Russian su-34 destroy multiple convoys In Turkish/Syrian borders

a reply to: markosity1973

Did you miss the 90's and early 2000's? We literally blew up the middle east so we could have contractors come in and "rebuild". Russia was late on that move, and they see it works, and they see a time more than ever to try it.

Remember, the USA not only backed, but ALSO funded Saddam Hussein in the late 70's/early 80's to MAKE him the dictator of Iraq.

Part of me wishes he just shut up and went along with it, but the other part sees what the US has done there. Profit.

Putin cares nothing about the ME, he sees an old tactic used that he will now use and the world will lap it up like dogs because Putin...freaking sick.

a reply to: Vector99

Fact #1 Putin did not start the problems in Syria. The USA caused it through deposing Gadaffi in Libya which allowed the people who becamse ISIS to gain a place to train and plan.

Fact #2 Putin was strongly opposed to intervention of any kind in Syria from the start

Fact #3 Russia only entered the conflict after Assad asked them for help

Fact #4 Putin has presented a peace plan for post war Syria to the UN several times. The UN keeps rejecting it because it does not exclude the possibility of Assad remaining in power.

This is not a repeat of the USA's tricks in Iraq. Iraq has even asked Russia for help over the USA too in this situation. The people on the ground seem to disagree with you,

a reply to: markosity1973

Fact #1 Putin did not start the problems in Syria. The USA caused it through deposing Gadaffi in Libya which allowed the people who becamse ISIS to gain a place to train and plan.

The problems in Syria started when Assad's father came to power in a coup. Syria is an hereditary monarchy masquerading as a democratic republic.

Fact #2 Putin was strongly opposed to intervention of any kind in Syria from the start

Because he thought Assad could handle it; besides Russian arms manufacturers were making a healthy profit keeping him supplied.

Fact #3 Russia only entered the conflict after Assad asked them for help

Russia only entered the conflict when it became obvious that untrained soldiers in white pick-up trucks were crushing a professional army equipped with Russian weapons.

Fact #4 Putin has presented a peace plan for post war Syria to the UN several times. The UN keeps rejecting it because it does not exclude the possibility of Assad remaining in power.

What about this?

The Russian Federation and China vetoed today a Security Council draft resolution that would have demanded that all parties in Syria — both Government forces and armed opposition groups — stop all violence and reprisals, ending days of intense negotiations in New York as diplomats laboured to bring a halt to the deadly 10-month crackdown on anti-Government protests in the Middle Eastern country.

www.un.org...

If Putin wants peace, why did he reject a peace plan?

This is not a repeat of the USA's tricks in Iraq. Iraq has even asked Russia for help over the USA too in this situation. The people on the ground seem to disagree with you,

Iraq has asked for Russian help because its Iranian masters want the United States out of the region. Russia and Iran can fight over the spoils later.

originally posted by: markosity1973
a reply to: Vector99

Fact #1 Putin did not start the problems in Syria. The USA caused it through deposing Gadaffi in Libya which allowed the people who becamse ISIS to gain a place to train and plan.

Fact #2 Putin was strongly opposed to intervention of any kind in Syria from the start

Fact #3 Russia only entered the conflict after Assad asked them for help

Fact #4 Putin has presented a peace plan for post war Syria to the UN several times. The UN keeps rejecting it because it does not exclude the possibility of Assad remaining in power.

This is not a repeat of the USA's tricks in Iraq. Iraq has even asked Russia for help over the USA too in this situation. The people on the ground seem to disagree with you,

Lets try this with a realistic theme.

Fact 1 - France and Britain initiated intervention in Libya source

Fact 2 - Putin has a naval base in Syria, and is threatened by a saudi/qatari pipeline. (It IS that big of a deal to Russia)

Fact 3 - Russia only entered the conflict when they realized their base was threatened.

Fact 4 - Putin is presenting unacceptable terms to the UN. Just by presenting them does not mean it is right.

Do you really think Iraqi government is really independant already? Like for real, do you really think the USA has pulled so far out of Iraq that it doesn't control what the Iraqi government says and does?

I'm not a rah rah USA guy, but I'm also not stupid

originally posted by: DJW001
a reply to: markosity1973

Russia rejected the plan because of this

xplaining his negative vote, the representative of the Russian Federation said that the draft resolution sought to send an “unbalanced” message to Syria. Moreover, no proposal had been made to end attacks by armed groups, or their association with extremists. Stressing that the violence and bloodshed must end immediately, he announced that the Russian Government was taking direct action by sending high-level officials to meet with Syrian President Bashar al-Assad on 7 February. Yet, while the Russian Federation was committed to finding a solution, some influential members of the international community had been undermining the possibility of a peaceful settlement by advocating regime change, he said.

From your UN source.

Russia did not want to see another Libya. And bloody good on them for standing up to everyone else.

originally posted by: markosity1973
Russia did not want to see another Libya. And bloody good on them for standing up to everyone else.

THIS is where you lie to yourself. Russia is NOT the good guy here. Russia is only involved because they have a Syrian port. Russia doesn't care about the middle-east, in-fact I applaud their approach in saying # you # your religion, you just #ed with the mafia.

What I wonder most honestly is the secret soviet plans that would come into play today, Putin is that man. I also fear Putin's non-hesitance for nukes. While I don't fear death, I'm in no mood to rush it along.

a reply to: Vector99

Russia went in there when it was obvious that the Assad regime was faltering. Assad asked for help. They responded. Assad thanked them.

It's all been documented in both russian and western media. Western media condemns every new step while Russian praises it.

Libya has gone from stability to a life of hell thanks to the intervention over there. America calls it 'Hilary's war' So they lay some claim to it alright. I'm not going to dispute NATO countries were involved.

Here is Putin's 8 point peace plan. You tell me what is so unacceptable about it. It seems perfectly sane and logical to me.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

I'm amazed that some people here would work with ISIS to feed their family!

Even if your not the one doing the killings you would have blood on your hands from the dirty money

There are plenty of ways to support your family aiding a group like this should never be an option

originally posted by: markosity1973
a reply to: Vector99

Russia went in there when it was obvious that the Assad regime was faltering. Assad asked for help. They responded. Assad thanked them.

It's all been documented in both russian and western media. Western media condemns every new step while Russian praises it.

Libya has gone from stability to a life of hell thanks to the intervention over there. America calls it 'Hilary's war' So they lay some claim to it alright. I'm not going to dispute NATO countries were involved.

Here is Putin's 8 point peace plan. You tell me what is so unacceptable about it. It seems perfectly sane and logical to me.

www.dailymail.co.uk...

Don't fool yourself, Assad asked for Russian help a long time ago. Russia only cares about its naval base in Tartus.

Not a single # was given by Russia about the people or the government. They ONLY care about that base.

a reply to: markosity1973

Russia rejected the peace plan because it wanted Assad to stay in power. Now they are hinting that Assad can go. Why didn't they just agree to that two years ago?

a reply to: DJW001

because it's not about Assad, it's about who replaces him.

originally posted by: Vector99
a reply to: DJW001

because it's not about Assad, it's about who replaces him.

Even back then, they could have been honest and said that their only condition is that any new regime would honor existing treaties with Russia. They didn't have any skin in the game back then, so they didn't care how many Arabs died. Now that Russia's national prestige is on the line, they're willing to make any compromise they can spin to look like they're dealing from strength.

a reply to: Whereismypassword

Tell that to the people who looked at it like that, and now don't have a family.

Seriously, go ahead and tell them that.

As for me, since I'm one that would, I'll live with the blood, especially if I get to go home and watch the little ones sleep.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: enlightenedservant

This exactly.

If its going to be a war that is a contest of who is the bigger sonofabitch....im happy to not win that contest.

Doesn't mean i roll over and give up. But surely we can all share this planet while remaining human?

This cycle will continue until people stop solving their problems with violence. It took me a long time to realize that it's harder for most people to unclench a fist than to swing it.

originally posted by: Whereismypassword
I'm amazed that some people here would work with ISIS to feed their family!

Even if your not the one doing the killings you would have blood on your hands from the dirty money

There are plenty of ways to support your family aiding a group like this should never be an option

People do this stuff every day. Look at how many people work for gangs, cartels, and organized crime groups. Then look at how many people sell their products or help them launder their money. Then look at how many people purchase prostitutes, illegal drugs, or engage in gambling, all of which can directly fund those groups. How is this any different? Not to mention the legal & "legit" companies and businessmen who take hush money, pay bribes, or pay out "protection fees" to those groups on a frequent basis.

The cartels in Mexico behead people just like ISIS does. And the Cartel War in Mexico has claimed at least 60,000 to 80,000 lives since it was started in 2006. That doesn't stop people from all over North America from helping them launder their money; purchasing their products; working at their "drug fronts" or other companies they secretly control, etc.

Most people in America don't even care who owns the strip clubs or night clubs they work at or frequent, much less if those places are run by gang or cartel money. And they don't care where their illegal drugs come from either, regardless of which murderer may have sold it to them or how many new weapons that gang/cartel can buy with the money from that sale. And people will complain about illegal immigrants, then hire them for cheap labor; never once caring that their actions are only enabling the violent smuggling & human trafficking rings that brought the people here in the first place.

There will never be a shortage of people who'll work with people they despise or disagree with if it pays their bills. And there will also never be a shortage of people who just don't care about others. So they'll do whatever it takes to survive and thrive, regardless of who is affected by their actions.

originally posted by: seagull
a reply to: elementalgrove

We agree to disagree. That's cool.

One thing before I go...

I think you'll find that I despise Daesh every bit as much as you do...just so you know.

So if the USA was doing its job bombing the same convoy you would be stating the same things ??

Very much doubtful

a reply to: ParasuvO

You go right ahead and doubt, friend. Because your opinion is without meaning to me.

a reply to: seagull

ISIS members operate those trucks

Not your "honorable family" types, unless you think cutting people's head off is OK.

Your concern is for the terrorists and not for the millions of refugees.

Got it.

Peculiar.

originally posted by: bigfatfurrytexan
a reply to: seagull

Correct.

The REAL regret would happen as you sit and listen to your children sobbing and crying when all they had for supper (again) was their sadness.

And the cycle would continue, then you would kill anyone and EVERYONE you had to, to stop it.

Becoming the exact same as the guys bombing the convoy guys,

originally posted by: M5xaz
a reply to: seagull

ISIS members operate those trucks

Not your "honorable family" types, unless you think cutting people's head off is OK.

Your concern is for the terrorists and not for the millions of refugees.

Got it.

Peculiar.

ISIS can't operate out of their area .
There are intermediaries in oil smuggling business .

If there was a statistic about the beheadings of truck drivers at the hand of ISIS in Syria & Iraq ; Turks would win hands down , they have already had their share of beheaded truck drivers .


10,000 barrels of oil amounts to 3km long convoy of oil trucks , every day .

If Turks were buying this oil , where is the satellite footage to show it ?

It would be easy to see a 3 km long convoy travelling everyday on the same road .

The local area is Kurdish on the Turkey side and one of their speciality is to travel to Syria and smuggle stuff , including oil , cigarettes , dope , etc ,etc .

Anyhow , it is easy to determine whether Turks were buying oil or not ; there should be satellite footage somewhere .

It is not made public because it exonorates Turks I dare say .

a reply to: M5xaz

I see your reading comprehension hasn't improved since last you replied to a post I made.

Believe what you will.