U.S. scientists achieve 'turning point' in fusion energy quest

Scientists with the National Ignition Facility (NIF) at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory announced today that they have achieved a critical step in fusion research: For the first time, their hydrogen fuel has given off more energy than it took in.

Though an important milestone, the result does not mean that your Delorean is soon going to sport a Mr. Fusion reactor. NIF would need to sustain temperatures and pressures much greater than they are currently capable of before they can harness fusion energy.

With true fusion power, the amount of water you use in a single shower could provide all your energy needs for a year. But for six decades, fusion has remained a far-off dream.

Reuters, Wired, Popular mechanics

To create fusion reactions at NIF, scientists shoot 192 lasers simultaneously with a peak power of 500 trillion Watts, roughly the energy the U.S. consumes every six minutes. This heats up a 1 centimeter gold cylinder to millions of degrees, producing X-rays that get focused at a plastic shell the size of a BB pellet. The X-rays blast the shell, creating an implosion that shrinks the gas inside pellet to 1/35th of its size, compressing isotopes of hydrogen known as deuterium and tritium to incredible densities. At the center of this hydrogen plasma, in an area smaller than the width of a human hair, the atoms fuse. This gives off energy, which should in theory set off a chain reaction that ignites the rest of the hydrogen and creates a self-sustaining ball of fusion.

Neat find, one step closer of making a huge leap in energy production, the reaction that occurs in a star.

Don't expect to have one of these working from trash in your backyard any time soon as this experiment cost 3.5 billions, there is another experimental fusion reactor being constructed in Europe that cost 20 billions



(Going to take a look at the article, be back with more)


My bad i cannot get a thing of the article i hope someone smart takes from here and give something relevant to the thread

reply to post by Indigent


Hm, I am a bit skeptic about this cold fusion stuff but I keep my mind open. S&F for at least sharing this with us.

reply to post by Indigent


It's baby steps, but at the very least, it is an indication that I and thousands of other alternative energy believers have been talking to dolts when we have said it isn't about the laws of physics, it's about engineering solutions.

Well...so much for the conservation of energy...you CAN actually get out more than you put in...with the correct engineering.

Can we now finally admit that it's about what we do, not what we think we know?

Frankly, this version of the race to fusion is, in my view, deliberately over-engineered.

Why?

Simple, how would tptb make any money from fusion if we could all rig ourselves a reactor in a couple of hours...?

Make it unnecessarily high-tech, with very difficult methods of operation and construction, and the serfs are still reliant.

MysterX
reply to post by Indigent

 

Well...so much for the conservation of energy...you CAN actually get out more than you put in...with the correct engineering.

This is incorrect. We spend less energy extracting oil than we get from using it but the energy is still conserved. You will not get more energy from the fuel than is already there.

Frankly, this version of the race to fusion is, in my view, deliberately over-engineered.

Why?

Simple, how would tptb make any money from fusion if we could all rig ourselves a reactor in a couple of hours...?

Make it unnecessarily high-tech, with very difficult methods of operation and construction, and the serfs are still reliant.

Come back in a couple of hours with your fusion generator and then we'll talk conspiracies.

reply to post by Indigent

Op you are a quick draw on this one, I just barely finished reading the Nature article linked to in regards to this experiment.

Fuel gain exceeding unity in an inertially confined fusion implosion
Nature (2014) doi:10.1038/nature13008
Received 01 November 2013 Accepted 07 January 2014 Published online 12 February 2014
www.nature.com...

Fusion energy: NIF experiments show initial gain in fusion fuel
phys.org...

The experimental series was carefully designed to avoid breakup of the plastic shell that surrounds and confines the DT fuel as it is compressed. It was hypothesized that the breakup was the source of degraded fusion yields observed in previous experiments. By modifying the laser pulse used to compress the fuel, the instability that causes break-up was suppressed. The higher yields that were obtained affirmed the hypothesis, and demonstrated the onset of boot-strapping.

The experimental results have matched computer simulations much better than previous experiments, providing an important benchmark for the models used to predict the behavior of matter under conditions similar to those generated during a nuclear explosion, a primary goal for the NIF.

The math associated with their models that I can find is F'ing insane.

Freaking magicians . . .

-FBB

reply to post by FriedBabelBroccoli


yeah i was reading the real paper but i fail to understand anything perhaps mods can delete this and let someone that get it makes a new one

swanne
reply to post by Indigent

 

Hm, I am a bit skeptic about this cold fusion stuff but I keep my mind open.

Millions of degrees is only "cold" in interstellar space where you can freeze to death in such temperatures, not in fusion experiments such as this.

Now I have to remove a phrase from my vocabulary, that we haven't had a fusion reactor produce more power out than in. It's still quite a challenge to first make and then control what is something like a miniature sun, without all the gravity assist to hold things together.

swanne
reply to post by Indigent

 

Hm, I am a bit skeptic about this cold fusion stuff but I keep my mind open. S&F for at least sharing this with us.

This is NOT cold fusion. This is about creating a plasma that can contain/sustain a hydrogen (deuterium) reaction. It's about a far from cold as one can get. The temperatures are in millions of degrees, analogous to those inside a star.

MysterX
reply to post by Indigent

 

It's baby steps, but at the very least, it is an indication that I and thousands of other alternative energy believers have been talking to dolts when we have said it isn't about the laws of physics, it's about engineering solutions.

Well...so much for the conservation of energy...you CAN actually get out more than you put in...with the correct engineering.

Your ignorance is astounding. This isn't breaking the conversation of energy, it requires fuel. Previously it took more to light the fuel than the fuel gave. Now the fuel gives more than it takes to light it.

Those "dolts" were and are still right. You were and are still wrong.

Those people are very smart. Lot of respect for them.

What can be said? People have talked about fusion for how long? I'm a common person. I'm amazed just by the nuclear power 50 years ago.

Here's a link:
www.sciencedaily.com - Wave power could contain fusion plasma...

jonnywhite
What can be said? People have talked about fusion for how long? I'm a common person. I'm amazed just by the nuclear power 50 years ago.

In the grand scheme of things, the time scale is nothing. The amount of $$$ spent of fusion research is negligible but the returns would be astronomical so even if they have to plug away for another 50 years or so, it will be worth it.

Arbitrageur
Millions of degrees is only "cold" in interstellar space where you can freeze to death in such temperatures, not in fusion experiments such as this.

Good point, my bad.

It's still quite a challenge to first make and then control what is something like a miniature sun, without all the gravity assist to hold things together.

Indeed! That's why I'm surprised about the OP.

it is a great achievement, but there has been some misreporting going on, apparently they got the break even point, not the positive. There was a statement i read about them having to up the pressure to make it positive.

Despite that, really awesome!