see how far this religion is going, they are borderline retarded.

- Even if the New Testament had legitimacy, you yourself are denying the God of the Old Testament whilst claiming he is OK in the New Testament. Sorry to say but you are lukewarm... BTW, they are the same God's.

a reply to: FlyersFan

4:82 If it had been from [any] other than Allah , they would have found within it much contradiction.

all of misrepresentations from sun in the murky water, blood clot or grammar have long been refuted and explained by scholars but there are always some not very well educated on the subject who for whatever reason have need to find errors.

guys, you are holding straws.

why I am saying that?

because I was looking for some time what people who claim errors or contradictions etc. have to say - not even one time I found anything...

originally posted by: demus
a reply to: FlyersFan

4:82 If it had been from [any] other than Allah , they would have found within it much contradiction.

all of misrepresentations from sun in the murky water, blood clot or grammar have long been refuted and explained by scholars but there are always some not very well educated on the subject who for whatever reason have need to find errors.

guys, you are holding straws.

why I am saying that?

because I was looking for some time what people who claim errors or contradictions etc. have to say - not even one time I found anything...

This is completely correct.

I have been debating on posting refuting facts on what flayerfan posted.
However is it worth it ?

Or will the debate continue to no end ....

It is what it is ... At the end of the day I am still Muslim Alhamdulilah!!!

a reply to: LightningStrikesHere

there is no need, because all of the refutations can be found with few clicks IF somebody want to know.

Good point. The illiteracy rate is only that high for muslem women.

originally posted by: demus
a reply to post=18102995]LightningStrikesHere[/post]

there is no need, because all of the refutations can be found with few clicks IF somebody want to know.

I agree , my issuse is being able to provide the correct knowlege .
This is very important when doing dawa .

I my self am very much a student of knowlege .

I supose i could just link videos however i dont think that would apeal to this crowd.

Also I am not qualified to issue knowledge on hadith ect . ect.

originally posted by: glend
Perhaps you should watch a documentary called "Fallujah - the hidden massacre" and tell me exactly how that fits into your model of "US is a nation of secular rule of law"

Perhaps you should explain exactly how the secular rule of law doesn't fit. It was secular rule of law that sent forces into Fallujah. Not religious ones.

Many islamic countries have problems with rape and unreported rapes but its not a religious problem, its a cultural problem.

It's a culture based on faith. But that's not the point. The point is that there are people on here screaming that the West is a mess of rape and murder etc etc and that Islamic countries aren't. That simply isn't true. I posted the facts showing that there is indeed a very high rate of rape, child molestation and murder in Muslim countries. Those things happen everywhere, not just in the West.

originally posted by: DarknStormy
The New Testament is the biggest myth out of all of them.

You are free to think that. However, to call the New Testament a myth but then accept the absurdity of Muhammads 'visions' ... I find that silly. But whatever, dude ... you are free to turn the common sense on and off as you wish.

BTW, they are the same God's.

BTW .. not even close.

originally posted by: demus
I was looking for some time what people who claim errors or contradictions etc. have to say - not even one time I found anything...

I already posted them so you are only seeing what you want to see.

Noahs Ark - proven not to have happened. Adam and Eve - proven not to have happened. Exodus - proven not to have happened. So Muhammad LIED when he said Allah told him these stories. Common sense - Muhammad was just regurgitating old stories he heard from other religions when he invented his new one. GOD doesn't make mistakes. GOD wouldn't lie. So GOD wouldn't have told those stories to Muhammad or anyone else. Bottom line - Muhammad didn't get the Qu'ran from God.

originally posted by: LightningStrikesHere
I have been debating on posting refuting facts on what flayerfan posted.
However is it worth it ?

I said Noahs Ark didn't happen. You said 'prove it'. I proved it. I said Adam and Eve didn't happen. You said 'prove it'. I proved it. You have failed to prove the scientific facts wrong. If you had any facts, you'd post them. Obviously, you do not. Therefore ... you need to admit that the qur'an is in error. It's just that simple. Admit the Qu'ran is wrong.

a reply to: FlyersFan

if you want to prove something you should have knowledge about it first hand.

you cannot go on the internet in search of misrepresentations and than claim it as a proof.

see this:

According to Islam, Noah's ark was a flat watercraft made of logs, tied together with primitive ropes, the flood was local, around the Dead Sea area, and the animals were Noah's domesticated animals.

how could you prove it it didn't happen?

a reply to: FlyersFan

you see, to have any basis for discussion about Qur'an you should have at least read it.

but than you might become a believer in one god and submit your will to him and you seems to refuse that possibility.

originally posted by: demus
if you want to prove something you should have knowledge about it first hand.

Yes ... a person should. And obviously you didn't read the science presented so you have no knowledge.

you cannot go on the internet in search of misrepresentations and than claim it as a proof.

The science I presented is fact.

how could you prove it it didn't happen?

I already did. There is absolutely no evidence to support Noahs Ark. And Adam and Eve has been completely proven false. DNA evidence proves both stories fail.

originally posted by: demus
than you might become a believer in one god

I already believe in God. And God isn't found in the Qu'ran; He's not found in lies told by fake prophets, be they ancient or new; and He's not found in MYTHS from the Old Testament that have been proven wrong.