Forest on Mars !?!?

Originally posted by thedangler
if it is a forest those trees would be huge.
take a comparison picture using google earth from the same distance see if thye look similar. i doubt it.

Great Idea! Why don't you?

Well we did... and they do...

Here is Wayne Newtons backyard (this is the guest house)

Originally posted by zeeon
Lol, no you misunderstand. I know there is water on Mars, I'm saying WHO discovered water on Mars? NASA did, and they released the info - along with other coaberating (sp?) agencies. Thats what I meant.

AH so your an anti NASA person eh?

Well its interesting but in this link bluebird provided there is this comment:

Scientists are reporting this week detailed evidence for vast amounts of water ice just beneath the surface of Mars. The finding, which confirms preliminary data released earlier this year, should help answer an age-old question regarding where ancient Mars' water went, and it is likely to fuel greater interest in probing the Red Planet for signs of life.

The new data, provided by the Mars Odyssey spacecraft, will be reported in Friday's issue of the journal Science. The findings were embargoed for release Thursday afternoon, but some news outlets in the U.S. and Britain reported on them last week and over the weekend.

The journal lifted the embargo this morning.

So here is absolute proof that the scientists do have info, but the info is embargoed until someone decides to release it. Now THAT is as interesting as the new discovery of under ground water in this release..

Water Ice Discovery on Mars May Be 'Tip of an Iceberg'

Originally posted by laiguana

I have tried to find official explanations for these tree-like formations, and so far I haven’t across any. Perhaps I haven’t been looking up the necessary criteria?

So have I and I have written letters to ask and no response. It seems official sources are refusing to make ANY comment on the images, yet on the "face" issue they did not hesitate to speak up in denial, even though it was NASA who first publicized the "face" to gain common support...

Nothing suspicious in that... move along folkes.. nothing to see here...

:shk:

I've scanned over the large image, and I keep coming back to this one area, I can't help but wonder what I am looking at here, and what caused this...

Originally posted by laiguana
I would also like to tie this theory into this:
www.space.com...

Great work and links laiguana especially that video clip. I have forwarded that to the Pegasus group to look over. As to the atmosphere being "stored" other than Arnold's movie I have not heard of this before, but I will certainly look into it.. I'll give you a wats for this...

To be honest, I'm still skeptical, why wouldn't this make the news to some degree at the least?

Mentioned a reason in the last post... seems they embargo news releases... I wonder how long and how far reaching that practise is?

quote: Originally posted by laiguana
I would also like to tie this theory into this:
www.space.com...

Absolutly and why not!

Scanning the Earth scientists found enormous reservoirs of water deep beneath the surface and scientists are saying that the volume of water is at least the Arctic ocean size.

“That is exactly what we show here,” Wysession said. “Water inside the rock goes down with the sinking slab and it’s quite cold, but it heats up the deeper it goes, and the rock eventually becomes unstable and loses its water.”

The water then rises up into the overlying region, which becomes saturated with watert would still look like solid rock to you,” Wysession told LiveScience. “You would have to put it in the lab to find the water in it.”.

Huge ocean Discovered Inside Earth

We can look at vast LOWLANDS /north: on average whether Mars had plate tectonics/ on Mars: they are just like Ocean Basins on Earth, without water.

Important question:than whether Mars had plate tectonics - that shaped this oceans basins and have the ability to reshape ( for exp. sink water beneath)? And water to act like a natural lubricant to keep the sheets of crust in motion.


. "If one believes early Mars was wet, then it makes plate tectonics more reasonable," says Gerald Schubert of the University of California, Los Angeles. "Alternatively, one could turn this around ? accept plate tectonics, and use this as independent support for a lot of water on early Mars."
Terra Sirenium - big highland on southern hemisphere was observed by the Mars Global Surveyor - " Surveyor detected buried magnetic fields four times stronger than those it had recorded in the northern region.

One interesting theory, published in 1999 is that these bands could be evidence of the past operation of plate tectonics on Mars, although this has yet to be proven [2]. If true, the processes involved may have helped to sustain an Earth-like atmosphere by transporting carbon rich rocks to the surface, while the presence of a magnetic field would have helped to protect the planet from cosmic radiation.

Plate Tectonics on Mars
NASA



And again - water!?!? New deposit - in a time span of JUST 5 YEARS?

Location near: 8.8°N, 1.2°W

* strange landscape!?

".......small, approximately 3 km by 3 km (1.9 mi by 1.9 mi) area on the floor of an unnamed impact crater in western Arabia Terra"

source


[edit on 25-4-2007 by sanctum]

""Smoking Gun" Evidence for Persistent Water Flow
and Sediment Deposition on Ancient Mars"




river deltas - lake basins...

What is important about this discovery? First, it provides clear, unequivocal evidence that some valleys on Mars experienced the same type of on-going, or, persistent, flow over long periods of time as rivers do on Earth. Second, because the fan is today a deposit of sedimentary rock, it demonstrates that some sedimentary rocks on Mars were, as has been suspected but never clearly demonstrated, deposited in a liquid (probably water) environment. Third, the general shape, pattern of its channels, and low topographic slopes provide circumstantial evidence that the feature was actually a delta--that is, a deposit made when a river or stream enters a body of water. In other words, the landform discovered by MOC may be the strongest indicator yet that some craters and other depressions on Mars once held lakes. Although hundreds of other locations on Mars where valleys enter craters and basins have been imaged by MOC, this is the first to show landforms like those presented here.

source

A lot of the misperception about the Mars stuff is the way it has "branches" or "veins." Yeah, trees and bushes and other forms of plant life do that, but there are also plenty of erosion processes that will give you that same shape. And folks are also fooled by the light and shadows of the photos.

Get off the "light and shadows" kick... while SOME people may be fooled as you say, but the Pegasus group and associates are well experienced and trained in graphics and we know what is shadows and what isn't

As to those "plenty of erosion processes" Please ppoint us to one tha looks the same.... NASA sccientist can't ex[plain them, [perhaps you have some better knowledge you can share?

Thanks for you contribution

To Blue Bird...

THE BLUE BIRD FILES

I am at page 6 of the thread so far putting all this data onto the webpage... I also added Pegasus material that was related and the thread is broken into three groups.. 3 more pages of thread to go and then a few other Mars Water threads I need to go back and check on for any missed data... but I don't think there is anything in them I haven't got already

Trees and Life
Water Page 1
Water Page 2
Color of Mars

Take a minute to go over them see if anything is missing

Here is a view of Ancient Mars

Taken from our time machine

Glorious image zorgon

Originally posted by zorgon



THE BLUE BIRD FILES

I am speechless zorgon!
You made may day!
Thank you!

*and that Ancient Mars oh boy!
*and blude bird on red planet

[edit on 26-4-2007 by blue bird]

"If there is vegetation on Mars, it should be concentrated in the darkarea elements, measuring 10 to 100 kilometers. Vegetation is the best hypothesis to account for seasonal changes in the maria and for the persistence of these formations despite dust storms of global extent. Survival of vegetation in the extreme dryness of the Martian climate could depend on the low night-time temperature and deposition of hoarfrost, which could melt into droplets after sunrise, before evaporating. If not vegetation, it must be something thing specifically Martian; no other hypothesis hitherto proposed is able to account for the facts."

Science Magazine


*** for Mars lovers:"Mars as the Abode of life" by Percival Lowell

[edit on 27-4-2007 by blue bird]

Originally posted by blue bird

I am speechless zorgon!

Your welcome and welcome to Pegasus LOL

But your work putting all the water issues into one thread has been very helpful and motivated me to get that section finished. I will catch up the other pages tomorrow..

But here is a couple pieces of the puzzle I found following your links...

Mars Rovers Explore Hints of Salty Water

NASA's Opportunity rover sent back new images from Mars showing that small spheres previously found on the surface also exist below, in a trench the rover dug. Hints of salty water were also found in the trench, but much more analysis is needed to learn the true composition.

Meanwhile Opportunity's twin rover, Spirit, is about to dig a trench of its own in order to investigate soil that sticks to its wheels, suggesting the fine-grained material might be moist.

In a press conference today, officials said the soil at both locations could contain small amounts of water mixed with salt in a brine that can exist in liquid form at very low temperatures...

Water is the main thing scientists are searching for at Mars, because all life as we know it requires liquid water...

SOURCE

Sooo seems those rover tracks ARE MUDDY afterall

[edit on 27-4-2007 by zorgon]

Water Once Filled Mars Opportunity Rover Landing Site

"The landing site of the Mars rover Opportunity was once drenched with water, providing an environment that could have supported life, NASA scientists announced at a press conference today.

Water once covered or infused the small crater in which the rover sits, then it gradually evaporated away leaving high concentrations of salt behind. A lake or ocean at the site and beyond might have once been the size of one of Earth's Great Lakes. Or the area might have been loaded with groundwater that rarely if ever reached the surface.

And while no signs of biological activity are likely to be uncovered by the current mission, scientists are ecstatic that they now know exactly where to look for past life on Mars..."

SOURCE

[edit on 27-4-2007 by zorgon]

Here is my favorite one...

Mars Rover Sits on Ancient Beach

The US space agency has announced that its robotic Mars rover Opportunity is parked on what was once the shore of a salty Martian sea.

There is multiple evidence that the surface of Mars was awash with liquid water at some time in its past.

But the latest findings from Nasa's robot explorers on the Red Planet are fleshing out a picture of what Mars must have been like when it was wet...

"If you have an interest in searching for fossils on Mars, this is the first place you want to go Ed Weiler, Nasa" - Talking about Opportunity's landing site at Meridiani Planum"

SOURCE

Why is this my favorite? Well in one of Mike Singh's threads we were discussing fossils...

Now here is a NASA Scientist pointing to Rover evidence and telling me WHERE I might find fossils...

And for those who haven't seen it here is the fossil picture I posted.. (J. Skipper also has this, though he didn't find as many specimens )




Details and image sources and close ups of the specimens is here
landoflegends.us...

* speaking of “salty“ - here are some very, very salty “blueberries“:





*“continuous production of oxygen atoms and oxygen molecules“ - the GLOWING in the Martian Night - just like Earth and Venus lol:




Astrobiology Magazine

And also - can we trace methane on Mars?

On Earth methane is produced by microbes. If we have this nice HARPS instrument ( one that founf “Earth-like Gliese 581 c ) and so we know, that spectrometry ( the analysis of light waves) is very good method - we better hurry to study gases in Mars atmosphere!

* In 2003, Michael Mumma of Goddard Space Flight Center (GSFC) detected methane using spectrometers at two large earthbound telescopes. He has since told several scientific meetings that large variations exist in methane concentration on Mars. In a presentation at a NASA Astrobiology Institute meeting in April 2005, Mumma said the detection of martian methane varied with geography: there was an average of 200 parts per billion (ppb) detected at the equator, and 20 to 60 ppb near the poles.

* Vladimir Krasnopolsky, a research professor at Catholic University of America in Washington D.C., also detected methane on Mars. Like Mumma, Krasnopolsky used spectrometers on Earth-based telescopes. He calculated a global average of 11 ppb, with a range of 7 to 15 ppb. The data, as Krasnopolsky reported to a European Geosciences Union meeting in April 2004, came from 1999 observations of the whole planet's disk.

* In December 2004, the European Space Agency's Mars Express delivered the first methane data from a Mars orbiter. In the journal Science, Vittorio Formisano of the Institute of the Physics of Interplanetary Space in Rome and colleagues reported measurements made with the satellite's Planetary Fourier Spectrometer. Their measurements were similar to Krasnopolsky's numbers: A concentration of 10 ppb, plus or minus 5 ppb.

source



“Methane-making microbes inside Greenland ice could be telling us there's life on Mars, say researchers.“

Methane bugs love ice, so why not Mars?

[edit on 27-4-2007 by blue bird]

Originally posted by zorgon

Sooo seems those rover tracks ARE MUDDY afterall

Of course it is muddy! We see it clearly! We just need to look at this wet and muddy traces after rover!? What holds this molecules together in that composition? If it is also dry dust - no such footprints on ground!







First they were selling to us all dry desert - nothing on - now we see ice with water down ...volcanos on craters....deltas of river and water carved canyons.... MARSIS ( radar system ESO is using) is bumping radio waves from ionosphere - so there is magnetism down there...





[edit on 27-4-2007 by blue bird]

Good thread but isn't an ionosphere formed when solar wind hits an atmosphere? Mars has a thin atmosphere so it would still have an ionosphere.
en.wikipedia.org... If not could you tell me why because it does form the inner edge of the magnetosphere unless wiki and others are wrong, maybe no magnetosphere no ionosphere?