Mormons Have World's Largest Database on Human Race: Why?

Originally posted by hawkiye


. I did not watch the video but that is not the baptism for the dead.

Does "deny ignorance" mean anything to you? I thought your statement above to be absurd. How would you know it's not the baptism for the dead if you did not watch it to see?

Originally posted by hawkiye
They simply believe the deceased person has an opportunity to accept or reject the ritual performed on thier behalf.

And that makes sense to you? How does the dead person let someone know of their rejection of the ritual? Do they rattle chains or something?

Originally posted by hawkiye
Although I do think they will refrain if a family requests it.

And do they notify the immediate family of the deceased to let them know they are going to baptize Uncle Joe as a Mormon so he can get to heaven? Do they even give the family an opportunity to know that they are taking liberties to do such a thing? Apparently not. Did you even watch the video of Pres. Obama's mother being baptized in Mormon ritual posthumously ----without anyone's permission? I think these actions show a lot of gall as well as infringe on the rights and freedom of religion of others.

A lot of their stuff is accessible to the general public. Also, a lot of it is just plain wrong. I was into genealogy for awhile and researched my own family. There any number of trees in their database with erroneous information. There doesn't seem to be any attempt at quality control.

To all of you who may have questions about the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints please go to www.mormon.org. Please do this before posting any false or inaccurate information, or even something you've heard from others.
For instance, we are not required to submit any genealogical info to the Church before we will be accepted as members.

Seems simple enough to me

Pre- internet, pre-global communication people had to record everything on paper (documents)

There was no such thing as a federal government to fully handle any kind of census before a certain date.

Thus, the church (which had a lot more influence then) handled all birth, marriage, death records because as you can probably guess a child is baptized in a church, couple are married in a church, and people hold funerals in a church

This was the status quo untill the late 1800's when the government started doing census records which showed residence, job, children...

However, in keeping with tradition, the church still maintains records for a lot of people as a lot of the above stated (baptisms,weddings,funerals) are all still held in churches.

Once the internet came around and people started wanting to connect with their past with new access to a wealth of material, the church (which is the only record holder) decided to create a website and that's the story

Originally posted by dontreally
Not to mention Joseph Smith was highly influenced by the philosophy of Emmanuel Swedenborg whos writings deal heavily with the idea of a new jerusalem (as well as william blake

Very Very interesting stuff thanks.

Originally posted by TETRA.X
reply to post by Alethea

 

Please don't shoot me for having a different opinion.

The only groups interested in human DNA/Genealogy are the illuminati/Reptilian race.

My humble opinion.

Cooooooooooolllllllllll......

My father always did claim his Momma was a lizard.

reply to post by Alethea

Does "deny ignorance" mean anything to you? I thought your statement above to be absurd. How would you know it's not the baptism for the dead if you did not watch it to see?

Yes unlike you who seems to want to just bash Mormons without knowing a damn thing about them and done no research. Did it ever occur to you that some of us might have some experience in this??? I used to be a Mormon born and raised and participated in these rituals till I found out who I really am. I do not need to watch some uniformed video on the Internet to know what goes on.

And that makes sense to you? How does the dead person let someone know of their rejection of the ritual? Do they rattle chains or something?

Where did I say anything about it making sense or agreeing with it? Once again you seem to just want to use this as a platform to bash and ridicule Mormons or anyone who doesn't share your obvious disdain for them. What do you care if you think it is a bunch of hocus pocus? There are numerous groups and religions that have strange nonsensical rituals, who cares as long as they are not harming anyone?

And do they notify the immediate family of the deceased to let them know they are going to baptize Uncle Joe as a Mormon so he can get to heaven? Do they even give the family an opportunity to know that they are taking liberties to do such a thing? Apparently not. Did you even watch the video of Pres. Obama's mother being baptised in Mormon ritual posthumously ----without anyone's permission? I think these actions show a lot of gall as well as infringe on the rights and freedom of religion of others.

Once again who cares? As I said if you don't believe there is anything too it why are you so concerned about it? Ultimately it is up to uncle Joe not his family isn't it? Oh but wait you don't believe there is anything to it so who gives crap if they want to massage their beliefs with some ritual as a hundred other religions or groups do? Who is it harming? Again you appear to just want to bash and ridicule them instead of understanding their belief... Sigh!

Originally posted by ADUB77
Seems simple enough to me

There was no such thing as a federal government to fully handle any kind of census before a certain date.

You think it's OK just to make up your own story about it as you go along? Your "information" here is erroneous. Even the bible speaks of the census. Don't you know that's why the fairy tale story of Jesus being born in a barn was because Mary and Joseph had to travel to another city to "report themselves" for the census?
The census was established before there ever was a "federal government".

Originally posted by ADUB77
Thus, the church (which had a lot more influence then) handled all birth, marriage, death records....

This was the status quo untill the late 1800's when the government started doing census records which showed residence, job, children...

Totally erroneous information again. Census records go back a lot further than 1800. The problem is...some entities have kept them from us by making sure people got shifted around and split up. Serfs were sent to various countries to settle new lands and their lords still expected a cut of their wages. This is why we are registered as stock when we get a birth certificate = receipt of title.

Originally posted by ADUB77
Once the internet came around and people started wanting to connect with their past with new access to a wealth of material, the church (which is the only record holder) decided to create a website and that's the story

Why should one particular church be "the record holder"? By whose authority has this been done?

I truly wish more data would become available by subscription. Having to willy-nilly order parish records without any clue if the ones you are looking for are yours is insane. Or I could spend tens of thousands of dollars flying to go look at records in person from the various places they MIGHT be. Or hire a multitude of people who aren't as familiar with what I am looking for to not find what is there.

My ancestor's data IS MY DATA. Y'get that, right? What they were is gone and all that is left of it is ME and my family. What was them, the good, the bad, the ugly, is now all mine.

The dead are dead.

Ya can't hide your secrets in a deep enough hole that I might not find them. And when you withhold information which is rightly MINE, as a descendant, I don't give a ratspatootie that ya didn't want me to know that you bonked your great-uncle. Or that you didn't tell my second-cousin that she's actually my half-aunt. Or any number of other goofy crap.

I don't appreciate all the lovely "secrets" nor the "privacy." If you don't want your descendents to find out what sort of crap you got up to, then don't do it. Otherwise, suffer the burden of being dead and not knowing that I dug up with a genetic test that you were a naughty little tramp.

reply to post by Alethea


It is going to be accessible to the public. Just in digital form... Can't you see they are only trying to protect it??
Maybe they feel it is very important to keep record of these things...I bet they think a list of pop record hits for each week is ridiculous... But, it exists!

The seed vault in Sweden is heavily protected like this... Should we all have your form of public accessibility in the seed bank?

"Why is it not accessible to the public" .. It is!! They are simply not going to let us get our grubby mitts all over the hard copies, of their hard work. You could find this same information... For it is, public record. Why should they have an obligation to "show you their work".

Originally posted by hawkiye
Yes unlike you who seems to want to just bash Mormons without knowing a damn thing about them and done no research.

Sounds like someone wants to accuse me of bashing because they don't want to explore the dark side and ask questions. Sounds like ex-members have a hard time with personally examining their own cult.

Originally posted by hawkiye
Once again you seem to just want to use this as a platform to bash and ridicule Mormons or anyone who doesn't share your obvious disdain for them.

Sounds like you are bent and determined to deflect my questions by making statements that appear to be a cult control tactic. No questions allowed! Obey!

Originally posted by hawkiye
What do you care if you think it is a bunch of hocus pocus? There are numerous groups and religions that have strange nonsensical rituals, who cares as long as they are not harming anyone?

You do not consider deception and ulterior motive to be "harmful"?

Originally posted by hawkiye
Once again who cares? As I said if you don't believe there is anything too it why are you so concerned about it? Ultimately it is up to uncle Joe not his family isn't it? Oh but wait you don't believe there is anything to it so who gives crap if they want to massage their beliefs with some ritual as a hundred other religions or groups do? Who is it harming?

You are really squealing, aren't you? Is this subject making you squirm? It appears so. And still, you are insisting that dead uncle Joe is capable of making baptismal decisions after his demise and departure. Cognitive dissonance, much?

Originally posted by hawkiye
Again you appear to just want to bash and ridicule them instead of understanding their belief... Sigh!

"What fellowship has light (truth) with darkness (lies/deception)"

I really do not care about understanding their belief. I want to know how they came to hold all these records and what is their real intention behind it. I want to know why this Masonic group feels a need to know everyone's family history. How do they intend to further use these records. It may appear benevolent on the surface, but many of us have been deceived by religious conjectures enough to know that there is more than what we are being told.



QUESTION:

If you find any of your relatives in this data-base, does that mean they have been involuntarily baptized into the Mormon religion after they died?

reply to post by dontreally


No, the decided to settle there because they knew no one would care. And the built it up into a really nice place.
I've always considered it a reverse of your reason.........the Jewish community returned to Israel, to a place where there wasn't really a whole lot of anything, and made it a really nice place. Now everybody wants it.
I think it was Golda Meir that pointed out the God's chose people are settlled into the only place in the Middle East with no oil. I've always thought that was very funny, in a dry kind of way.

Originally posted by mayabong

Originally posted by dontreally
Not to mention Joseph Smith was highly influenced by the philosophy of Emmanuel Swedenborg whos writings deal heavily with the idea of a new jerusalem (as well as william blake

Very Very interesting stuff thanks.

It is interesting stuff.

I dont believe the hogwash that mormons are told. or the greater christian community for that matter.

Joseph Smith was inspired by the same esoteric substratum that underlies all western christian thought in general. His purpose was to establish a religion. And he did. And he went to the part of the 'new atlantis' which has great meaning and significance to the gnostics.

and im also sure that the records which the mormons have are probably based on the much more ancient records of the Roman empire, probably collected and held by the Vatican.

Geneology, as people should know, is a very serious subject to the elite. Take the torah for instance; or the book of chronicles. You dont think theres a secret record of these things? I wouldnt doubt for a second that the mormons are the caretakers of this knowledge - in their 'new jerusalem'. It is truly no coincidence. The mormons regard the Salt Lake valley as 'the new jerusalem' and this is undoubtedly based on the esoteric writings of Swedenborg, Blake and earlier gnostic writers. Also, the correspondences between this valley, and the jordan rift valley. The great Salt lake and the Dead sea.

Anyways. Im glad someone else finds this interesting.

There is no conspiracy there.

The Mormons got the records in some cases because governments and there agencies no longer wanted to pay for storing 100+ year old records.

The records they store in the mountain are only the master copies of the microfilms. there are other copies around the country.

In a few countries that have been invaded or had a change of government the new government destroyed a lot of records and now the Mormon records are being used to restore the countries birth and death records.

If TEOTWAWKI happens these records may allow the survivors to prove inheritance and other things.

Originally posted by Resurrectio
Why should they have an obligation to "show you their work".

Just like any other biometric identifiers...your heritage is your personal property.

I suppose in going to those sites, people are probably obligated to contribute whatever information they have available and the records continue to grow through this method. Is there some sort of adhesion contract when you sign up that they are allowed to keep and research whatever info and names you contribute? If that's the case, they are not freely releasing info to anyone....they are subtly engaging you in a contract of advantage to use your information in return for allowing you to browse their files.

reply to post by Alethea


The dead rarely "volunteer" for anything.

I can also make you into a FROG. Bippity-Boppity-Boo. No more typing with your webbing now. You are a frog. I said it and REALLY REALLY meant it.

reply to post by Alethea


Wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong, wrong.

Really, please trust a person who has done this, it's not how you describe. It is baptism in water, in a large font, symbolically set upon the backs of 12 oxen. I know, I've done this.
There was nothing in the Temple that was creepy. As I've mentioned in a previous post, it is important and sacred to me. And I don't discuss it, other than to correct errors like you have made. If you were LDS, you would understand.
I can liken it best by talking about someone Mother. Would you like someone to talk about your Mother in a bad or untrue way? No, probably not. Most people hold their Mother as one of the most important people in their life, a sacred bond. If someone told a lie about her, you would correct them. If someone started discussing her as though she was a whore, you would be offended. And who knows about your Mother more than anyone? You, because she is your Mother.
What happens in a Temple is important to us. It is special and sacred. When people tell untruths, like you have, we will correct you. When you start saying bad things, we are offended. We know what goes on there, because we have been there. We have experienced it for ourselves.
You have not. What you said is not true. But, it's not your Church. So it really shouldn't matter.

Just started doing research on my family since this thread came out. Turns out my original french ancestor to louisiana was the leader of the Militia there, and I also found out that I'm related to one of my best friends. Crazy stuff.

I think its time to stop researching, I might find out my ex girlfriends were my cousins or something.

I dated a mormon girl for years and found her beliefs quite strange, from the golden bulls to the
geneology. From what i learned they seem transfixed with the number 144,000 mentioned in the
bible, possibly refering to the twelve tribes of israel and instant ascension.

Originally posted by stars15k

I can liken it best by talking about someone Mother. Would you like someone to talk about your Mother in a bad or untrue way? If someone started discussing her as though she was a whore, you would be offended.

The bible describes the network of religions as The Whore of Babylon. So it makes sense that many refer to "the church" as a feminine (Mother) goddess. Revelation mentions 'the Harlot and her daughters. The daughters have formed a vast system which now controls politics, religions, and commerce.

My object in this thread is not to discuss the particulars of a religion. Some of you seem determined to make it into a doctrinal issue, which it is not.

I believe a lot of strange genealogical experiments took place during the Hitler regime and continued afterward.
I believe that certain genealogical information could be used for future genocide.
I believe that in the past, many families destroyed their records simply because of those dangers. This is true of those descendants of American Indians.

I don't believe these records have been laboriously put together just for our reminiscence. I think this may hold answers as to why "they" want our DNA and biometric confirmations. And I am apprehensive that this may be used to sinister purposes.