China's iron Olympic grip starts to slip...

Originally posted by NinguLilium
Massive cut and paste.

The (somewhat dated) source of your post - which you didn't even seem to read as it cuts out mid word, can be found here

Originally posted by wolfmanjack

Busted!!! China Caught Cheating-- Female Gymnasts Too Young

www.politicalforum.com...

Between 2003 and 2006 the General Administration of Sport of China reported that Chinese gymnast Yang Yilin was born on Aug. 26, 1993.
In 2007 the Chinese bumped her birth date back to Aug. 26, 1992: results.beijing2008.cn...


There were already reports questioning the age of the Chinese gymnasts before the gymnastics team competition last night.
But, after the world got a better look at the teens with missing baby teeth www.nytimes.com...&oref=slogin there were several reports today on the controversy.

www.npr.org...=93555913
www.latimes.com...

The New York Times reported on August 4, 2008: query.nytimes.com...


With the start of the women's gymnastics competition less than one week away, questions are again being raised about the age of a Chinese gymnast scheduled to compete at the Beijing Games.

Yang Yilin, a top contender for gold in the all-around and the uneven bars, could be 14 instead of the minimum age of 16, The Associated Press reported Sunday.

She is the third of six Olympians on the Chinese women's gymnastics team whose age has been questioned in the lead-up to these Olympics.

Registration lists from 2003 to 2006, previously posted on the Web site of the General Administration of Sport of China, said Yang was born on Aug. 26, 1993, which means she will turn 15 later this month. Gymnasts must turn 16 during the year of the Olympics to be eligible to compete in the Games.


And China has been busted cheating in the olimpics MANY TIMES in the past..

[edit on 17-8-2008 by wolfmanjack]

Wow, you americans are sooooo desperate to remain to be seen as the only superpower that your usually reliable media (ahem!) is now resorting slander and outright lies to soil the olympic dreams of anyone who might threaten americas dominance! Sounds like desperation to me?
Just watching the olympics live and a week after you posted that, Yang Yilin has just won bronze in the womens apparatus final-you'd think the international olympic comittee might want to check up in light of all the stories? No, they are completely satisfied as are International Federation of Gymnastics - the governing body of competitive gymnastics. Doesn't really matter anyway He Kixin (china) took the gold with Nastia Liukin (Usa) taking silver, but those sour grapes are always hard to swallow?
And as for-
"And China has been busted cheating in the olimpics MANY TIMES in the past.. "
Off the top of my head I can think of Marion Jones, Jud Logan and LaMark Carter, from the Usa who were all caught cheating (doping) at the olympics.
As for parts of the opening ceremony being "faked"-who cares! It was still the most spectacular opening ceremony in history and one of the most awe inspiring things i've ever seen on tv. You'll be telling me that the guy who flew around the stadium walls with the olympic torch was on wires next?
The table for gold medals at the time of writing-
China 37
USA 20
GB 12


[edit on 18-8-2008 by the way]

Originally posted by poet1b
I think China has gone all out to prove itself to the world at these Olympics. While China's civil rights record is bad, they are trying to change all that, and that is important.

China has done a great job at these Olympic games, and this should be acknowledged.

I agree. The Chinese have done a fantastic job.... The UK newspaper report above is rubbish in my opinion. I've been watching a lot of the games and have never seen half empty stadiums? What do they keep harping on about that child miming for anyway.... who cares... it looked good.

As far as taking part, you might expect the Chinese to do so well since they account for 1/4 of the worlds population! I would expect them to dominate at at the next games as well.

Originally posted by stumason
I know that some event's, such as the Greco-Roman wrestling, where packed out at first, but as soon as the Chinese participant (some great, huge mountain of a man) got knocked out, they all litterally upped and left, leaving the arena virtually empty.

The same could be said for other events, I suppose. Because they're guy is out, they don't want to watch it, but the tickets have already been allocated rather than being resold, so you end up with some events being in empty arena's.

Having said that, there have been some packed out events as well, for example the athletics, soccer and rowing.

China's Michael Phelps - Liu Xiang, a runner who is the national favorite - hurt himself last night and was unable to run in his event. When they announced this to the (very largely Chinese) crowd nearly everyone left! Can you believe how rude that is to the other competitors? This Olympics isn't about athleticism or global community spirit or building bridges; it's about nationalism pure and simple. Absolutely Disgusting

The biggest shenanigans of these games aren't "fake" opening ceremonies or unfilled stands...it's the unfair judging that has been occurring, the scores that have been weighed in China's favor. Anyone who has been watching an event that has to be judged knows what I'm talking about...Women's gymnastics on the vault...Alicia Sacramone should have gotten a silver at least (behind Germany who should have gotten a gold)...but didn't even get a medal...while a Chinese girl who fell flat on her face got a bronze, and a Korean girl who landed out of bounds beat two stellar performances by Alicia Sacramone and a German woman who both only had small bounces to get a gold. It happened in the team competition too, on the balance beam, it's happened in synchronized diving. The judging has been horribly unfair when it comes to judging Asian nations vs Western nations. I really think the judges should be investigated for fraud...because it is too obvious to ignore.

[edit on 18-8-2008 by yellowcard]

reply to post by yellowcard


I originally posted these in the-Is the olympic scoring system bias to the Chinese? thread, hope they answer your question?

Originally posted by the way
So when an american wins its fair judging but if the chinese win it must be fixed, right?

Judging is done by INTERNATIONAL judges, not by China!
Its strange that the usually reliable american media (ahem!) are the ones whining about this-i've heard nothing about it in the european media??

If there is score fixing/doping it will all be revealed in time, but you guys had better pray there's a lot of it becuase China are owning the competition at the moment, the medals table speaks for itself-

The table for gold medals at the time of writing-
China 37
USA 20
GB 12

I'm sure a nice cold glass of bud will help those sour grapes slip down a bit easier?

[edit on 18-8-2008 by the way]

Originally posted by the way

Originally posted by roadgravel
The bias was not subtle in the women's vault. The American took 4th behind China even though the Chinese woman fell on a landing. It was hard to believe she still took third. The deduction was very low by most accounts.

[edit on 8/18/2008 by roadgravel]

Perhaps before you go crying foul, you should familiarise yourself with the rules of the competition you are watching?
In gymnastics points are awarded on the overall difficulty of the particular routine, for instance-
If someone peforms a routine that is graded as having a difficulty of 15.8 and they make a small error and one medium (- 0.1 and 0.3 respectively) they will receive a higher score than someone who performs a 14.9 without any mistakes. Even a large mistake made would still beat that as that is -0.8.

No fault, no harm, just another false alarm!

[edit on 18-8-2008 by the way]

[edit on 18-8-2008 by the way]

I hope this is of help to you?

Ha, people complaining of China cheating? Hahaha, that's funny.

All the judging is done by people from the IOC, not Chinese Party members!

I suppose the Chinese kindly rigged the rowing, sailing and cycling for the UK did they? As we've cleaned up there, even against Chinese athletes.

This could be the best Olympics for the UK since 1908 and the USA is second in the table with an impressive 22 Golds (72 medals in all), so how exactly is it rigged?

Your just upset because your not number 1, aren't you?

Awww, does the poor Amewican want a huggy and a kissy? Mummy will make it all better.....

Originally posted by stumason
Ha, people complaining of China cheating? Hahaha, that's funny.

All the judging is done by people from the IOC, not Chinese Party members!

I suppose the Chinese kindly rigged the rowing, sailing and cycling for the UK did they? As we've cleaned up there, even against Chinese athletes.

This could be the best Olympics for the UK since 1908 and the USA is second in the table with an impressive 22 Golds (72 medals in all), so how exactly is it rigged?

Your just upset because your not number 1, aren't you?

Awww, does the poor Amewican want a huggy and a kissy? Mummy will make it all better.....

Yeah, because IOC judges have never been caught cheating...

www.rense.com...
fav.or.it...
archives.cnn.com...

Yup, totally infallible.

Just because some games have weighted scores doesn't mean that ALL events are "rigged"...and you pointed out unjudged events...which kind of doesn't make any sense at all. If you pay attention to the judging point spreads you can see a definite discrepancy.

[edit on 18-8-2008 by yellowcard]

Originally posted by the way
reply to post by yellowcard
I hope this is of help to you?

It doesn't help at all, considering that even famous coaches and people who have been in gymnastics for more years than...well...you. Have said that the judging has been unfair. False alarm? Perhaps YOU should learn how something is judged before accusing others of having no knowledge of both Olympic history or how an event is judged. You also left out starting scores from your analysis...but that still doesn't account for falling flat on your face and winning a bronze.

[edit on 18-8-2008 by yellowcard]

reply to post by wolfmanjack

their people have been busted doping etc....... Over MANY years worth of Olympics.

Uhh... who knows how many americans have used performance enhancing substances...

The will to get an edge on other athletes no matter the cost is a worldwide problem I suspect..

Originally posted by yellowcard

Originally posted by the way
reply to post by yellowcard
I hope this is of help to you?

It doesn't help at all, considering that even famous coaches and people who have been in gymnastics for more years than...well...you. Have said that the judging has been unfair. False alarm? Perhaps YOU should learn how something is judged before accusing others of having no knowledge of both Olympic history or how an event is judged. You also left out starting scores from your analysis...but that still doesn't account for falling flat on your face and winning a bronze.

[edit on 18-8-2008 by yellowcard]

Reeeally??

Have you ever considered that maybe these "famous coaches and people who have been in gymnastics for more years than...well...you" might be a bit biased? Just something you might want to consider?

As I said here in Europe I've heard no such claims and everyone who's saying otherwise seems to be from the good ole US-but I guess thats just a coincidence and not sour grapes at all?

Part of sportsmanship is a little thing called losing gracefully, and having respect for the opponent who beat you- you guys should give it a shot sometime!

[edit on 18-8-2008 by the way]

reply to post by yellowcard


So i'm guessing that when Nastia Liukin won the individual womens final that was fair judging?

But when america got silvers in the uneven bars and in the womens team final (due to some very big mistakes by their third wheel-Liukin and Johnson were fantastic but the chinese girls were consistently awesome) losing golds to the chinese- that was biased judging?

Hmmm...I'm begining to see a pattern forming here...
Those sour grapes are easier to swallow if you juice 'em first....suck it down.
You're a bad loser, mate.
Or to quote Stewie- "Oh, you're a poor sport!"

This wasn't meant to be a China hate thread. Not that I'm a fan of China, but the article is more about how China handled some aspects of the Olympics, including how they faked certain parts of the ceremony (the entire fireworks display we all saw on our televisions, little did we know, didn't exist at all!). I just think that China's trying too hard to be perfect and grandiose. And I'm surprised that a city with such poor air quality, and a country with such a history of censorship and human rights abuses, would be chosen to host the Olympic games. But the issue is more of how it was managed, what China had to resort to faking to put on a good front, any why.

[edit on 18-8-2008 by Johnmike]

Originally posted by the way
Off the top of my head I can think of Marion Jones, Jud Logan and LaMark Carter, from the Usa who were all caught cheating (doping) at the olympics.
As for parts of the opening ceremony being "faked"-who cares!

Well...I do! I'm watching the Olympics to see what's actually happening at the Olympics. When I'm fed CGI, and told that it is really happening, that's lying. I want to see the Olympic games; if I wanted to see a computer simulation, I could watch that myself.

reply to post by Johnmike


Did you actually watch all of it, Johnmike?

The opening was the best televised ceremony I have ever seen in my 37 years on the planet. 15,000+ people were on the stage (at various times) and I think they did an awesome job of putting on a fantastic show that conveyed something of china's history and culture, hard work and discipline, technological excellence and hopes for the future.

It was also a spectacular triumph of the of the olympic spirit and humanity's striving for excellence through friendly competition that only a hardened, heartless cynic could feel unmoved by, imho.

It will be looked back on as the benchmark for such events and I sadly doubt that my own country will be able to match it or even come close to that standard in 2012.

And you're complaining that a kid mimed and a few (not all) fireworks were cgi'd.
Pfft...there's just no pleasing some people, but I guess if it was your country that had done this we wouldn't be having this debate, somehow?







[edit on 18-8-2008 by the way]

Originally posted by the way
Did you actually watch all of it, Johnmike?

Not straight through. Is that okay?

Originally posted by the way
And you're complaining that a kid mimed and a few (not all) fireworks were cgi'd.

Yeah. That what we saw on TV, expecting to be real, was a fake computer animation. And that the girl who was singing wasn't really singing (I feel sort of bad for the singer - she wasn't pretty enough for China). And that Beijing got it, even though the smog's so bad they had to artificially alter the weather. And how they handled the ticket sales. And how they had to round up protesters before the event. And how the censorship remains. This stuff bothers me, in any country.

Originally posted by the way
Pfft...there's just no pleasing some people, but I guess if it was your country that had done this we wouldn't be having this debate, somehow?

Yeah, I'd be even louder. I expected this from China, but in my own country, we could find who was responsible and condemn him ourselves. For China...we can just sort of watch from afar.

reply to post by Johnmike


Watch it all the way through if you get the chance.
Highly recommended it, in all seriousness.

And that way you can make your own mind up about it rather than regurgitating the politically motivated bias (I don't like the word propaganda) you've been fed through the news network.

Originally posted by the way
reply to post by yellowcard

 

So i'm guessing that when Nastia Liukin won the individual womens final that was fair judging?

But when america got silvers in the uneven bars and in the womens team final (due to some very big mistakes by their third wheel-Liukin and Johnson were fantastic but the chinese girls were consistently awesome) losing golds to the chinese- that was biased judging?

Hmmm...I'm begining to see a pattern forming here...
Those sour grapes are easier to swallow if you juice 'em first....suck it down.
You're a bad loser, mate.
Or to quote Stewie- "Oh, you're a poor sport!"

I've played sports me entire life...mate. I can say that the Germans SHOULD have gotten gold on the women's vault, the U.S. SHOULD have gotten silver. It has nothing to do with being a "sore" loser, it has to be with getting the results right. You sound far more bitter than anyone here, you think questioning the results is because of bias? That is such an ignorant analysis...The poor judging hasn't only occurred against the U.S., it has occurred against Germany, Canada, Russia, etc. This is not a U.S. event, it is a result of poor judging and a horrible judging system that was adopted for these Chinese Olympics. If I remember correctly Alicia Sacramone was a very gracious "loser," hugging each country's women because of their hard work. You can display good sportsmanship and question results, it has nothing to do with the competing team's members, it has to do with the judging booth and how it can be manipulated.

[edit on 18-8-2008 by yellowcard]

reply to post by yellowcard


I can't comment on the womens vault as I managed to miss it.
I'm really not bitter at all, just fed up with all your compatriots on all the olympic threads here whining about how hard done by they are.
And for the record this is the first time i've heard anyone complain that any other country is getting screwed over except the US.

The Chinese also use official cheer squads, where large sections of the crowd are chosen by the regime to fill seats and give the impression of a harmonious and enthusiastic public. The opening ceremony was largely made up of these "rent-a-crowds".