Police Shoot and Kill Man for Watering Lawn

greencmp
reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy

 

This is just too common, 12 rounds no less.

I believe we may have to consider passing legislation to disarm them in our towns at least then we can talk about cities.

I have some ideas for replacing the existing police system with civilians in a jury duty model.

edit on 9-4-2014 by greencmp because: (no reason given)

pepper spray
tasers
overwhelming numbers on just about ANY call
batons
beanbag rounds
pepper rounds

tell me again, WHY do they need firearms?

perhaps have one in the trunk that they reach for AFTER attempts with other tools not adequate. Last i checked, the cops dont have a robe to judge, or an electric chair to be executioner, QUIT GIVING THEM THE POWER!!

reply to post by AngryCymraeg


Sorry but I find that hard to believe.

Supposedly there were quite a few police. He didn't know the police were there? I doubt they all arrived in one car.

Are you trying to tell me the guy had no chance to comply. Not buying it for one second.

I've said many times in my previous posts I believe the police used excessive force and didn't need to kill the guy but I think he was partly to blame.

He was drunk and high ,look at the autopsy report.

There are always two sides.

minusinfinity
reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy

 

All I can say is I'm sorry I voiced my opinion.

In the future I will follow the flock and behave as a mindless drone.

In your ultimate wisdom the members of ATS have convinced me that all police and every section of all the governments of the world are evil entities.

I thank you.

There was a time I held my own beliefs and thought for myself. It is so much easier to "go with the flow".

Your opinion was countered by fact. Generally, when the point your making is countered, you either come up with a rational counterpoint or you concede and leave the debate a little bit wiser. You have done neither, instead responding with more nonsense that displays you have not taken the time to formulate a sensible response.

Look, I get that it's the internet and nobody really cares; however, if you're going to participate in a debate, online or offline, at least try to obtain some kind of understanding of what is being discussed before interjecting with your opinion.

Many of the initial points you raised had already been countered in the article. Most of what you posted after that had been addressed, and thus countered, by posters before you.

Again I'll ask you, why do you champion the police? Granted not all cops are terrible people, and in fact many of them are decent folks, there are so many outstanding cases of rampant corruption and abuse of power. The evidence speaks for itself; a good cop seems to be the odd one out.

Well the majority of cops operate from two mindsets. The first mindset which I believe fits large percentage of cops in the force is the disorder of sociopathy. They just love the power, control and will do things just to re-assert such. The first mindset gets a thrill in seeing people squirm, and respond to their perceived power. They are fueled by adrenaline and perceive any resistance, or rather not resistance, but reaction as a threat to the authority bestowed upon them through the taxpayers dollar (it's not even their authority, it's ours).

The second mindset suffers from a diminished sense of personal power during childhood and adolescence and a need to regain that. But in the process of restoring it, they distort the true attributes of personal power and instead they over-compensate by becoming authoritative assholes with identity issues.They find this identity in the police force, and they merge with it. They are no longer human. They are now part of collective and in being part of that collective force, they isolate themselves from the people to which they refer as 'civilians'.

The second mindset forget that the people pays their bills (the first one knows and doesn't care). So in essence, they work for us. That is not their thought process though. They believe us to serve them when they express their belligerence. Rarely do you find a cop who is truly in the force to 'protect and serve'. And with the militarization of police, that number will diminish tremendously.

The government of this era does not want thinking, sensitive, rational human beings. They want automated robots that will surrender to the will of the highest bidder. They will push legislation to support this, and if you deny the enactment of such, they will rewrite, revise it, or hide it in another bill to get it passed.


"Ah, America" - Peter Griffin

I used to be adventurous and take walks down unexplored streets. Just to check out the scenery and enjoy the fresh air. Often I would be carrying my black cell phone in hand...

Not any more. I might be confronted by irritated cops, or scared citizens "standing their ground". Every one is FAR too up tight here in Cali.

minusinfinity
reply to post by AngryCymraeg

 

Sorry but I find that hard to believe.

Supposedly there were quite a few police. He didn't know the police were there? I doubt they all arrived in one car.

Are you trying to tell me the guy had no chance to comply. Not buying it for one second.

I've said many times in my previous posts I believe the police used excessive force and didn't need to kill the guy but I think he was partly to blame.

He was drunk and high ,look at the autopsy report.

There are always two sides.

Round objects. He had a hose, was sitting down and was not a threat in any way. They turned up, did not identify themselves and unloaded 12 rounds into him. How could he possibly been partly to blame?

reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy


Fair response.

I don't feel most of my points have been proven wrong. Most of the replies have been opinionated nonsense.

The reason I back the police is because I have provided factual evidence the person was more than inebriated. If he wasn't then how was he unaware of the police presence? Why didn't he comply with police orders? If he had been sober I bet he would have been more compliant.

Some have said the police just open fired but if you're as intelligent as you seem you know that is just nonsense. I agree the police should have used less than lethal force, if the gentleman had complied than chances are he would be alive and this would be a non factor.

minusinfinity
reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy

 

Okay I did a quick search and discovered that this happened in 2010. Why are you posting this four years after it happened?

The family of a man fatally shot by Long Beach police in 2010 was awarded $6.5 million in damages by a federal jury on Thursday.

ktla.com...

Could it be your source looks for anything in the news only to make people angry with the government?

The police were wrong but....

He had a blood-alcohol level of 0.42% and had Valium and THC in his system at the time of his death.

Not saying he deserved to be gunned down but he wasn't just out watering his lawn.

Get the whole story before you jump 2 conclusions.

The bolded section is where I call bs. The odds of not being comatose at .42 BAC without the valium and THC coursing through your system are slim. With the added drugs on top of it you'd have better odds of winning the powerball and getting struck by lightening at the same time. Sounds like someone from up high ordered a little fudging of the autopsy to vindicate the po-po's.

Some info on alcohol poisoning:

BAC .30 percent
You’re probably in a stupor. You have little comprehension of where you are or what’s really going on around you. You may suddenly pass out and be difficult to awaken.
BAC .35 percent
This blood alcohol concentration is similar to the physical effects of surgical anesthesia. You may stop breathing.
BAC .40 percent to .50 percent
You are probably in a coma. The nerve centers controlling your heartbeat and respiration are slowing down, and it’s a miracle if you survive.
Scientists use the term “lethal dose” (LD) to describe the blood alcohol concentration that produces death from alcohol poisoning in half the population. Most authorities agree that BACs in the 0.40 percent to 0.50 percent range meet the requirement. Since studies of lethal dosage cannot be empirically tested in the laboratory, scientists estimate the LD for alcohol from post-mortem cases in which alcohol poisoning was the primary cause of death. Cases of fatal overdoses from alcohol at BACs lower than 0.40 percent have been documented, as have cases of survivors at BACs higher than 0.50 percent. To place this in perspective, a 100-pound woman or man who consumed nine to 10 standard drinks in less than one hour would be in the lethal dose range.

Source

reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy

Text these cops should be behind bars. Punishing tax-payers for the negligence and aggressiveness of cops is NOT a solution.

Well stated there. I am embarresed to know that people in more civilized Countries are reading these stories.

-Alien

reply to post by minusinfinity


Likewise, one year after the incident was settled in a civil court. The date on the KTLA article is 4/5/13. The OP's article doesn't look to be any of the more current postings by the site in question so I'm guessing that it's something they stumbled across that was actually an older story for the site. Overall, it is a dredging up of an old story with the last update being in April of 2013.

As far as the blood alcohol, valium and THC, the insertion of that was actually interesting to me in the KTLA article. Despite KTLA thinking it was relevant to the case, it apparently was deemed relevant by the courts as they awarded the man's family that $6.5 million settlement. Getting drunk and watering one's lawn isn't against the law last I checked unless there is a prohibition against drinking and watering that I haven't heard about.

reply to post by minusinfinity

The reason I back the police is because I have provided factual evidence the person was more than inebriated. If he wasn't then how was he unaware of the police presence? Why didn't he comply with police orders? If he had been sober I bet he would have been more compliant.

So since he did comply, shoot him.........
He wasn't under arrest, he didn't have to comply to any command.
What about that part?

ETA:

I agree the police should have used less than lethal force, if the gentleman had complied than chances are he would be alive and this would be a non factor.

Or if the cops used any sense at ALL this would be a non factor

These cops should have gone to jail and judged by a jury of the people they "serve and protect"

reply to post by hogstooth


Exactly. He was probably either passed out or close to it when thd police arrived on scene. Especially if he was sitting down and slumped over which has been established. In fact it looks like the police showed up, didn't get a response from him and just shot him, because he was probably passed out.

6.5 million, that buys a lot of amnesia

reply to post by strawburry


You think so? You think that money, or anything can fill this gaping horror?

What a telling remark. I'd worry, were I related to you.

To you it does, or you wouldn't have dreamed of making such a statement; not even in a nightmare does this have any truth in it.

Money cannot even buy love, let alone bring back loss of life. I suggest a spiritual retreat. A long one.

# 224

Krazysh0t
reply to post by hogstooth

 

Exactly. He was probably either passed out or close to it when thd police arrived on scene. Especially if he was sitting down and slumped over which has been established. In fact it looks like the police showed up, didn't get a response from him and just shot him, because he was probably passed out.

LMAO!!!!!

The only reason I'm replying is because you did make me smile.

Please tell me you're joking.

Do you really think police walk up to unconscious people and shoot them?!?

You need help.

I can't visit ATS once without reading about some psychopathic cop killing a defenseless child, teenager, grandma or dog..

EVERY SINGLE TIME I visit this site there's another case of police officers gunning down some poor civilian in cold blood, and always getting away with it too.

When will this madness end?

I long for a time in the future when all these murderers are prosecuted, throw the book at them, look them away forever, torture them for years, I don't care, I really don't. No special treatment, lock them up with the baddest gangbangers around and pass them around. That is what they deserve.

And I pray that something happens because this is so out of control it's frankly getting ridiculous.

I hope the American people don't forget about this, I hope that justice will be served, and it will be, in this life or the next.
They will be accounted for.

I just hope I'll be around to see it. The fall of this psychopathic police state.

I am with you, in mind and in spirit.

I suggest making a small, tactical, bulletproof glass shield standard issue. It would afford first responding officers time to issue a drop your weapon order in these scenario's. Vitals would be covered between vest and shield. The officers weapon could still be drawn using the opposite hand. Really would be no excuse to shoot first without asking questions/orders. Would probably also ease officers tension without fear of being headshotted. If it became cumbersome or unneeded for some reason it could simply be dropped. Only downside would be cost of deployment and diminished shooting stance.

That 6.5 Million $$$ payout could have probably fronted the bill for national deployment.

I know I'm going to be hated, but the video states nowhere he was watering his lawn, he was just holding the water nozzle alone, which in a quick minute looks like a gun. I think the LEOs were right in this, what if it was a REAL GUN, and he turned and opened fire on the officers.
We might could be saying let's ban the guns! A drunk and stoned person had access to one!

HomerinNC
I know I'm going to be hated, but the video states nowhere he was watering his lawn, he was just holding the water nozzle alone, which in a quick minute looks like a gun. I think the LEOs were right in this, what if it was a REAL GUN, and he turned and opened fire on the officers.
We might could be saying let's ban the guns! A drunk and stoned person had access to one!

So it is ok to shoot some one because you can't make out what is in their hand and they don't want to listen to you?
"Whoa he is turning around, not listening and something is in his hand, shoot!! He might kill us all!"
Are they really that scared of every one? Should they be cops if they are scared all the time?
Or they should give cops non lethal ways of dealing with things....

Seems established that he was sitting down and almost slumped over, which would go right with the 0.42, diazepam( he wasn't buying brand) and THC.
Seems like 3 men could take care of him with their hands rather easy, I am 5'8 5'9 185 on a good day, fought many bigger men then me in the marines, and I am sure one or two of those cops were former military. On top of the hand to hand training they get as officers .

reply to post by HomerinNC

Yeah topic made it sound like he was actually watering the lawn. Was in disbelief until I read the article at ktla.com... . Would like to know if anyone can think of a reason why my shield idea above is bad or not. I mean, it works for Captain America, amiright?


Also not to sound wrong but was this story suppressed? Shocked this is the first time I'm hearing of incident that happened way back in 2010. Seems like it would normally be the kind of thing to spark a lot of controversy.

reply to post by DestroyDestroyDestroy


Once again the jack boots are not held accountable and the tax payer is paying the tab. It goes on and on and on and nobody does anything about it , no cops go to prison. This gives the cops the green light to keep killing people without hesitation because it"s "ok " its acceptable because ya know , citizens are expendable apparently . They are trigger happy irresponsible sociopaths and thats the way the orwellian police state functions.