TSA, does it have the right?

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by BigTimeCheater

 

Please see 7/7 London Bombings.

Those involved double decker buses... The government will absolutely adore you, my friend. You are easily and quickly laying the same cause, effect, "solution" groundwork which they will ultimately use to excuse them placing these "public safety measures" in all facets of daily life. I mean sure, this all started with planes flying into the Word Trade Towers... but those crafty terrorists could start hijacking buses, trains, and cruise ships... oops, what about domestic motorists? Better incorporate the technology into gas station pumps (*giddy voices in the Pentagon* OK, my turn to watch the scanner cams at the Chevron next to the USC girl's dorm!) to catch any crafty terrorists who might be thinking of blowing up the SAAB while driving through the Eisenhower Tunnel. Thinking about it, we better get these on major street corners, too just to be safe and ensure pedestrians aren't strapped with explosives. Yes, I'm being facetious but, as you said earlier "Nothing to hide, nothing to fear", right?

reply to post by burdman30ott6


Okay, could you please clarify something for me? In your opinion, what is the reason the Government is paying these "creeps" to "grope" innocent civilians?

reply to post by Death_Kron


It is to provide a false sense of security while finding.... "things"

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by burdman30ott6

 

Okay, could you please clarify something for me? In your opinion, what is the reason the Government is paying these "creeps" to "grope" innocent civilians?

Conditioning. When you place a frog into a pot of boiling water, it will immediately try to escape. If, however, you place a frog into a pot of tepid water, apply flame, and slowly bring it to aboil, it will happily sit there until it is cooked alive.

If the government were to leap directly from previously presumed freedom & expected rights into full blown Orwellian dystopia, the frogs would jump from the pot... or, rather, riots would take to the streets. If, however, you slowly and summarily strip people of their rights, their privacy, and their dignity, over time you will reach the point of a rightsless, subserviant, "Big Brother is always right and always guides in to do what is right" core of society.

Right now, they are pushing more firmly, attempting to determine a resistance point. WHen they reach that reisistance point... the point at which the majority of the country is opposed to their actions and it is markedly hurting the financial bottom line of the corporate heirarchy, they will openly draw back and, most likely, it will be time for another "incident" which makes the average American again cry for Big Brother to protect them. Wash, rinse, repeat. Eventually the time between starting the firmer pushing and public resistance starting will become longer and longer until, ultimately, they have reached a fully pliable society which believes only what the government tells them and is willing to give up everything and anything at the instantaneous beck and call of that government.

I think recently they screwed this process up, for whatever this is worth to you. For a number of years, I heard this boiling frog analogy and thought it was bullcrap. It is only in the last 2 or 3 years that I have noticed it myself, causing me to think that maybe somebody overestimated the amount by which to turn up the heat and may have bumped the knob a bit more than they wished to.

reply to post by burdman30ott6


Interesting thought process but ultimately sounds a little over dramatised and a little melodramatic, will post further tomorrow.

reply to post by Death_Kron

Star for burdman above by the way.'zactly.
"Negative" to the o.p.:
This is about rights and being run over roughshod the fed gov. We've all been seen and touched by"strangers": ( gone to the doctor? turn your head to the left and cough please... ! Recruits: face the wall bend over please..This is about over authoritative mall cops.claiming authority they don't have. There wasa guy in Saudi who hid an explosive in his rectum. convicts routinely hide shivs; weapons(and telephones and power drills) in the "keister. The saudi bum bomber went off but he didn't kill the prince( target) he was sitting next to.

Should we do the full cavity search?

Scared of being blown out of the sky?
don't fly.
No search can stop a determined idiot with a stinger.

Why search a flightcrew? : A stewardess ( "flight attendant" could produce a weapon and threaten the pilot to crash the plane)?

Then why search pilots????

its unwarranted authoritative B.S.
There is no "Terrorista-stan".There is no war on terror ( just like you cannot have a war on "sneak attacks".)
except to corral the American people to accept a world govt. body.

reply to post by 46ACE


*sighs again*

Just because you can't fully prevent terrorism doesn't mean you don't implement measures that may prevent some attacks.

Actually, we can have 100% security. Don't bother with this "slippery slope" nonsense. As soon as someone buys a ticket, a TSA agent jumps up from behind the counter and BAM, shoots them right between the eyes. That'll teach them darn terrorists! Next in line, please ...

A lot of people have suggested boycotting the airlines for a day. That won't change things. An indefinate boycott may have an effect, but some people must fly. Here's an idea. Boycott the largest airline. If you must fly, do so, just avoid one particular airline. When the largest airline goes bankrupt, then maybe the voice of the people would be heard. If not, start boycotting #2. Repeat as necessary.

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by 46ACE

 

*sighs again*

Just because you can't fully prevent terrorism doesn't mean you don't implement measures that may prevent some attacks.

So put a couple of air marshalls in the cockpit and in coach on every flight; lock the cockpit doors. you can't detect the truly crazy.Credit cards are fairly sharp . A dvd can be shattered where does it stop?wearing a paper jump suit provided by the carrier? nekkid and shackled to your seat? Con Air?where does it stop?

Does this look right to anyone?

Originally posted by bekod
Do you think, under the pretense of safety and security, the TSA has the right to take the 4th amendment and chuck it out the window?????

Of course not. The first time you excuse a CONSTITUTIONAL violation, we all lose.
So in other words, the TSA is violating CONSTITUTIONAL LAW and any agent performing either a pat down or running a body scanner should be arrested.

Get to Play touchy feely with you, or expose your self to x-rays and to who ever might "see" you. yes this is a 3 part question, i could make it a 4 part, do you think that under the "freedom of religion" some should get free pass?,

Do people really think any of this will make us any safer?
And even if it did, at what cost? The loss of everything the United States stands for????
Does this sound familiar to anyone?
Those who would give up liberty for security deserve neither and will soon lose BOTH. -paraphrased.

Are we really going to allow TSA agents to molest our children in front of us or take pornographic pictures of our children in front of us without doing anything??????????

Or, should all get same treatment. I do not fly , just so you know, under the new laws and TSA's "SS" like tactics, there is now way in "H" i would, i would take the train, bus, boat, car or walk before i let my self be bullied into "what is best for me". Bull! it is control, uncontrolled control.
In my own free thinking we the "sheepole" have let them, the terrorist, win, by letting them put fear into us, and in doing so taking our freedoms away. if one wants to kill you they will!! No law, nor, no one will stop them, they will die and you along with them, we seem to forget this fact.

Heres a short 10 minute compilation I found TSA's greatest hits;: the TSA does not have the right to do any of this: especially the blonde girl towards the end bodily tackled and thrown across the area over a bottle of contact cleaning solution.

reply to post by 46ACE


If that was my child screaming "don't touch me" while being illegally fondled by a TSA scumbag, I wouldn't idle stand by video taping it. I would be spending the night in jail. I got very upset while watching that.

Death_Kron,

I have read throughout 4 pages of your praise of the TSA, and the few people who agree with you.

I must ask you and your supporters…how exactly does the TSA actions correspond with the 4th amendment?

Originally posted by Death_Kron
reply to post by Stryker Ops

 

I presume the majority of people who share your "argument" have never been searched by the police...

Ergo, they have done nothing to warrant being pat searched by the police, or any other governmental agency.
By wanting to fly, they automatically give up rights afforded to every American citizen? Your "argument" that comparing this to other situations, i.e. being touched by a random man on the street is not relevant because

the TSA staff or any other police/security/military personel are doing their job to protect you.

does not fly either. Have you ever performed a pat search, or for that matter, been subjected to one? Aside from airports, any interaction you may have had that required a pat search, would almost certainly require your being pat searched by a police officer. Does a pat search not bother you? If not, you have been "conditioned", which is the purpose of a thorough pat search. Condition the individual to accept the power one holds over another. This conditioning leads to acceptance of greater loss of power by the individual.

If one wants to insure no contraband passes beyond a certain point, all property must be searched and cleared, and each individual must be thoroughly strip searched. When suspicions warrant, cavity searches and x-rays are the next line of defense. This is not the direction we need to go. 350,000,000 American citizens. How many, aside from TPTB, were involved in the hijackings and terrorist attacks of 9/11? How many have been involved in the remainder of terrorist attacks since that date, be it a hijacking or domestic attack?

The problem is we are going about this all wrong. Quit criminalizing and conditioning citizens, and focus on better ways to protect our airlines. All DHS and TSA are doing is reacting to situations and placing restrictions on American citizens. For once, they should be proactive, and focus not on prosecuting people like John Tyner, but spend their time and our money on good intelligence gathering. I have had many gang intelligence officers working for me who could do 100 times the job these yahoo's are doing now.

I don't know the answer, I just hope and pray Americans wake up and force the government to realize we are not the criminals. Focus on those who are terrorists and their associates. Learn how to gather good intelligence, and how to put it to work to fight terrorism, not to feel up my wife, daughters, and grandchildren.

I apologize for the long rant, but had to blow off some steam.

Well, how do you think they would bring Obama Care to the people?
- Xrays available now, colon exams begin Jan 1st.
FYI - all work preformed by min wage x-corporate employees.

Fun to spoof - But too..
You don't realize what giving up your freedom really means until you have given up your freedom.
"This just isn't right".
Really do hope some changes come soon.

Andy

TSA small government agency. Small government agencies hire people with small minds. Want to anger some one with a small mind, don't go through the scanner. This will change. There's enough uproar in the MSM, the powers that be will do something about it.

TSA small government agency. Small government agencies hire people with small minds. Want to anger some one with a small mind, don't go through the scanner. This will change. There's enough uproar in the MSM, the powers that be will do something about it.

Originally posted by bekod
Do you think, under the pretense of safety and security, the TSA has the right to take the 4th amendment and chuck it out the window?????Get to Play touchy feely with you, or expose your self to x-rays and to who ever might "see" you. yes this is a 3 part question, i could make it a 4 part, do you think that under the "freedom of religion" some should get free pass?, Or, should all get same treatment. I do not fly , just so you know, under the new laws and TSA's "SS" like tactics, there is now way in "H" i would, i would take the train, bus, boat, car or walk before i let my self be bullied into "what is best for me". Bull! it is control, uncontrolled control.
In my own free thinking we the "sheepole" have let them, the terrorist, win, by letting them put fear into us, and in doing so taking our freedoms away. if one wants to kill you they will!! No law, nor, no one will stop them, they will die and you along with them, we seem to forget this fact.

No. Here is a classic case of an agency setting it's rules without first consulting very many people. It's obvious. Some clown in TSA who thinks he/she knows enough to make proper judgments is "free lancing" and the result is public outrage.

Pretty soon a tit will be in a wringer (you kids don't know that means do you? Ha) and it will be discovered that the company that makes those scanners got together with TSA and determined a really neat way to get rich.

I doubt that our HS boss had any say in the matter. If she did the least she can do is to post a scan pic of her on the internet. Wait.... OMG she's a slug. Forget that idea.

reply to post by retiredTxn


Yep, I've been patted down plenty of times and it hasn't ever bothered me in the slightest, why would it?