the god of the bible is an evil god

Originally posted by mutehalo
The god of the bible is an evil god

Thanks for being so open minded. /sarcasm If a christian said something they believed as blantently as you did, they would get flamed for "shoving religion down other's throats" like Brown was sorta talking about.

when you use the minds that god gave you

this is a bit confusing, for by first stating this (implying you believe in God, or at least are not going to argue the issue of God's existance at this present time) then saying "validating my point that the bible god isn't real.", it leaves me looking all over your orignal post for this "point" that you are now validating.

first off if god is so loving why would he create a fiery pit of torment and despair for all the so called sinners to rot in for all eternity.

He orginally created it for Lucifer, as i think someone else said. and as for the ppl doomed in hell...how are they only "so called sinners"? do you believe they did not sin?

wheres the love in sending your children to an eternity of torment because they may have made a few mistakes with thier lives

He doesnt "send" them, they choose to do there. Its like every one that dies jumps off a cliff. Either you can reach for God and he can catch you (think of that famous painting where God is reaching out and man is just holding up a hand) or if you dont reach for him you will fall. Its your choice though, coming back to the freewill issue others have said.

my next question is why would god allow satan to lead his children astray.

The same reason parents let kids get away with some things. The parent may not like what the child is doing with their life, but would rather let the child choose than force a choice upon them

next there is the whole concept of sin. from what i gather, sin is basically an act that pisses god off. but it seems to me that most everything pisses god off like sex, homosexuality, drugs, dancing, rock music, and other things of that nature.

he encourages sex, just only within a marraige. he doesnt say that he hates rock music, its more of the other things assoicated with the music itself. as for dancing, david danced as a form of worship for God.

a young inocent child that dosn't even know what he or she is really doing. if you have any connection to sinners, you will die a horrible death and goto hell because god said so.

please give some examples. Are you talking about the Egyptian firstborns? It never says those children went to hell, nor that they died horrible deaths. Their deaths werent meant to cause pain to them, but to cause pain to the Pharoh and to have enough Egyptians willing to let the Jews go.

the only way to be forgiven for your sins is to accept jesus as your savior and reject sin for the rest of your life. if we are forgiven through jesus, why the hell do we have to live a sinless life from now on.

You obviously do not know of one very popular passage in the Bible. "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith--and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God-- not by works, so that no one can boast. " Ephesians 2:8-9 NIV

This means that from your faith you are saved, not by what you do(works)

and what about those that never heard of jesus or were raised in another religion (suposidly created by satan). well if there was no way to find out about jesus or you were raised to believe in something else, too fricking bad for you.

I still have not found the answer to this, i will let you know if i do

and what about children that die unbaptised or died too young to know anything about children.

baptisim is not nessesary. The man on the cross next to Jesus was saved, and i really doubt he was baptized (he was also a murderer, so he wasnt just a "so called sinner")
I also believe that children are innocent and although michevious, do not mean real harm, and I believe God knows that and takes them with him.

and what do you get anyways for living a sinless life and accepting jesus. an eternity of praying to your god in submission. how is that any better than hell aside from burning in a lake of fire?

you never suffer again. You are never hurt, never cold, never hungry, never worked. How could this even compare to hell?

what they found was not an evil god at all but a infinitely loving god.

so you are saying that there is a God, just not the one of the Bible then?

---Pineapple

"The God of the Bible."

It shouldn't be singular. There is more than one god in the Bible - at least four.
Abraham was a follower of El. Moses was a follower of Yaweh. Joshuah's god has different characteristics from both. So does Jesus' god.

The god of the Bible evolves in it's literature from one entity to another.

Originally posted by ThatsJustWeird
also personally i dont believe in the concepts of good an evil. but many christians do so thats why i put things in the terms of good and evil.

STOP:
So what do you think in terms of?
If not good and evil, then what? (the world would be in total chaos if nothing was either good or bad)

Take murder (cold blooded). What is that?

While I can't speak for mutehalo, I see good and evil, in the same way I see light and dark. There is no such thing as pure evil, there is only the absence, to a greater or lesser degree, of good.
As an example, consider this: darkness is only an absence of light, it's doesn't exist except as a perceived contrast to light. When light is removed from a room, the room is not then FILLED with an anti-light, called Darkness. As the light decreases, there is simply less light, not more darkness, because darkness doesn't truly exist. If it did, we could measure the speed of darkness, just like we do the speed of light.

The same goes for good and evil. Good exists irregardless of our comprehension of it, whereas "evil" is just our label for something that lacks any goodness. Evil then, is not separate from good at all. It is merely the place furthest from the top on the infinite scale of "goodness".

in the bible, young infants are murdered at the hands of god and for what reason?

Not sure where you got this from but please provide a link or proof.

Here are a couple of instances, off the top of my head, where the LORD killed babies and children:
Exodus 12:29 And it came to pass, that at midnight the LORD smote all the firstborn in the land of Egypt, from the firstborn of Pharaoh that sat on his throne unto the firstborn of the captive that [was] in the dungeon; and all the firstborn of cattle.
Exodus 12:30 And Pharaoh rose up in the night, he, and all his servants, and all the Egyptians; and there was a great cry in Egypt; for [there was] not a house where [there was] not one dead.
------
1 Samuel 15:2 Thus saith the LORD of hosts, I remember [that] which Amalek did to Israel, how he laid [wait] for him in the way, when he came up from Egypt.
1 Samuel 15:3 Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and spare them not; but slay both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and ass.
------

Originally posted by Leveller
"The God of the Bible."

It shouldn't be singular. There is more than one god in the Bible - at least four.
Abraham was a follower of El. Moses was a follower of Yaweh. Joshuah's god has different characteristics from both. So does Jesus' god.

The god of the Bible evolves in it's literature from one entity to another.

Well there's only ONE God though. And Jesus is God's son wich makes him God, kind of like Zues, and Herculies.

God didn't make hell for people. Hell was made for the devil and the angels that followed him. Will there be people in hell? Yes, when you reject Christ that is where your eternal destination will be. People who will be in hell are there of their own choice.

Quit using the excuse of finding fault with God by saying "what about the people who have never heard of Jesus."If you have heard of what Jesus did for mankind then that is your first responsibility. To accept or reject Him. If you reject Him that's a choice someone makes and God may let you choose that way. I say may because there are many people who reject Christ and find that God pursues them through circumstances trying to get their attention.

If you accept Christ then start thinking about those who have never heard. Start making sure they do hear.

Despite what someone wrote, satan is not now in hell, he roams the earth looking for lives to mess up and destroy.

Originally posted by AD5673

Well there's only ONE God though.

That's not the point. There might be only one god in reality, but the Bible contains at least four which are all given different interpretations by their authors.
The question should have highlighted which specific god is being questioned.
Jesus' god is nothing like the war god Yaweh - he is kind and understanding.
Abraham's god was much more personal. He appeared to Abraham and ate dinner with him.
Yaweh is the aloof god of war who terrified Moses and those who followed him. He then evolves into something even worse when Joshua fights all of his battles in his name.

The Bible was written by different authors who picked up the story at different times. They refer to different gods but when the book was put together, everyone naturally assumed that because there is only one god (as you stated) the deities mentioned in the Bible must only be one god. It's rather a paradox when you read the book and see Yaweh himself referring to the existence of other gods.

Quote: "Fundamentalists take them the wrong way, they strictly follow all the stuff in the OT that isn't even supposed to apply to us anymore. They were laws for an ancient people. I think the only sins we really have to be worried about are the big moral issues like murder, rape, etc. Eating shellfish, working on the sabbath, etc don't constitute getting stoned to death, ya know? It's foolish to be so fundamentalist about it."

Ah the sound of REASON - how refreshing!!!

Leveler thank you for dis-crediting Monothiesim - Jewish people NEVER talk about how thier "One God" is in Reality MORE THAN ONE GOD!!!

As for the Christian Guy-"Like" Zeus & Hercules - I would say EXACTLY LIKE Zeus & Hercules - it is just Mythologies & Stories People - we are supposed to Learn & Grow from them - not put our Brains into Boxes out of Fear of the Wrath of "God" or "Satan" or whatever!!!!!

ail hail captain cucumber.
i will eat your babies and sniff your cherries.
bomb everything under the sun but make sure you dont wake dad.
CANDLES! CANDLES!! CANDLES!!!!
SO WHAtever hapPENED 2 MAiry any way mathha faaaakkkkuuuuu

First off let me say very good thread.

I see how GOD can be seen as good, And also interped as a bad GOD, I think the bible was made as a teaching of the ways. I think there was a person name Jesus..... Do I think he is the son of GOD? No.... I believe he believe he was. If you are told things from birth, you are going to believe it. Some examples... If you just call a child Stupid, Retard, A waste, whatever BAD parents call there children thes days. The child is going to believe it. Lets try it at home... People that are out on your own, do you ever cook something a way that your mom did? What about laundry, how do you do it? The way you was told was the right way? Who taught you? When your out, are you polite? For the guys, Do you hit women? Hopefull not. If you dont, im sure your parents took the time to say that is bad. For the ladies, Do you stay with that dead beat that does hit and mentaly beat you, because your daddy did the same to mommy? All mary would have was not Lie about getting laid. She was human you know.

I think God was a creation of someone or group that was far more intelgent than anyone of that time. Maybe the George Washington, Thomas Jefferson................ of thier era. Maybe aliens.......... In this day and age, I think I can not believe in something that cant be proven or disproven. All I can do is look at all the diffrent pieces and try to make my picture.

My Avatar Shows that I believe that Jesus was use by evil..... You people see what you want, not for what it is. You think I am try ing to put down "your GOD" ......... All I can say is YOU SEE what you want.. Just trying to give my small picture.

Well I hope I add so good input into the this great thread.

Originally posted by Leveller
That's not the point. There might be only one god in reality, but the Bible contains at least four which are all given different interpretations by their authors.

So if you were describing yourself you would use only one word?

Originally posted by SpittinCobra

Well I hope I add so good input into the this great thread.

yes you did, i applaud you for seing the post for what it is, and to those who missed my point, i feel sorry for you and i pray to god that he'll show you the way to the true heaven.

awesome avatar btw

[edit on 17-7-2004 by mutehalo]

dont you guys understand this simple concept of science?

If what is put into motion stays in motion, and energy at rest stays at rest, then what put the first energy into motion. It debunks any and all theories of God not existing. The answer is simple, GOD DID IT ALL! Energy just can't pick itself up and go. oh, and the people who haven't heard of Jesus are judged in the end on a different scale than those who have heard of Jesus.

First off if i pi$$ anyone of I'm sorry...There is no god,devil,heaven,or hell..religion was created to satisfy our own fears of mortality..we as humans cannot or should i say we don't want to believe that when we die there is nothing after that...we need to believe that we go on..Everyone should just realize that we are nothing but animals..more evovled than every other species but animals none the less. Think about how in the world did all these different races of people and animals end up on six different continents after the flood if the only people to survive was Noah and his family?We wont get into the amount of time it would take to have built the ark and to find two of every species of animal,not to mention that he(Noah)would have had to find only babies of these animals to fit them all on the ark.I also have tried to find historical proof that the plagues of Egypt happened.Funny but I don't seem to be able to find it.And as to the creation of God..we've all heard the big bang theory and I'm sure there are other theories out there...Come on people do you honestly believe that something happened that just created an all powerful all knowing entity?Someone was saying in another post about christians not pushing their views on others..sorry but yes they do(atleast in my experience) and if you don't see things their way you're a no good athiest..I have friends of nine years and a girlfriend whose pastor thinks they should not have anything to do with me because of my views??Feck him!!! I don't go to his church and tell everyone they shouldn't talk to him because of his views..I don't put anyone down for their beliefs I shouldn't be put down for mine..But as for God being evil. Would a loving god allow the things that go on in this world to happen?ie.the starving children in the world that haven't done a damn thing to anyone to deserve that..What of George Dubya saying God talks to him and tells him to strike out at Al Queda and Saddam?If God exist then yes I say he's evil and we are nothing more than entertainment for him

One of the biggest problems in the church today is the encroachment of the "God is love, man. He's peace and flowers and little kittens." doctrine. Yes, God IS love, but He is also a Judge. And any parent will tell you that "love" is not about letting your child do whatever it wants. Love is also discipline. Teaching your child that there are rules and consequences for your actions.

I've said this before in a previous post, so I'm just going to paraphrase. Man was not intended to go to Heaven. Man was intended to live on Earth, (which was a paradise at the time) and never know death. Sort of a Heaven on Earth kinda thing. In those days man walked with God. The fall of man brought about separation from God and introduced death into mans' existance. With the stain of sin on mans' souls, he (and I'm including male AND female in this generalization, don't flame me.) could not enter into the Holy presence of God. You see, Gods' presence is so Holy, that anything unholy(stained with sin) is instantly destroyed. It wasn't God saying "I don't want you here", it was "you aren't ABLE to come here". After the fall of man, the relationship with God was sort of forgotten. Around the time of Abram, man started to have that relationship again. God made a Covenant with Abram and his descendants that if they followed Him and lived according to His law, they could return to His presence. The law wasn't things that God didn't like, it was a kind of list of things not to do( and some things TO do) that would keep man from being stained with sin. Thus allowing him to return to God. Kinda like how if you want to go to the NBA, you have to play basketball.
However, this covenant was only to Abram (now called Abraham) and his descendants (the Jews). Later, God came to Earth as Christ and took on Himself the sin of the world and allowed Himself to be punished for those sins. All a person has to do is accept that God did this for him, and live by His law, and all transgressions against God are null and void. Thats why Christs' last words on the cross were,"It is finished". Gods' plan for the redemption of man was finally completed.
The idea that the Israelites worshipped many different gods because they had different names for Him is false. It was just different names, not different gods. God is called many different names by his people, but he is always "God". In fact, the only true name of God is the name God gives to Moses to tell Egypts leader. When Moses asks God whos' name he should say he is demanding the release of Egypts hebrew slaves in, God replies, "Tell them I AM sent me." It's not so much a name as it is a statement. Ponder the magnitude of calling yourself I AM.
As for the severity of Gods' punishments in the Bible, It is easy for us, in our era of modern conveniences like modern medicine and ambulances, to look back and say,"well, that was really harsh." But remember, these were extremely hard times, and you had to be a hard person living by hard rules just to survive. When the actions of one person could mean the death of the entire tribe, you had to be very deliberate in your actions. Remember, the great sin of lucifer was arrogance.

I WILL PREY FOR YOU MY CHILD,

FOR THIS DAY LET IT BE KNOW THAT A BLASPHEMER HAS APPEARED

THIS DAY HAS ALSO GIVEN BIRTH TO AN ACCUSER, LIKE THE ONE OF THE SAME BIBLE THE ACCUSER IS ANOTHER NAME FOR LUCIFER.

SAVE YOUR SELF, REPENT OF YOUR MISDEEDS PLEASE BECAUSE I DONT WISH TO WATCH SOMEONE DESTROY THEMSELF SUCH AS YOU HAVE STARTED DOING.

THE GOD OF OUR FATHERS AND OUR FATHERS, FATHERS GAVE HIS ONLY BEGOTTEN SON THAT IF YOU CALL ON HIM AND ASK FORGIVENESS YOU WILL NOT ONLY BE SAVED BUT THE DEVIL WONT BE ABLE TO DECEIVE YOU ANYMORE AND YOU WILL BE ABLE TO SEE THE TRUTH IN THE WORD FOR WHAT IT IS THE TRUTH AND THAT GOD IS NOT EVIL

GOD DIDNT MAKE HELL FOR MAN BUT FOR LUCIFER SO THAT HE MAY NO LONGER TEMP THE CHILDREN NOR HARM THEM

AS FOR THOSE OF US THAT ARE CHILDREN OF GOD WE DECIDE OF OUR OWN FREE WILL TO JOIN THE DEVIL IN HELL GOD DIDNT MAKE IT FOR US AND DOESNT WANT US THERE

woe to those who turn GOOD to EVIL and EVIL to GOOD.

thats exactly what you are doing, saying God is evil and evil is Good.

you are seriously deceived, deluded and spreading your falsehood

Simon_Boudreaux

YOU KNOW ONE MOST POPULAR STATEMENTS THAT THE PROPHACY WATCHERS BELEIVE WILL BE USED BY THE ANTICHRIST ALONG WITH
THE FACT HE IS OUR GOD IS JUST WHAT YOU SAID THERE IS NO HEAVEN NO HELL THERE IS ONLY US

THIS STATEMENT WILL FALLOW A GLORIOUS EVENT WHEREBY SATAN GIVES THE ANTICHRIST THE POWER TO PERFORM GOD LIKE MIRACLES TO VALIDATE HIMSELF TO THE UNRIGHTEOUS AS THE ONE AND ONLY TRUE GOD


PLEASE DONT BELEIVE THE LIES IF IT WHERE NOT TRUE THAT GOD HAD AND JESUS HAD PREPARED US A PLACE IN HEAVEN THEN WHY WOULD HE HAVE SAID IT WAS DONE

[edit on 17/7/04 by drbryankkruta]

Originally posted by The Last Patriot

The idea that the Israelites worshipped many different gods because they had different names for Him is false. It was just different names, not different gods.

Uhhh. Not true. Abraham worshipped Elohim - he was the Canaanite high god.
Yaweh was an entirely different god altogether - probably a minor deity until elevated by Moses. The Egyptians did the same thing with Osiris.

i just wanna take a few moments to make a few things clear here.

first off i believe that there is an infinite god out there that has set everything into motion. god is not just limited to a single book. god is everything but at the same time nothing. its all about perfect balance within the universe. i believe that god is whatever you make him or her or it to be. and the idea that there is a god watching over us judging our every action does not fit in with the idea of an infinite god. i mean how can god have limits, he's god for gods sake. he has no boundries. so why would god get possibly pissed off at his own creation. he created everything. because he is god and stuff.

next i'm not against christianity. what i am against is the way christianity traps people into a very limited existance and shields them away of the infiniteness of the universe. i'm not trying to attack your belief systems either, i'm trying to make you use the mind that god gave you and encourage you all to think for yourselves and create your own destiny.

also if your wondering what the point of all this is. my point that when the bible is taken litterly is blatently rediculous. it also dosn't give god the credit he or she or it deserves. the first step for truley being free is questionioning everything you have been lead to believe in. while it may seem hard at first and many people will ultimately take the blue pill so to speak. once you get through all the hardship of the red pill path, you'll find an amazing world that you never could have possibly imagined. cause when you get down to it if you think with a closed mind, what makes you different from a machine that is programed what to say and do other than the fact you are self aware and have a soul?

i'm also a big fan of jesus. i think that jesus had alot of great radical ideas but unfortunately they didn't fit in too well with the establishment so they had him crucified to send a message to all his followers. sadly they also destroyed what he stood for by turning him into a religion. jesus wasn't trying to show us that heaven was a distant place that can be reached through submission to god, but rather that heaven was a state of mind that can be achieved within your earthly lives. he also wanted to show us that we are our own gods thus the statement in the bible "we are gods". he came to set us all free from the tryany of the establishment and for that i applaud and have alot of respect for him.

also i personally dont believe in the concepts of good and evil. what we see as good and evil is all about perception. i will get into this more in a later post but ultimately what is good and evil is all in our heads. the only reason i use the term evil is because the vast majority are still living within the boundries of duality. when in truth good and evil is all part of the same infinite force working together whith each other.

also for the fundamentalists that are preaching how much of a blasphemer i am, once again it all comes down to perception. blasphemy is all in your head. and i have chosen the past of the so called "blasphemer" and nothing you can preach to me can make you change the way i think. go right ahead and pray for me all you want, it aint gona change anything, the only one who is gona make any change in my life is myself and myself alone. because what i believe in is based on years of valid research whereas what you believe in is mearly limited to some thousand year old book.

[edit on 17-7-2004 by mutehalo]

Originally posted by Leveller

Originally posted by AD5673

Well there's only ONE God though.

That's not the point. There might be only one god in reality, but the Bible contains at least four which are all given different interpretations by their authors.
The question should have highlighted which specific god is being questioned.
Jesus' god is nothing like the war god Yaweh - he is kind and understanding.
Abraham's god was much more personal. He appeared to Abraham and ate dinner with him.
Yaweh is the aloof god of war who terrified Moses and those who followed him. He then evolves into something even worse when Joshua fights all of his battles in his name.

The Bible was written by different authors who picked up the story at different times. They refer to different gods but when the book was put together, everyone naturally assumed that because there is only one god (as you stated) the deities mentioned in the Bible must only be one god. It's rather a paradox when you read the book and see Yaweh himself referring to the existence of other gods.

That would be different reactions of God to humanity. In reality, and in the Bible there is one God.