Russian Orthodox Church is just a smokescreen

originally posted by: RadiationAndCancer

Don't believe a word of it, there is complete separation between church and state in Russia.

Everything else is just fluff for the sake of presenting Russians as even MORE evil than they are usually presented.

Thanks R&C, I was interested by this thread because my husband's family are Lithuanian. His grandfather came over to Scotland during WW2, but he still has cousins over there. So although I don't know much about this part of the world, I'm always interested to learn more. It's never the case where an entire nation is corrupt or evil, there are always thousands of reasons and complexities - nothing is black and white. I've only been to Moscow for a short time, but I would love to go back and spend more time there.

originally posted by: adjensen
a reply to: dollukka

Isn´t everything related Secret societies within secret sociaties and what is common to all of these societies is to achieve power and control ?

I have no idea.

I am merely pointing out that a Catholic cannot be a Mason, because Canon Law says that if a Catholic joins the Masons, they are kicked out of the church and, thus, are no longer a Catholic. Canon Law applies to everyone, whether Benedictine, Jesuit, Carmelite or the Pope himself.

And since the Jesuits run a lot of schools, merely making a connection between someone to them because they went to such an institution doesn't really mean anything. Someone pointed out that President Obama had a Jesuit influence his life at some point, but that sure doesn't mean that the President is a friend of the Catholic Church (if he was, they wouldn't have to sue his administration over the health care mandate.)

Why can't a catholic be a mason/nazi/jesuit/black panther/shill/cia agent/whistleblower/kkk/peta? They abide by their canon laws now? If they're 'ex-communicated' for being a mason, why do they protect their pedophile priests? Wouldn't they be ex-communicated? Shouldn't they? Why would they allow their priests to molest various children over the spans of decades and not ex-communicate them? Oh, but be a mason and you're out! Lol, they don't even follow/respect children(well, they do technically follow children lol), much less their own beliefs, and you expect them to not affiliate with any other groups or engage in evil activities?

On topic, interesting thread; I've never heard about the 'old believers'.

a reply to: evilcommunist

I 'll add this as an Orthodox and as a husband of a Russian Orthodox.

You are completely wrong about everything you posted. There is no conspiracy at all. In fact, the Orthodox church is the church where conspiracies have no place.

For the "blessing" of the "Old Believers" you are wrong too. The way Jesus holds his right arm is not to pray but to give blessings to the believers.

Also, there is no such thing as "Old Believers" and "New Believers". Never existed never will. On the other hand, there are the people who are with the Old Calendar and the people who are with the New Calendar. The only difference they have is the days they celebrate the Saint's Memorials, Christmas and Easter (Big and Small). No difference in the beliefs, no difference in the way they pray, no difference in the Bible, no difference in the holy paintings, no difference except the calendar.

Now, where you found the conspiracies, the secret societies and the differencies you pointed out is something only you know. And the fact that an Old Calendar Church was built way before the skyscrapers is something that you do not care to check, right? And the fact that you did not check your resource did not matter you, right?

Anyway, the only reason Russia, Mount Athos and the Holy Lands have the Old Calendar is simply because they never liked the change pope Gregory the 13th did. That pope moved the date of the original calendar forward by 13 days. The reason he did was because he wanted to "fix" the spring equinox "fault", as according to him the original calendar had the spring equinox moved for 1 day every 128 whereas his calendar moved for 1 day every 3.300 years. Wanna check it? Use Wikipedia.

Now as i, the Orthodoxs had and have doubts about the "good" motives of the popes. This along with the fact that the Catholic Church is a different Church from the Orthodox were the reasons why the Russians, Mount Athos and the Holy Lands did not change their diaries.

I mean, common, for the 1000 years of the Byzantine Empire no one saw a mistake in the calendar and a pope, who came 100 years after the fall of the Byzantine Empire, discovered the mistake? I don't buy, so did the Orthodoxs before me.


And those Crosses you post and claim to be Crosses of the "Old Believers" are being placed still on tombs and churches. There is no difference with the Crosses we use today. In fact they represent exactly the Cross where Jesus was crossed. Apart from that, the Byzantine Empire was using both Crosses. Now, a whole Empire did not see a conspiracy and you did? Just amazing!

To sumarize and close this, there is no "Old and New Believers" thing in the Orthodox Church, there is only the difference in the calendar and whoever wants accepts it, whoever doesn't simply uses the New calendar. People go to pray in both churches and monasteries, people are being baptized in both churches, people pray in the same holy paintings in both paintings, people have in their tombs both crosses.

So please, next time you want to talk about a Church, you better know a few things about it before you do. Else, you just make yourself sound completely ignorant.

"Old Believers" LOL

a reply to: JesusChristwins

Ok, so all the info in the Wikipedia link I posted is fake?

Here it is again: en.wikipedia.org...

Please, read it carefully it describes all the differencies in the rituals. It also has a description of various Old Believers sects.

You could also find this interesting:

Old Believer church outside of Gervais, Oregon, USA.



Inside Old Believers church in McKee, Oregon near Gervais and Woodburn in Oregon, USA



Russian Old Believers in Woodburn, Oregon. Old Believers consider the shaving of one's beard a severe sin. This is due to the so-called iconographic thinking of Orthodoxy: Christ had a beard and men ought to have the same appearance.



Here are some more links for you:

Russian Old Believers website: starove.ru...

Old Believers spells used in the old times, some of them incorporated from pagan rituals: www.borovskold.ru...

Oh,and your Russian wife should read this article as well: ru.wikipedia.org...

To this day some of the Old Believers sects do not consider adepts of the Russian Orthodox Church (RPCZ) to be christians at all and if they want to become Old Believers they need to be baptized again in accordance with the old traditions.


The second half of your post about the calendars is interesting but has nothing to do with my post.

And unlike you I checked all my sources.

a reply to: evilcommunist

Let me help you my friend.

The churches outside could be anyhow they want to, they just have to follow some rules. The church in the picture you posted follows these rules.

The churches inside is alike the one you posted, our priests look alike the priests in the picture you posted and shaving the beard is indeed a severe sin for all the Orthodox priests. Priests can cut their hair and shave the beard only if health reasons are in the middle.

So, i don't understand why you posted the pics. What you wanted to present?

Anyway, about Wikipedia and its entries about the history of the Orthodox Church and its disagreements within it by some people.
As i wrote before, "Old Believers" are the people who have the Old Calendar. Does Wiki mention anywhere about the Calendar difference which is a major fact? No. To emphasize the mistakes of Wiki in the entries about the Orthodox faith, i will add the "Seventy disciples" entry. We are aware that almost all of the 70 Apostles were Greek, basically from their names. Yet Wiki does not write it anywhere.

Major facts, which do not concern most of the readers of Wiki, are not placed in the entries. This is why i have many times in the past stated that we cannot base our sources only on Wiki.

About the difference in the way they make their sign of cross, many Russians since the time they became Orthodox Christians were making that way their sign of cross. This happened because the Holy Paintings were showing Saints and Jesus blessing the people that way. Does Wiki mention it anywhere? No my friend. This is why the "Old Believers", as they are wrongly named in English, make their sign differently.

I said it before, i will say it again, the major difference lies and began with the Calendar! Yes, if you wish to become an Old Calendar's person you have to baptize again in Russia and you have to confess all your sins and do a 40 days fasting in Greece. I can confirm that. But No, they are not a sect, and they do consider the other Orthodoxs of Russia Christians but they believe that having the wrong calendar and not honoring the Saints' memorials in the correct date will not lead them to the Paradise.

It is all about the calendar. Your sources are mistaken but hey, it's "Democracy" so i cannot say anything more. If you wish to insist on believing on that, that's fine by me. Just, do not misguide people.

Oh, and i haven't checked my resources? That's something new. I thought that being baptized in an Old Calendar's church, having my wedding and my two sons' Christening there and going every Sunday in an Old Calendar's church would provide me with enough knowledge about the difference between the Old and the New Calendar. But it seems that you know things better than me

OK

a reply to: JesusChristwins

In my last post I even gave you a link to a Russian Starover (Old Believer) website, but you keep telling me about the calendar.

Ok, you are entitled to your opinion.

Christianity comes from gnostics, the russian cross / orthodox flag is gnostic. In the center they have Saint Georgios who kills the snake

Serbia cross is the cross as many people use today.

My countries Orthodox flag is the archaic symbol of Father (holy father) with a swastika that represents the possitives in the universe - Zeus and they blasphemised father, even represent him as the devil.

Mongoloids/zionism hided from people that the symbol of the cross, is the symbol of Zeus. Many people say : if everything is fake, how is it possible when people are demonised, or if houses are hunted, to fear the cross. Well you should understand that the cross as a symbol represents father. Swastika is not a germanic symbol, there is 2 swastikas, reversed from each other, 1 represents the negatives and the other represents the possitives in the universe. Mongoloids nazis, used the one that represents the negatives. Both symbols belong to my country from the very very ancient years. Both swastikas are extensions of the cross, one from the right side and the other in the left side... its like the energy flows.

here is a link, dont translate it, its irrelevant news, but you can see the differences between the flags of orthodoxy.
link

Here is another link with another gnostic symbol of the cross www.rt.com...

The russian flag is gnostics, represents also the archaic gods like Poseidon, warriors of light... Many things hided from the public, in order for them to attach the false gods of mongoloids/an artificial race created by the fallen.

You should also know that the word LORD is a judaism attachment into christianity. This word has nothing to do with the representatives of Christianity. LORD = BAAL in babylonian and it represents the son of SATAN search it guys, internet gave you the abbility to study and search, but you dont. All archaic judaism/pro babylonian followers of the fallen, called him LORD. I do believe that christianity after the dark ages, was tweaked in a level to give them the tools, slowly and steadily to promote and confuse people, lead them into satan. Satan is actually saturn, seth or sat in babbylona, or Sabaoth in jewish, or Kronos in my country, its the same personality.

Now you know, why they hate the cross, why they do everything they can to ban the cross.
Also you should know tha the religion of 12 gods of Olympus is extremely modern, crafted as well to promote the fallen. Half of those are fallen gods, the basic idea of christianity was to remove all that, promote father as we call in our prayers today (Holy Father of all heavens and all men ) without the extra additions. But Christianity today is lead by many secret societies, masons etc, who actually promote Satan, SETH . Thats why they killed all the original christians, burned all books and re-wrotte them. That is why they call it Orthodox... search the words translation Ορθη and Δοξα (Ορθοδοξια). Ορθη = standing against, I stand in my feet against diffuculties,etc.. ΔΟΞΑ = Glory ( Ethics, true belief, respect to father).

Why the 12 golds of Olympus didnt work for them or all archaic religions? Because all gods in ancient years have their names and what they represented. Nobody gave a thing about Kronos, about Dionisus, about Hermes, etc... only a small part of minorities and it didnt work for them. They needed them all to praise them. Today you may not praise Dionisus, but you celebrate carnivals for their LORD... CARN - BAAL anthropophagy. In every celebrations you eat animals, dressing like an animal, behaving like one.

In all modern religions, they hide their names and use only titles. So people can easily be deceived.

is there a youtube video for this? im very lazy =/