Bible following women how can you follow something that represses you?.

I can not believe that some modern women follow a book that represses their sex so much.
For example.

Deuteronomy 22:28-29
King James Version (KJV)
28 If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found;

29 Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.

So a man can rape you and If found he has to pay the father silver and If the woman is not married or engaged she is forced into the marriage of her rapist.

Genesis 3:16
New International Version (NIV)
16 To the woman he said,

“I will make your pains in childbearing very severe;
with painful labor you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you.”

Saying men rule over women.

(I Timothy 2:11-14)

"Let the women learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression."

Thats right it is all the women's fault and you better shut up about it.


I Corinthians 14:34-35

"Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."


Better not speak in church woman...it is shameful.

Ephesians 5:21-24

“Wives, be submissive to your husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is head of the wife as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. As the church is subject to Christ, so let wives also be subject in everything to their husbands.”

Yup be submissive to your husbands...

Revelation 14:3-4

“No one could learn that song except the hundred and forty-four thousand who had been redeemed from the earth. It is these who have not defiled themselves with women, for they are chaste…”

Men think you will be one of the ones saved during the apocalypse? only If you are a virgin...cos women are dirty and evil..pfft.

Plenty more btw.

Now I do believe Jesus did try to elevate women but the Christian Religion mostly ignored it, Still they are not as high in the clergy as men.
So how can you follow something that has repressed women for century's? and still does btw.

a reply to: boymonkey74

That was from the old testament "The Torah" that is nothing more than a history and laws of Judaism.......Something Christians need to take notice of IMO. That's why there is the NEW Testament.

Religion and it's laws are mired in hypocrisy. Take the good from it and shed the things that are ridiculous.

No need to lose sleep over it....

Religion continues to exist because it targets children. Since babies they are taught about religion. It becomes their reality and they accept it.

To me Islam is one of the religions that represses women the most. But we see many women who follow Islam today. I think mostly because they might be killed if they try to leave. But this is how they make make women follow Islam:

a reply to: seeker1963

Some are from the new testament....thing is many take the whole bible as the word of God and none of it untrue.
So cherry pick? yeah I have seen that many times when Christians attack gay people.

a reply to: danielsil18

I agree good thing that some women are waking up...look at what is happening in Iran with the My Stealthy Freedom FB page.
Many are taking off their Hijabs to be free.

www.bbc.co.uk...

You know it's funny, but our marriage, which is almost 20 years old, falls into the pattern of me being the so-called submissive wife just naturally, and it works very well. He's the captain, and I'm the navigator. In any partnership, there is going to be one leader, one decision maker. In our case, that's my husband, and I'm fine with that because I trust that he considers me and our son the same way that Christ would. Think about how Christ acted and behaved toward people. To consider others in a Christlike manner means to not behave in a selfish manner and take them into consideration always and their needs before your own.

So, I submit to his decisions, but I trust he will submit his needs before our own in kind.

Also, I know him. He asks my opinion before making decisions. I said I'm the navigator, right? It's true. I do all the research, lay out the options, before he makes the call. We're buying a car or TV? I'm the one doing the research on what the best buys are and where we can find them. Going on a trip? I plan the route; he drives.

Also, most women are more emotional in nature. Emotion is not a good quality to have dominant in a leader. It just isn't.

a reply to: ketsuko

Admirable but is that because of religion or just natural progression?

My first marriage I was suppose to do all the manly things, but not allowed to be a man! I think we can safely say that men and women in this day and age can often switch roles?

If it works for a couple then who cares?

Again, I think you and your husband have a natural and healthy relationship. If you think religion has a part then fine, but I think you two might also just have the "soul mate" factor and it works?

Anyhow, we are all different. What works for some, might not work or be the answers for others....

a reply to: seeker1963

I think the point of the verse is that one is supposed to be the helpmate of the other. We were designed to be complimentary, two halves of a whole.

I'm sure there are other partnerships where it works the other way, but I'll bet the division falls out similar - one leads and other advises. If you have two people trying to take control, there will be friction. There has to be some working in tandem at least.

a reply to: boymonkey74

It's the same way that most people think our government has their best interests in mind.
People just want to belong to a group that gives them a feeling of safety or power (not actual safety or power).

originally posted by: boymonkey74

Oh, do you mean submission as in slavery? Nope, no Christian woman is supposed to be a slave. Maybe that works in other religions, but not ours.

Christian women, if they are being repressed, it isn't what Christianity teaches. I see you aren't quite keen on middle and near eastern cultural practices, which are still be carried out today, there.

The thing about paying the girl's father meant that the father could say no and then the man would be killed. See how that works? The cultural context of those times meant that if you raped a girl, then you had to compensate for it, much like today, you go to jail today for it. But they didn't have jails back then.

And the girl had the right to say no. I see how you conveniently left those verses out.

So here's the idea, raping a girl meant that you forcibly took from her a valuable thing, her virginity and future prospects of more honorable marriage. Virginity was valuable, and still is for some people. To raping her takes away from the dignity of her person, which means you are liable, which means if you stole a future from her, you are required to recompense. Do you understand what that meant, in a cultural context?

But if her father said no, or she said no, then man, you got stoned to death, simple as that. And if you got her pregnant, then you were responsible to take care of the child you made.

Amazing how you people just don't know these things.

Submission to your husband, but your husband only, not every man out there because he's a man, doesn't mean to be a slave. Submission means that you are willing to be a helpmeet, and the Christian man is to be the protector and provider and the one that covers her.

"Husbands, love your wives as Christ loves the church and gave His life for it". The Christian husband is to give his very life for his wife, if need be. That means you take the vow to give up other women, your parents and everything you think that makes you manly, like bachelorhood trysts, give it up for her.

Husbands, love your wives as you do your own body, for no man who loves his body refuses to give it nourishment" which means you love your wife that you make sure she is taken care of.

Your buddies, are they still more important than your wife?

Your mother, is she still more important than your wife?

Your former habits, are they still more important than your wife?

Your looking at other women, are they more important than the beauty of your wife?

You took the vow, live up to it. That's what the Christian husband does.

Somehow, it is always the wives who gets the sermons, though. If my husband were to one day say he would convert to Islam, then he is no longer faithful to the vow he made to God, and he broke the marriage contract, because the Christian marriage is a covenant, from the covenant God performed for Adam and Eve, in the Garden. Once he goes against the God he vowed before, and denies the Christ that he professed, he no longer is my covering.

Let the unbelieving depart, I would no longer be bound to him. Simple as that.

Traditional Christian vows are this...

Dearly beloved, we are gathered together here in the sight of God and in the face of this company, to join together this Man and this Woman in the bonds of Holy Matrimony; which is an honorable estate instituted by God, signifying the mystical union between Christ and His Church. Christ approved marriage by His first miracle at the marriage of Cana.
The Apostle Paul commended marriage to be honorable among all. Marriage is to be entered into reverently, discreetly, advisedly, soberly and in the presence of God. Into this Holy Estate these two present come now to be joined.
If any man can show cause, why they may not lawfully be joined together, let him speak now or else hereafter hold his peace.
VOWS:
If you, _ __, and you, _ __, have freely and deliberately chosen each others as partners for life, would you please join your right hands.

_, will you have this woman to be your wedded wife; will you love her, honor and keep her in sickness as in health, in poverty as in wealth, and forsaking all others, keep thee only unto her so long as you both shall live?

_ , will you have this man to be your lawfully wedded husband? Will you love him, honor and keep him in sickness as in health, for richer, for poorer, and forsaking all others, keep thee only unto him so long as you both shall live?

, please repeat after me, I, .... take thee, . to be my wedded wife... to have and to hold... from this day forward...for better, for worse.... for richer, for poorer.... in sickness and in health.... to love and cherish... ’til death do us part.

_, please repeat after me, I, _... take thee, .... to be my wedded husband... to have and to hold... from this day forward...for better, for worse.... for richer, for poorer.... in sickness and in health.... to love, cherish, and obey... "till death do us part.

EXCHANGING OF RINGS

May I have the rings, please? A ring has been for centuries the token of love and the symbol of marital union. This is because a ring has no end and true love has no end. The Scripture tells us that Redemption, through Christ’s death and resurrection, has put us in the church and brought us into a relationship with Jesus Christ. The Church is the Bride of Christ and His love for the Church never ends and nothing can ever separate Jesus from those he loves.

_, as you give this ring to you are saying, " I love you with a love that has no end like this ring and with a love so strong that I would die for you as Christ did for His Bride." To symbolize that love would you take this beautiful ring and place it upon the third finger of the left hand? As you do, you will give it to her because you love her, and she will wear it to show the world her love for you as her life shows her love for Christ.

Now, , you are saying, " , I , too want to show my love, and I show you that love by placing this ring upon your finger. I give my life, my love, and my heart and as in love I submit unto the Lord, my Savior, I submit in love unto you, my husband." In so doing would you please place the ring upon the third finger of his left hand? You will give it to him because you love him, and _, you will wear it as your commitment to and your willingness to sacrifice all for her, as Christ

a reply to: ketsuko

Here's a parallel comparison that might shock you ketsuko, but it totally backs up your captain and navigator concept. As some if you know, I am gay and I have a partner that I've been with for 8 1/2 years now.

If you can get past the 'Eww gross, gay' thing, you might start to ask yourself how on earth 2 guys can stay together that long. The answer is simple; just like in your example, one of us is the captain and the other is navigator. I'm the decision maker in our relationship and my partner provides me with the platform and guidance to make those decisions. He doesn't like making tough calls because well, he just likes someone else to decide, but when a call is made he'll put all his energy into it.

The bible says that the man is boss, but in reality it's the woman who wears the pants in any relationship. There is a lot of truth in the old saying 'when your woman is happy, you are happy, when she is not happy, your life is hell' The same principle applies to my relationship, just replace the word woman with partner.

I think whoever wrote those passages was just kidding himself. Maybe he had an ultra bossy wife

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: danielsil18

I agree good thing that some women are waking up...look at what is happening in Iran with the My Stealthy Freedom FB page.
Many are taking off their Hijabs to be free.

www.bbc.co.uk...

But that isn't Christianity.

I thought this was about Bible Believing Christian wives.

And a Christian woman should not be joined in covenant with a Muslim man, that's just silly. Do not be unequally yoked, it just leads to a lot of heartache.

a reply to: ketsuko

I admire you for coming into what appears to be another Christian-bashing thread and answering in a peaceful and calm manner.

I also applaud you and your husband for having such a strong and healthy marriage! My wife and I are only on a year and a half so we have a ways to go.

I have always liked the scripture in the New Testament where Christ teaches by their fruits ye shall know them. I hope most Christians you know are kind hearted individuals or families who look to serve others and be kind to whomever they meet. Of course there are groups who look to stay in the spotlight and give us a bad name.

Sometimes people look past the mark and focus too much on the do's and don'ts. How about we focus on the most important commandment: love.

Even Christ said,

"34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.
35 By this shall all men know that ye are my disciples, if ye have love one to another." (John 13).

a reply to: ArnoldNonymous

Can you at least address the OP...can you refute that the bible (also many other holy texts) degrade women and put them below men?
Oh and the religious do not have a monopoly on love you know...

Religion law dominated many cultures throughout history and guess what we made it this far using these laws, not do as thou wilt. We have at least 2000 years of human history to account for using these laws, more if you account the old testament. But, I think that 2000 years is enough to prove that civilizations can function and flourish using these laws.

Why are you so against religion all the time? What do you believe? Why don't the 10 commandments sit right with you?

a reply to: bitsforbytes

Because religion is a cancer and just rules made up by men.
God wouldn't repress women...only man would.
If people think the Bible is the word of God they have to agree with the passages above.
The 10 commandments should be 6 because 4 of them are obviously just made up to keep people in the religious club by instilling fear.
The rest (6) are obvious and even Atheists know these things are wrong....morals do not come from any book they come from within.
Oh and fight against all religion because it attacked me first...in real life and here on ATS.
If it was just in Church and homes I wouldn't care but when It is pushed into government, schools and my face I push back.

a reply to: ketsuko

Great good for you sounds like a partnership but that is nothing like what the Bible is saying.
You shouldn't have any say in things you should be quiet and submissive...not a partnership like you have described.
Do you think the Bible as the word of God?
Like I said Jesus attempted to elevate women to be equals to men but the people who wrote the Bible had other ideas.

originally posted by: boymonkey74
a reply to: ArnoldNonymous

can you refute that the bible degrade women and put them below men?

What you have done is a classic case of cherry picking from the bible. Religious fundamentalists often make the same mistake by taking pieces of scripture to present unbalanced arguments.

Here are some of the things the bible says in support of women

Ephesians 5:25 ESV / 91 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her,
Colossians 3:19 ESV / 59 Husbands, love your wives, and do not be harsh with them.

1 Peter 3:7 ESV / 58 h Likewise, husbands, live with your wives in an understanding way, showing honor to the woman as the weaker vessel, since they are heirs with you of the grace of life, so that your prayers may not be hindered.

1 Corinthians 13:4-8 ESV / 58 Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.

Ephesians 5:25-28 ESV / 55 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself.

1 Corinthians 7:1-40 ESV / 45 Now concerning the matters about which you wrote: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.” But because of the temptation to sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband. The husband should give to his wife her conjugal rights, and likewise the wife to her husband. For the wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does. Likewise the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does. Do not deprive one another, except perhaps by agreement for a limited time, that you may devote yourselves to prayer; but then come together again, so that Satan may not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.

Source

All you have truthfully shown is that the bible is contracdictory and that you need to read everything in it's full context to understand what is actually meant.

a reply to: markosity1973

Bang on it is contradictory and I fail to understand how people can say it is the word of God.
The thing is in that people have used it against women since its inception.
It isn't just the Bible btw many religions have painted women as dirty, sinful and below men.
Maybe instead of the Bible in my heading I should have put religious instead.


Hitch is better than me explaining it.

a reply to: boymonkey74

It is impossible for humans to imagine what they have never experienced consciously or unconsciously.

How did we imagine God if we can't imagine what we don't know? Where did we get that knowledge from?