MH370 missing (Part 2)

reply to post by roadgravel


There are no resources being "wasted". The planes would have been flying similar missions regardless, and the ships would have been sailing anyway.

reply to post by Imagewerx


At least one expert has said that the frequency will start to shift as the batteries die.

Zaphod58
reply to post by roadgravel

 

There are no resources being "wasted". The planes would have been flying similar missions regardless, and the ships would have been sailing anyway.

If that is the case, I have to wonder why a few dozen ships and helicopters are out on "day cruises" to enjoy the scenery, every day of the year. I mean seriously, they are flying and sailing similar missions looking for..... what? And on whose dime?

This SRO has a specific purpose and mandate, which is to find MH370, not just any old plane or ship. What you have espoused in the above statement is that they're out there all the time, burning fuel and paying hundreds of people to look at the pretty waves and whales, but there may be a crash someplace they are unaware of that needs searching.

Cheers - Dave

Zaphod58
reply to post by Imagewerx

 

At least one expert has said that the frequency will start to shift as the batteries die.

That is very true, but also the output wattage will also drop. If you started with a say a 24vdc battery supply and your crystal circuit ran on a regulated 12vdc supply that was sub regulated with a 9.1vdc Zener diode, then you would probably be able to use 95% of the battery power to generate a stable frequency. The problem is the output drive for the transmitter which if on a regulated source will probably last to 90% battery depletion. You will see a drop in effective output amplitude before the output frequency drifts.

Cheers - Dave

reply to post by bobs_uruncle


Not at all, but they don't sit at a pier, or parked on a ramp if they're not searching for a missing plane. The ships would be out sailing somewhere regardless of if they were searching for this plane or not. The P-8s would still be in Japan, but they'd still be flying missions daily if they were looking for the plane or not.

Zaphod58
reply to post by Imagewerx

 

At least one expert has said that the frequency will start to shift as the batteries die.

Are these the "experts" who live by the tagline at the bottom of all my posts? If these pingers are crystal controlled (I'm only guessing they are as radio transmitters will always be locked to a precise frequency in this way),then once the circuit is locked to an exact frequency by the quartz crystal,it cannot possibly oscillate at any other frequency.This is dictated by how the crystal is cut and will always be the same irrespective of supply voltage.In fact they will always operate at well below battery voltage through a regulator,so that even as the battery output voltage starts to drop,the important parts of the transmitter will still get the voltage they need to work properly.The only thing that can make a quartz crystal alter from it's desired frequency is temperature,but I would hope they'd compensate for that knowing that these devices would need to operate on the seabed where it's going to be kinda chilly for a very long time.

Of course if they're not crystal controlled,they could possibly drift off frequency a little bit,and knowing this they'd have to use wider band receivers when looking for them.But a shift of over 10% in this case is still more than I'd expect from a professionally made device like this.

a reply to: Imagewerx

These are experts that design and test the recorders.

Hi all just loggin in to stage 2 of the little mystery, better writting block aswel.

a reply to: Zaphod58
They need to design them a bit better in that case! Actually I've just read that some models of pingers have user selectable frequency,so maybe this one (if not fixed) was set to 33 KHz by mistake?

a reply to: Imagewerx

It's possible. They've been trying to extend the life of the pingers to 90 days for several years now. They need to set them to a frequency that only the pingers will use to ensure that when they hear them they know it's them and nothing else.

a reply to: Zaphod58

180 days for the extended life version of the Teledyne Benthos,and can transmit between 25 and 40 KHz in 0.5 KHz increments.......

www.benthos.com...

a reply to: Imagewerx

The companies that make them have pingers that go much longer than 90 days, but they're trying to get the FAA to mandate 90 days. That will keep costs somewhat down as they're replaced, but still give a good life for them.

I just found this was anyone aware of this? It appears that this very 777 was involved in a substantial collision back on:
Date: 09-AUG-2012
Time: 16:40

If you knew your plane had this incident would you step on board?

Aviation Safety

Owner/operator: Malaysia Airlines
Registration: 9M-MRO
C/n / msn: 28420/404
Fatalities: Fatalities: 0 / Occupants: 263
Other fatalities: 0
Airplane damage: Substantial
Location: Shanghai-Pudong Intl AP (ZSPD) - China
Phase: Taxi
Nature: International Scheduled Passenger
Departure airport: Shanghai-Pudong Intl AP (ZSPD)
Destination airport: Kuala Lumpur
Narrative:
A taxiing Malaysia Airlines Boeing 777 passenger plane (9M-MRO), flight MH389, contaced the tail of a China Eastern Airlines A340 plane, B-6050, waiting on the taxiway at Pudong International Airport.No one was injured.

The tip of the wing of the Malaysia Airlines Boeing 777 was broken off and hung on the tail of the China Eastern Airbus 340-600, according to pictures posted by passengers on the Internet.

The very same plane went missing on March 8, 2014 while on a flight from Kuala Lumpur to Beijing,

a reply to: whatnext21

I would. Manufacturers are very careful about performing those repairs after JAL 123.

a reply to: whatnext21

As long as they didn't repair the broken wing tip with Gaffer tape and lolly sticks and it's been inspected and granted air worthiness once more,then yes I'd be happy to fly on it.

a reply to: Zaphod58

So I assume that this is known then? There are a lot of pages in the original thread and not sure if it was there or not.

a reply to: whatnext21

Someone mentioned it early in the thread I think. I don't remember exactly what was said about it, but I'm pretty sure it was brought up at some point.

a reply to: anon72

Maybe this will help?

Another aircraft form Malaysia airline which was about 30 minutes ahaed of MH370 contacted the plane and the copilot responded, this was after 01:30, so atleast 8 or 9 minutes after it had vanished from radar.
This has been the last contact with flight370.

Personally, i think they followed the planned route and were flying above Vietnam when they decided to turn back because of problems with the plane.
While they were heading back to KL they passed out (hypoxia) and the aircraft flew on in a southerly direction until fuel starvation which brings it close to where the Chinese vessel picked up the first signals from the black box.

No BB will be recovered or even if there is one its probably fake or what is reported is not whats on it!
No plane, no debris, no floating anything which is F in impossible = Hoodwinkers!!
Said this 350 pages ago!!

What I find interesting is that there was 'garbled' transmission from the tower before they lost contact, this could have been the beginning of their problems...
Aviation Safety.net
I found this somewhere on that site, not sure where...sorry

MAS 370 (Kuala Lumpur to Beijing)
PILOT-ATC RADIOTELEPHONY TRANSCRIPT
Departure from KLIA: 8 March 2014
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ATC DELIVERY
12:25:53 MAS 370 Delivery MAS 370 Good Morning
12:26:02 ATC MAS 370 Standby and Malaysia Six is cleared to Frankfurt
via AGOSA Alpha Departure six thousand feet squawk two
one zero six
12:26:19 ATC ... MAS 370 request level
12:26:21 MAS 370 MAS 370 we are ready requesting flight level three five zero
to Beijing
12:26:39 ATC MAS 370 is cleared to Beijing via PIBOS A Departure Six
Thousand Feet squawk two one five seven
12:26:45 MAS 370 Beijing PIBOS A Six Thousand Squawk two one five seven,
MAS 370 Thank You
12:26:53 ATC MAS 370 Welcome over to ground
12:26:55 MAS 370 Good Day

LUMPUR GROUND
12:27:27 MAS 370 Ground MAS370 Good morning Charlie One Requesting push
and start
12:27:34 ATC MAS370 Lumpur Ground Morning Push back and start
approved Runway 32 Right Exit via Sierra 4.
12:27:40 MAS 370 Push back and start approved 32 Right Exit via Sierra 4 POB
239 Mike Romeo Oscar
12:27:45 ATC Copied

12:32:13 MAS 370 MAS377 request taxi.
12:32:26 ATC MAS37..... (garbled) ... standard route. Hold short Bravo
12:32:30 MAS 370 Ground, MAS370. You are unreadable. Say again.
12:32:38 ATC MAS370 taxi to holding point Alfa 11 Runway 32 Right via
standard route. Hold short of Bravo.
12:32:42 MAS 370 Alfa 11 Standard route Hold short Bravo MAS370.

12:35:53 ATC MAS 370 Tower
12:36:19 ATC (garbled) ... Tower ... (garbled)
MAS 370 1188 MAS370 Thank you

LUMPUR TOWER
12:36:30 MAS 370 Tower MAS370 Morning
12:36:38 ATC MAS370 good morning. Lumpur Tower. Holding point..
[garbled]..10 32 Right
12:36:50 MAS 370 Alfa 10 MAS370

12:38:43 ATC 370 line up 32 Right Alfa 10.
MAS 370 Line up 32 Right Alfa 10 MAS370.
12:40:38 ATC 370 32 Right Cleared for take-off. Good night.
MAS 370 32 Right Cleared for take-off MAS370. Thank you Bye.
LUMPUR APPROACH
12:42:05 MAS 370 Departure Malaysian Three Seven Zero
12:42:10 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero selamat pagi identified. Climb
flight level one eight zero cancel SID turn right direct to
IGARI
12:42:48 MAS 370 Okay level one eight zero direct IGARI Malaysian one err
Three Seven Zero
12:42:52 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero contact Lumpur Radar One
Three Two Six good night
MAS 370 Night One Three Two Six Malaysian Three Seven Zero
LUMPUR RADAR (AREA)
12:46:51 MAS 370 Lumpur Control Malaysian Three Seven Zero
12:46:51 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero Lumpur radar Good Morning
climb flight level two five zero
12:46:54 MAS370 Morning level two five zero Malaysian Three Seven Zero
12:50:06 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero climb flight level three five zero
12:50:09 MAS370 Flight level three five zero Malaysian Three Seven Zero
01:01:14 MAS370 Malaysian Three Seven Zero maintaining level three five zero
01:01:19 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero
01:07:55 MAS370 Malaysian...Three Seven Zero maintaining level three five
zero
01:08:00 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero
01:19:24 ATC Malaysian Three Seven Zero contact Ho Chi Minh 120
decimal 9 Good Night
01:19:29 MAS370 Good Night Malaysian Three Seven Zero
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
# end of file/BIT 30 March #