N. Korea Crisis - Updated as News come to hand

reply to post by Morgil


Does no one else think it is pathetic that NK has blamed everyone ELSE for their OWN actions? Are these just desperate calls for attention/aid?

Setting all military and past issues aside, does it blow anyone else's mind that NK would even attack SK at this point in time? I can't believe it. With all of the aid and funding sent in by SK/US, I cant believe they have the nerve to attack. What happened to not biting the hand that feeds you?

Top Chinese official makes abrupt visit to S. Korea amid tension over N. Korean attack

SEOUL, Nov. 27 (Yonhap) -- A top Chinese official made a previously unannounced visit to South Korea on Saturday and held talks with Seoul's Foreign Minister Kim Sung-hwan, an official said, amid high tensions over North Korea's deadly artillery strike on a South Korean island earlier this week.

Chinese State Councilor Dai Bingguo, who traveled together with Beijing's chief nuclear negotiator Wu Dawei, discussed Tuesday's attack and six-nation talks on ending Pyongyang's nuclear programs during a dinner meeting with Kim, the foreign ministry official said on condition of anonymity.

Link

Either the Chinese have diffused tensions and are relaying news/apologies from North Korea

or

China have said they do not condemn NK and have made it clear that South Korea must do their utmost to avoid war.

I personally think the latter is more likely. Something along the lines of "don't go ahead with the military drills, if war erupts China may not be held responsible for their actions".

Remember the reports that South Korea had flown propaganda leaflets over North Korea, and we were trying to work out how?

I think I've found the answer:

N.Korea fears balloons

N.Korea fears balloons

SEOUL - WHEN North Korea sent a rain of deadly shells across its border this week, the South retaliated not just with artillery but also a weapon that the hardline regime truly fears - balloons.

According to media reports, Seoul quickly launched a propaganda offensive meant to undermine the iron-fisted rule of Kim Jong Il by sending anti-Pyongyang leaflets on balloons across the heavily fortified border.

'We've released the balloons carrying leaflets as retaliation against the shelling,' a military official was quoted as telling the Joongang Ilbo daily. 'The leaflets contain criticism against Kim Jong Il and the third-generation hereditary succession,' the unnamed official said in reference to the North's expected looming power transfer to Mr Kim's 27-year-old son Jong Un.

Seoul had promised Pyongyang six years ago to halt such psy-ops, or psychological operations, but the South reportedly resumed them after the North stunned it on Tuesday by shelling an island and killing four people. Some 400,000 leaflets denouncing the North's sanctified leadership were floated across the Demilitarised Zone (DMZ) just hours after the North launched a barrage of shells on Yeonpyeong island, the reports said.

More


Some more updates....

Philippines halts workers to S.Korea

Which follow the reports that The Philippines has made plans to evacuate it's citizens from South Korea.



Mullen: North Korea's instability 'could be very dangerous' (Video)

Very interesting that Mullen uses the term "instability" in reference to the situation in North Korea after what I posted in reference to an instability scenario within North Korea's ruling elite.

reply to post by jonny2410


The Chinese Foreign Minister cancelling his trip to Seoul as was reported a few days ago, but a Chinese official still going to Seoul today could suggest a number of reasons.


1) that China did not want to appear to North Korea as sending someone too high-level to Seoul in case North Korea thought at these time of tensions China was making a statement to North Korea of whose side it was taking.


2) China is annoyed with Seoul and showed it by sending a lower level diplomat instead.


3) South Korea's government ministers refused to meet China's foreign minister because they were displeased with China's lack of condemnation for North Korea's actions, which South Korea has reportedly said about China in statements in the aftermath of the incident, and thus China did not send their Foreign Minister in case he was met with shut doors in Seoul.

4) China's Foreign Minister sent a lower official because he himself anticipated he would be busy in Beijing taking and making phone calls to and from Washington, Tokyo, Pyongyang and Seoul. Certainly yesterday it was reported China had been engaged in much communications to calm tensions, and that the Chinese Foreign Minister had spoken to North Korea's ambassador to China face to face.

Russian, Chinese foreign ministers discuss Korean conflict

From the Link:

Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov and Chinese Foreign Minister Yang Jiechi discussed on Saturday the tense situation on the Korean Peninsula and the necessity of not allowing it to escalate, according to a Russian ministry statement.

"It is of utmost necessity not to allow the further escalation of the situation and work toward the creation of conditions to ease the tension in relations between the two Koreas," the statement read.

More


A slightly disconcerting article headline....'Russian, Chinese foreign ministers discuss Korean conflict', but it does seem the Chinese Foreign Minister's phone is ringing hot at the moment.


The Philippines preparations for possible mass evacuations of it's citizens do now appear to be gaining momentum with a request for Japan's aid in doing so. This comes as The Philippines has also stopped it's citizens from travelling to work in South Korea:

Philippines prepares for possible mass evacuation from S. Korea, requests Japan's aid

Philippine President Benigno Aquino has held talks with Japanese Ambassador Makoto Katsura in Manila on the possible immediate evacuation of some 50,000 Filipinos from South Korea to Japan, NHK television reported on Saturday.

President Aquino's concerns come after reports of a U.S. naval task force led by the George Washington nuclear-powered aircraft carrier that will join South Korean warships in naval exercises on November 28-December 1.

More

As I've said before, either The Philippines are just taking safety precautions for their citizens, or they know something we don't.

The news they have now reportedly asked Japan for assistance for a possible evacuation of citizens from South Korea with the South Korean-US naval exercises due to get underway in the coming days, is a development that can either be seen as precautionary planning by the Philippines government, or a sign things are about to take a turn for the worst on the Korean Penninsula.

India has formed two new army divisions - comprising more than 36,000 men - to defend the north-eastern state of Arunachal Pradesh. The remote north-eastern state adjoins China which claims large parts of it. The 56th Division will be based in the nearby state of Nagaland to guard the eastern flank of Arunachal Pradesh from Chinese attack through Burma.

India sending 36,000 troops to china border


The peaces are on the move.

Originally posted by Itzpointless
reply to post by Morgil

 

Does no one else think it is pathetic that NK has blamed everyone ELSE for their OWN actions? Are these just desperate calls for attention/aid?

Setting all military and past issues aside, does it blow anyone else's mind that NK would even attack SK at this point in time? I can't believe it. With all of the aid and funding sent in by SK/US, I cant believe they have the nerve to attack. What happened to not biting the hand that feeds you?

It is SK who is genuinely pathetic in all the stunts it tried to perform. It's like a small fox tries to bully others because it thinks a (paper) tiger stands behind it. This is exactly what SK deserve: a spit right into its ugly face.

NK has not blamed EVERYONE else. NK blamed SK and US for this. And what's wrong with that? SK and US conducted navy drills right beside NK water despite repeated warnings from NK. So what do you think? Some countries in this world have the right to do military exercise in front of other countries' gates? If anyone tried to come to my doorway and threaten me with his big guns, I would put a bullet in his brain without any hesitation.

"With all the aid and funding sent in by SK/US"? You think SK and US "feed" NK? You are trully narcissistic! Why didn't you mention all the pressure SK/US put on NK for it to change? You think you can give someone a candy or two and then keep on bullying him/her? America's carrot-and-club policy has no effects here.

Kim may be mad but what about US? US invaded Iraq and caused millions of deaths for what? WMD? And what are you doing in Afghanistan? Chasing the dead Bin Laden? How many taxpayer dollars does US military spend in the name of "freedom"? Is that the freedom to bully others? In NO WAY you will get your way around that "freedom". In my view, US is the biggest hooligan country in this world.

Peace.

reply to post by killallbullies


wow man,your view.
tell me ,how does the US bully and North Korea doesn't? tell me when the last time the US,in a non warring state,shot thermobaric artillery into Canada or Mexico to get some trade agreement or push a point?
when was the last time the US sank anyones naval vessels with out provocation?
diplomacy is bullying?
So we are at war with Afghanistan and Iraq ,I wouldn't call those bullying but if the rest of the world thinks that then why did dozens of other countries,including Russia now, aid us in those wars?
if you think North Korea is in the right to bully South Korea then I suggest you do some more research on the county and it's regime,the Anti Us stuff is old hat and boring and for the most part I believe untruths put forth but other countries that are the real problems.

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
reply to post by HattoriHanzou

 

Chinese manpack radios have just caught up with the SINCGARS, a radio developed in 1983. The AN/PRC-117 that I used in Afghanistan is above and beyond the older SINCGARS. The PLA have quite abit of catching up to do. By the time they catch up to current systems, we'll have spaceborne troops equipped with active camouflaged powered armored exoskeletons and quantum encryption key based comms doing orbital insertions from transatmospheric vehicles. Sounds like sci fi, but only to those who have no idea what has been going on at DARPA for the past decade. People, especially outside the US military, simply have no idea whats knocking on the military industrial door.

I am aware that officers read Starship Troopers but that is still fiction. The powered exoskeletons have existed for years, the only problem is power. Cost is an issue too. I am also aware of all the neat stuff DARPA does as well as being a radio ham. China's radios certainly are not the whizzy SDR units that we have now, but your contention was that they produce "junk" and that is just not true.

I have worked for years as a defense contractor building whizzy systems that I will not talk about here, so I know the score even better than most of the guys in the military. I know it's important to keep morale up, but let's not get carried away. The word conquers but only if it is the truth.

Originally posted by Itzpointless
howdy all! Just thought I'd throw my two cents in. I disagree with the notion that this could be a false flag. The North has given the South (and the world) plenty of legitimate reasons to attack before, but they have shown impressive restraint. If the desire to attack was that strong, it seems like we would have moved in sooner. Kimmy's insanity, combined with the regime change, is a much more realistic scenario. His ability to tread fine lines (while occasionally crossing them) is legendary. This time he just may have gone too far. The next day or two could be huge, with their current threats and rhetoric about the war games.

This leads me into my question, however. Why on earth are we ignoring their actions? And why are we ignoring their threats to not only destroy SK, but to actually nuke (destroy) the US? Now I know that its a lot of huff and puff, but come on. Didn't we invade Iraq for much less? I don't get why we allow them to continue with this blatant disregard for the safety of other countries (they are actually testing nukes and making threats). It seems like NK is a country we actually SHOULD be focusing on. We have a civil war happening in Mexico, affecting our borders, and NK shelling another country (and threatening much worse), yet do nothing. But we spend billions annually fighting "terrorists", in a war we can never win. Please, someone explain these backwards views to me in a way that I can understand. Apparently I'm not smart enough to get it

.

I know it is popular to portray Kim Jong Il as "insane" but he is not. Please refer to Madeline Albright's account of her dealings with him. Conclusion? He is an ass and a jerk but not insane.

Originally posted by HattoriHanzou

Originally posted by Itzpointless


I know it is popular to portray Kim Jong Il as "insane" but he is not. Please refer to Madeline Albright's account of her dealings with him. Conclusion? He is an ass and a jerk but not insane.

Sounds like he has little man syndrome

1. Luke's Wall / War Pigs

Generals gathered in their masses
Just like witches at black masses
Evil minds that plot destruction
Sorcerers of death's construction
In the fields the bodies burning
As the war machine keeps turning
Death and hatred to mankind
Poisoning their brainwashed minds, oh lord yeah!
Politicians hide themselves away
They only started the war
Why should they go out to fight?
They leave that role to the poor
Time will tell them they are powered minds
Making war just for fun
Treating people just like pawns in chess
Wait 'till their Judgement Day comes, yeah!
Now in darkness, world stops turning
Ashes where their bodies burning
No more war pigs have the power
Hand of God has struck the hour
Day of Judgement, God is calling
Underneath the war pigs crawling
Begging mercy for their sins
Satan, laughing, spreads his wings
Oh, Lord yeah!

After all these years, these word are always valid.....people will never change....war war war war....

From the Korean Herald...

On Saturday, a South Korean official said his government is considering re-defining North Korea as its "main enemy" when the defense ministry publishes its next bi-annual defense white paper -- an ideological issue seen as a gauge of anti-North Korea sentiment among South Koreans.

As far as i know the war games have started or will be commencing in a matter of hours.

Also..

Yonhap reporting China State Councilor Dai Bingguo and top nuke negotiator Wu Dawei held talks with #ROK Foreign Min. Kim Saturday.

Yonhap quotes unnamed #ROK foreign ministry official saying Dai, Wu & Kim had dinner meeting. This is significant. #Koreas

PRC-owned Wen Wei Po: "China will not condemn the DPRK ...shelling" Veiled threat to cancel Hu Jintao US visit over carrier in Yellow Sea.

Wen Wei Po is a state-run chinese newspaper.

PLA Maj Gen Luo Yuan on Yellow Sea: US, ROK “should not take sensitive and provocative military actions at such a sensitive time and place."

yep sounds like we are heading for war nk said they will retaliate any war games


reply to post by jonny2410

Originally posted by modified device
reply to post by killallbullies

 

wow man,your view.
tell me ,how does the US bully and North Korea doesn't? tell me when the last time the US,in a non warring state,shot thermobaric artillery into Canada or Mexico to get some trade agreement or push a point?
when was the last time the US sank anyones naval vessels with out provocation?
diplomacy is bullying?
So we are at war with Afghanistan and Iraq ,I wouldn't call those bullying but if the rest of the world thinks that then why did dozens of other countries,including Russia now, aid us in those wars?
if you think North Korea is in the right to bully South Korea then I suggest you do some more research on the county and it's regime,the Anti Us stuff is old hat and boring and for the most part I believe untruths put forth but other countries that are the real problems.

Wow you, that IS my view. And you gotta do your research first.

Did Canada or Mexico ever carry out any navy exercises right outside of US water without the consent from US? You analogy is ridiculous. "Diplomacy is bullying"? Oh hell yes! Haven't you heard of Gunship Diplomacy? Isn't that what US has been doing? So doing navy exercise at other nations gates despite their warnings is not provocation?? You are using thug's philosophy here, like: "Yeah, I am pissing on your lawn and you shall do nothing to me. If you do, you are the one to provocate a fight." Right. Now come and do that on my lawn and I'll make sure you never do that again.

US is at WAR with Iraq and Afghanistan? You are truly amazing. Did any of these two country declared war to US? You wouldn't call those bullying? Then tell me what is bullying? I guess truth is up for you to define, huh? SK is angry and weeping over the bombardment, but does it ever contemplate about NK's warnings? Who did the navy exercise in the first place?

Anti-US? Sure. If anyone says anything bad about US, they are anti-US? Either you are with US or against US. Brilliant! You just aligned yourself with your national laugh stock named GWB.

Now, it's closing 8 am in the morning in SK in Sunday. A new start for SK or NK?

Weather in SK

Description: Clear. Cold.
Temperature: 19 °F Comfort Level: 19 °F
Wind: 1 mph from 300° West-northwestDirection East-southeast
Last update: Sun 7:00 AM KST

Forecast: Raining at evening.

If the USA would just send in the special forces, assassinate Kim Jong and his son, be in and out about it, then this entire scare will go away. No huge war will have to be fought, no economic investment, and the two people responsible for instigating a war will be good and gone.

reply to post by Secularist


I can't believe for all the secret espionage programs the Us and allies has and possibly are funding right this second we can't insert some sleeper agents or special ops into NK. I think there has to be more to it than just no one taking the initiative. There must be something to gain from NK staying in operation for this long.

-----

On another note, does anyone know when the exercises were supposed to kick-off? Honestly, with all the hubbub, it would have been nice to be presented with some sort of camera footage. Not saying anything will happen or should happen, but it would be interesting to watch in any case.

reply to post by SweetRevenge


Yonhap News South Korea

That link will get you to on-the-spot-as-it-gets news. They are a day ahed of us, you know. It's Sunday, now.