The "Fall" and Rise of MSM

a reply to: JoshuaCox

Speaking of MSM outlets neglecting their reporting duties. I read this article over at WaPo this morning.
As GOP buckles down on health care, conservative media loses interest

On Tuesday, the fate of the Republicans’ attempt to undo the Affordable Care Act dominated news out of Washington. Phones rattled with alerts about the decision to delay a vote until mid-July. Camera crews jostled for shots of senators meeting with President Trump, then boarding a bus that took them past jeering protesters.

A viewer tuning into Fox News that night hardly saw any of it.

The network’s prime-time shows, ratings kings of cable news, ignored the health-care story. Fox’s 8 p.m. and 10 p.m. shows began with stories about a sting video that caught a CNN producer dismissing his network’s coverage of Russia and the 2016 election. “The Five,” Fox’s 9 p.m. show, began with the “bombshell” news that President Barack Obama had said — in October 2016 — that it would be “impossible” to rig the election. Nine minutes were spent on the Senate bill before a segue way into the CNN story.

The lack of “Obamacare repeal” coverage, unthinkable just six months ago, reflected a general decline of conservative interest in what had united Republicans for seven years. Conservative grass-roots groups have either ignored the latest health-care details, like Americans for Prosperity, or lobbied against the bill, like the Club for Growth.

originally posted by: thekaboose
So you are saying the CNN thing is all "fake news", that it does not matter one bit.

No. I don't think that CNN lying about one story is really that important considering they have sacked the offending reporters. It also doesn't concern me because that one story being a lie doesn't automatically mean that the overarching Trump investigation narrative is false like you are trying to fallaciously claim.

Among all of that I find the Healthcare debate to be FAR more important currently.

Im from the UK, things like a network being caught out should be massive. People should be protesting the bias, people should expect the press to act in an ethical manor. But no. Keep on siding with your preferred network.

My preferred network? I don't even watch CNN. Stop with the assumptions.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: thekaboose
So you are saying the CNN thing is all "fake news", that it does not matter one bit.

No. I don't think that CNN lying about one story is really that important considering they have sacked the offending reporters. It also doesn't concern me because that one story being a lie doesn't automatically mean that the overarching Trump investigation narrative is false like you are trying to fallaciously claim.

Among all of that I find the Healthcare debate to be FAR more important currently.

Im from the UK, things like a network being caught out should be massive. People should be protesting the bias, people should expect the press to act in an ethical manor. But no. Keep on siding with your preferred network.

My preferred network? I don't even watch CNN. Stop with the assumptions.

I'm sorry, but you seem to be missing the point. If a big lie, or major bias is outed, there should be repercussions. The role of media in a perfect world would be to report cold hard facts. Networks and journalists should be punished when they break ethical codes. Truth should be top of the list.

But hell what do I know, in your eyes Im most likely a alt right nutter shill whos here to push a pro trump agenda. But again, sorry, assumptions and all.

originally posted by: thekaboose

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: thekaboose
So you are saying the CNN thing is all "fake news", that it does not matter one bit.

No. I don't think that CNN lying about one story is really that important considering they have sacked the offending reporters. It also doesn't concern me because that one story being a lie doesn't automatically mean that the overarching Trump investigation narrative is false like you are trying to fallaciously claim.

Among all of that I find the Healthcare debate to be FAR more important currently.

Im from the UK, things like a network being caught out should be massive. People should be protesting the bias, people should expect the press to act in an ethical manor. But no. Keep on siding with your preferred network.

My preferred network? I don't even watch CNN. Stop with the assumptions.

I'm sorry, but you seem to be missing the point. If a big lie, or major bias is outed, there should be repercussions. The role of media in a perfect world would be to report cold hard facts. Networks and journalists should be punished when they break ethical codes. Truth should be top of the list.

There were repercussions. CNN sacked the offending reporters. Then they apologized. Saying otherwise is a lie.

But hell what do I know, in your eyes Im most likely a alt right nutter shill whos here to push a pro trump agenda. But again, sorry, assumptions and all.

You said this. Not me. If you want to fight with yourself, knock yourself out, but don't put words in my mouth so you can adopt an antagonistic attitude towards me.

Who could have ever guessed that the media is run as a business for profit?

Hint: CNN isn't the only one.

a reply to: Krazysh0t

Forced to resign is not the same as sacked, its a way of saying "its ok, we wont let you be punished too much". The possible law suit should be carried out. The same as if Fox had started fake news against Obama that got out of hand, should face monetary loss.

If they were removed without benefits then yes, I would have let it go, but no, resigned... so they keep everything they have tied up in the company including bonuses and pay.

But again, go back to the THEORY, not everyone projecting their personal biases onto the post, a simple theory that could have been applied to any MSM if they were caught lying over something big, Russia being the main villian in this little scandal.

Your replies have all seem to be scripted to push for a antagonistic reply from myself. So, either join in or get out. Your choice. Ive seen people like you set up personal attacks across the site for years, a few choice words in a spit filled reply to get the maximum rise, keep poking the fire then leave them to explode. Not today! Feel free to use the door.

originally posted by: thekaboose
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Forced to resign is not the same as sacked, its a way of saying "its ok, we wont let you be punished too much". The possible law suit should be carried out. The same as if Fox had started fake news against Obama that got out of hand, should face monetary loss.

If they were removed without benefits then yes, I would have let it go, but no, resigned... so they keep everything they have tied up in the company including bonuses and pay.

You realize these reporters are pretty much pariahs in their industry now, right? No one is going to hire them again. Regardless of how they exited CNN. Their careers as reporters are over.

Your replies have all seem to be scripted to push for a antagonistic reply from myself. So, either join in or get out. Your choice. Ive seen people like you set up personal attacks across the site for years, a few choice words in a spit filled reply to get the maximum rise, keep poking the fire then leave them to explode. Not today! Feel free to use the door.

Is that so? Yet you are the one attacking me in the thread. I do recall you didn't put this in the mud pit. I'm sorry that you think that me disagreeing with you is a personal attack against you, but that is your own personal problem. I can't help the way you react to my words.

a reply to: thekaboose


Returning this to the subject of the thread, it has been pointed out that profits have increased for these guys, overall. So what, exactly, has 'risen and fallen'?

It looks to me to be trust and credibility. Worse, apparently, they don't care one whit.

It's also been pointed out that the same mechanism would occur-and likely already has- to alternate news outlets.

Is it safe to say we also get the media we deserve?

Todays news seems all a montage of mostly useless trivia to be fed 24/7 to an addicted audience. In some respects nothing more than grey noise. The days of worthy news casting died with Walter Cronkite and later Dan Rather.

originally posted by: Krazysh0t

originally posted by: thekaboose
a reply to: Krazysh0t

Forced to resign is not the same as sacked, its a way of saying "its ok, we wont let you be punished too much". The possible law suit should be carried out. The same as if Fox had started fake news against Obama that got out of hand, should face monetary loss.

If they were removed without benefits then yes, I would have let it go, but no, resigned... so they keep everything they have tied up in the company including bonuses and pay.

You realize these reporters are pretty much pariahs in their industry now, right? No one is going to hire them again. Regardless of how they exited CNN. Their careers as reporters are over.

Your replies have all seem to be scripted to push for a antagonistic reply from myself. So, either join in or get out. Your choice. Ive seen people like you set up personal attacks across the site for years, a few choice words in a spit filled reply to get the maximum rise, keep poking the fire then leave them to explode. Not today! Feel free to use the door.

Is that so? Yet you are the one attacking me in the thread. I do recall you didn't put this in the mud pit. I'm sorry that you think that me disagreeing with you is a personal attack against you, but that is your own personal problem. I can't help the way you react to my words.

The way you defend these people is the same as defending a doctor who gives false diagnoses to people to rake in more money for himself, only to be found out and fired?

I will apologise that I took your replies out of context and saw them as a personal attack, but as I have said, a theory in place, could have been any big lie. I wish it was from Fox news but I'm not that lucky. The Russia/Trump narrative that was pushed and pushed was the cause of this.

Without evidence and the way they pushed it, it was opinion based journalism.

originally posted by: nwtrucker
a reply to: thekaboose


Returning this to the subject of the thread, it has been pointed out that profits have increased for these guys, overall. So what, exactly, has 'risen and fallen'?

It looks to me to be trust and credibility. Worse, apparently, they don't care one whit.

It's also been pointed out that the same mechanism would occur-and likely already has- to alternate news outlets.

Is it safe to say we also get the media we deserve?

The cut off date for these figures though based in Q2, would that include this full week? An actual question, not trying to be snarky. Companies can post profit and numbers up but in reality they could be facing the worst week of the year.


"Is it safe to say we also get the media we deserve?"

Yes... we have screwed up

a reply to: thekaboose

I'm with you.. that's 100% fair.

I'm just pointing out that they don't even have reporters!!!

So the mathematical probability that they got the story right and the msm got it wrong, when the compilation site didn't even do any investigations.. is slim to none..

That's a pretty scary concept though...

If the msm dies and we end up with ONLY compilation sites with zero accountability.. good luck.

It is a vast animal with tentacles everwhere and must be fed. Thousands of jobs rely on it. It's that house mortgage payment, that Porsche payment, the orthodontist payment, the dinner in restaurants four nights a week. it's a creature of our own making.

originally posted by: thekaboose
The way you defend these people is the same as defending a doctor who gives false diagnoses to people to rake in more money for himself, only to be found out and fired?

I'm not defending them. I'm just repeating the actual events of what went down. All these things I've said you can verify for yourself. Again. I don't watch CNN, so what happens to their reporters doesn't concern me.

I will apologise that I took your replies out of context and saw them as a personal attack, but as I have said, a theory in place, could have been any big lie. I wish it was from Fox news but I'm not that lucky. The Russia/Trump narrative that was pushed and pushed was the cause of this.

Without evidence and the way they pushed it, it was opinion based journalism.

You're right, it was poor journalism, but that doesn't mean the whole Trump/Russia narrative is false. There are STILL ongoing investigations about this that haven't wrapped up yet. It sucks that these reporters got overzealous and put their personal success over integrity, but that doesn't mean I'm going to tune out all news or use this one story to deny tangential matters to the case at hand. Since I already don't pay much attention to CNN this story has little affect on me.

originally posted by: thekaboose
No ties

Wait, the investigations are complete?

a reply to: thekaboose

That theory is too small, look at it like this. The last 8 years with Obama, they went after the 2nd amendments. Now for the Next 8 they will go after the 1st amendment. This is a calculated. The slow game. Weaken the constitution.

How is that for a conspiracy. Not likely to be successful but TPTB still get an A for effort right.

a reply to: thekaboose

Define bias....

It's one thing if people who in most cases are fairly informed have an option or are telling people how they think the math of the situation works out..

Is that really bias or analysis??

Bias I consider when you are specificly omitting or pushing a narrative you know is not true or know you don't even remotely have the evidence to decide weather it is true or not...

For example..

The normal conservative talking point..


"All of the WORLDS (not just americas) media, science community, unions, college professors, teachers , physicists, celebrities , exc are all in a vast conspiracy to make republicans look bad and discredit Jesus..""


A) Are they all really in some convoluted interconnected conspiracy ???

Or

B) do they all independently think conservative policies are illogical and stuff that sounds good and wouldn't actually work??


If it is option B, is that really bias??

Or is that their legit deciding of the situation???


What would it take logistically to perpetuate a conspiracy against republicans on a global scale??

a reply to: thekaboose


Good point on the profit statements. Still, none seem to be approaching bankruptcy that I can see.

We've screwed up? Perhaps. I see us as no different, generally speaking, than them. Just as biased.We take comfort in our own 'echo chambers'- kudos to the guy that came up with that one- just as much as they do.

a reply to: Skorpy

When did they go after the second amendment?!?

Oh you mean in right wing world....

Because in the real world even suggesting a gun ban and/or is political suicide...

There isn't even a law enforcement body that would do it...

It is the dumbest talking point on the table..

"Vote for me because the other guys are comming to get your guns!!"

When that is politically , logically, logistically and scientificly impossible...

Maybe that is the true primary trait for conservative conspiracy people...

The ability to believe something that is logistically impossible.

How do you confiscate and ban guns ???

The army wouldn't do it...

Local police wouldn't do it...

So how is this threat real???

originally posted by: thekaboose
a reply to: IgnoranceIsntBlisss

Issue is, crush all MSM and then all alternative news becomes mainstream, they sell out and we go round and round until the death of our species and the planet spins into oblivion in a beautiful form of decay.

Appology from myself for attacking, though recently I had managed to get more than 2 hours sleep I have gone back into my broken sleep cycle

With that kind of defeatism why should anyone ever even bother waking up?

a reply to: JoshuaCox

I agree with you, however, you are still thinking in small terms, think bigger. Its not about the guns that are in the U.S. The PTB are looking at the world as a whole. DId you know that Columbia just gave up and turned in all their guns in the name of peace. It is part of the disarmament agreement that the UN has in place. The plan is working as intended.

www.nytimes.com...

Anyway no need to thread drift, sorry.